Sealed bid submitted by the princes of Genoa, Modena, and Tuscany on behalf of the Kingdom of Italy.
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Originally posted by BiB
Hardly. U both gave up sommink to get sommink u wanted in return, just like I did or am trying to do
BiB BiB BiB, do I really have to spell it out? I though the differences were so obvious.
Firstly there's one of scale. One TP traded in the new world is vastly different to two european islands swapping hands.
Secondly there's one of beleavability. IMO it's plausible for England and Portugal to make such an agreement and effectively tidy up their colonial possessions, much like we did in the Caribbean with our agreements between England and Spain. But with Austria not agreeing with your island trade to Venice in return for Venice to become an Austrian vassal the whole thing made no sense hence why it really had to be dropped.
About England´s policies:
Sweden never cooperated as such with the danes. We hepled England, an ally and friend of us and it just so happened that our mortal enemies did it at the same time .
Cooperation between Sweden and Denmark is likely not to happen before Sweden has taken revenge for those hundreds of years of danish occupation.
Sweden never cooperated as such with the danes. We hepled England, an ally and friend of us and it just so happened that our mortal enemies did it at the same time
.Cooperation between Sweden and Denmark is likely not to happen before Sweden has taken revenge for those hundreds of years of danish occupation.
Actually, those specific two islands are so poor that a New World TP might be worth more, once developed into a colony
In general, I am fine with land swapping (but prefer land selling, and preferably only of poor sparsely populated provinces), so I will wish BiB good luck in selling the islands
Heck, I have even submitted my own bid, as the princes of Genoa, Modena, and Tuscany would dearly love to gain control of those Islands off their coasts. [For style and for the AAR - not for profitability]A warning to anyone who wants to buy them, however. 1) The provinces are dirt poor with low manpower. 2) They add +5% to your techcosts (if you have more than 8 provinces already). 3) Austria-Italia has pronounced a claim on them
Originally posted by Peter Ebbesen
Actually, those specific two islands are so poor that a New World TP might be worth more, once developed into a colony
Yep well the beleavability bit was the most important reason anyway
.
I think you mean they add 5% of the base tech cost to your techcost before dp-modifications. That's something like a 1-2.5% increase in total tech costs, depending on your actual size. Well, 1% if you happen to own 128 provinces, 2.5% with 8 provinces.
And of course they are much more valuable than any trade post. They don't require any colonists to be sent and the majors are already promoted. Also most colonial locations have even lower base tax. Also colonies will have a hard time earning as much in trade taxes.
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That's exactly what I mean, yes
We are talking about Corsica (tax 2, naval supplies) and Sardinia (tax 4, fish) here (with wrong culture and even wrong religion, in the case of the opportunistic Danish bidder
). There are an awful lot of New World TPs that are worth rather more when built up to colonies both with respect to tax and production income.EDIT: In fact, I just loaded up the last save as Austria before BiB nixes my map knowledge. Spain is earning 11d and 15d per year from the two provinces respectively. Compared to that, Spain's Caribbean colonies are earning an average of around 20d/year, and England's seabord colonies (those I can see) seem to average around 15d. Moreover, the trade taxes of both Corsica and Sardinia are low - very low.
Btw. If BiB does end up selling, I expect him to raze the tax collectors and legal consels just the same as if the province had been conquered.
Originally posted by Peter Ebbesen
3) Austria-Italia has pronounced a claim on them
And then we can recognice the habsburgs way of business once again....
Originally posted by Peter Ebbesen
That's exactly what I mean, yes
We are talking about Corsica (tax 2, naval supplies) and Sardinia (tax 4, fish) here (with wrong culture and even wrong religion, in the case of the opportunistic Danish bidder
Btw. If BiB does end up selling, I expect him to raze the tax collectors and legal consels just the same as if the province had been conquered.
Hey!
You know perfectly well how cold and wet Denmark is during the winter...
