spendabuck

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What are the plans for societies? Seeing how there are so many religions in Lux Invicta, I'm obviously not counting on every single one getting a society, but I'm curious about what new societies will be implemented into the mod.
 

Leo4me

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Hey I love this mod and all the religion goes well with overall alternative history. As an Orthodox myself I can say that Carthage is not a holy Site of Orthodoxy but Antioch like in vanilla and also there are some other holy sites missing like the Hermits of Mt. Athos. The Orthodox religion in this mod should also respect the Chalcedonian holy sites which are the Pentarchies ( Rome / Constantinople / Antioch / Jerusalem and Alexandria plus some of the most holy sites like Mt Athos / Ephesos the place where St Apostle John is.
 

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Hey I love this mod and all the religion goes well with overall alternative history. As an Orthodox myself I can say that Carthage is not a holy Site of Orthodoxy but Antioch like in vanilla and also there are some other holy sites missing like the Hermits of Mt. Athos. The Orthodox religion in this mod should also respect the Chalcedonian holy sites which are the Pentarchies ( Rome / Constantinople / Antioch / Jerusalem and Alexandria plus some of the most holy sites like Mt Athos / Ephesos the place where St Apostle John is.
If history played differently, the holy sities would be different as well
 

Numahr

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@Leo4me, interesting points. Indeed as @qer points out, in LI we have deliberately different "spiritual geopolitics", although what makes it interesting, in my opinion, is how it is still related to real world history. And I think it makes sense from the point of view of our alternative universe.

Note that I speak as a former Mont Athos pilgrim of so I am sensitive to your perspective on this :)

Concretely, the survival of a split Roman Empire changed a lot how the Christian workd built its geography. Its pentarchy of holy sites is closer to the spiritual geopgraphy of the time of say, Saint Augustin's youth - obviously I mention him because of Carthage ;) . It also takes into account that christianity is not as overwhelming, and the fact that "paganism" (as labelled from the angle of Christians) is still a strong spirutal contender. So the spiritual focus is less on Christian self-narrative, and more on winning the most important centres of the Roman Empire's spiritual life as it was taking place in our real life 5-6th centuries, when indeed paganism was still a thing in the empire. That is way we made the couscious decision to move away from the Vanilla design and to actually create a unified list of Holy Sites for all Graeco-Roman religions, whether Christian or "Pagan". In LI, these creeds compete for the (crumbled) empire's same souls; the supremacy of a religion relies on beating the others on the same battle ground by taking hold of the most important cities of late antiquity's politics of spirituality.

It wasimportant for us to find a design that differed from Vanilla and history (otherwise why make an alternative history mod at all, since other mods tackle histrocal thouroughness much better), while making sense in our lore.

I hope this makes sense to you :)
 

Leo4me

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True but either way logical speaking they would've fled, and I read some of the Core alternative history timelines but either way Antioch is a better candidate even in alternative or maybe you can extent it but Carthage the only thing I can think of it is Carthage is the place where one of the GREAT Ecumenical Councils held in which it created the Bible today and separated what is false or wrong written from all the writings. Well anyways I have an off topic maybe someone can help me a bit i know it's not the subject of a religion but I am losing authority like hell even if it shows