EDIT: This thread is becomming incresingly interesting, almsot as much as the game itself!
Sardinia and Corsica combined would earn you more than any single colonial province, Jakarta, Bombay and the likes excepted, provide you with some manpower and save 20 colonists and about 1000 ducats.
Well, to me they would have a greater value, that is true. I thought your statement was general, however, and that it was comparing one new world TP with one of these islands, not one TP with two islands.
A difference of scale does not mean that its is a different action
Of course it is bigger in scale than exchanging a tp but it is smaller in scale than some deals that are to come and that have happened in history.The Venice thing should be regarded as totally not having happened; my new offer starts from scratch. Province sales are not that out of order. In fact Corsica is the island for which lots of events exist to sell it.
Say I sell 'em to Peter. I can quite believe that Spain would sell some lands to the nation that has been its ally throughout the game, is setting up an Italian kingdom and when u consider various provinces have changed hands between Austria and Spain thru events already.
People can accept me giving lands to the Dutch (not that I will
) but not to my longterm friend and family?
Trade taxes? Considering the Bahamas have 5000 natives that can easily be incorporated it pretty much is on par with any of the 2 islands on sale But they seem to be killed of, a real waste there.
And as Peter has already pointed out, the transfer of 3 Caribbean provinces was actually a bigger deal than the one on the table here.
But they seem to be killed of, a real waste there.And as Peter has already pointed out, the transfer of 3 Caribbean provinces was actually a bigger deal than the one on the table here.
I said "they are much more valuable than any trade post" not that one of them would be more valuable than one trade post. That would probably be true, too. And they are for any catholic at least, even more so for the two parties that would reasonably have an interest, Austria and Venice (France might also have some reasonable interest, depends on her strategy). The main issue is that they don't require all the investments that are needed to transfer a TP into a colony. That would be partly compensated by a need to convert them, tough. On the other hand a protestant country with no other non-state-religion provinces could just wait for a random conversion event.Originally posted by Peter Ebbesen
Well, to me they would have a greater value, that is true. I thought your statement was general, however, and that it was comparing one new world TP with one of these islands, not one TP with two islands.
What would most say about this sort of editing :
The Knights are my vassal but are in Austria's alliance. Any objections to them being edited into mine? I don't actually care what alliance they are in really (I will DOW anyone who attacks them anyway), I am just wondering about what can be edited. I can see how the OE wouldn't mind that for example as he prolly would prefer the next time he gets into a war with Austria to not have Spain get in on it because of the Knights being my vassal.
The Knights are my vassal but are in Austria's alliance. Any objections to them being edited into mine? I don't actually care what alliance they are in really (I will DOW anyone who attacks them anyway), I am just wondering about what can be edited. I can see how the OE wouldn't mind that for example as he prolly would prefer the next time he gets into a war with Austria to not have Spain get in on it because of the Knights being my vassal.
I would rather the Knights be in the Spanish alliance and the OE have a casus belli on Malta like it should.
Hmmm...I can't really grasp what evil scheming lies behind this one...
nah, its ok with me, its not like I have any interest in the knights.
well except their maps of course...
Peter,
The value of Sardinia and Corsica...As I have repeatedly stated...Is not for their wealth, but for their strategic position in the Med.
The same way that Crete would be so valuable to me, except that to go along historical lines, I tried to get Cyprus instead.
The value of Sardinia and Corsica...As I have repeatedly stated...Is not for their wealth, but for their strategic position in the Med.
The same way that Crete would be so valuable to me, except that to go along historical lines, I tried to get Cyprus instead.
I also think I should get a CB on Mecca, as long as Smirfy and BiB want me to dow them. Otherwise, they can pay me 5,000 ducats to cover the stab hit first
Originally posted by kurtbrian
Hmmm...I can't really grasp what evil scheming lies behind this one...
nah, its ok with me, its not like I have any interest in the knights.
well except their maps of course...
None this time
They have no cool maps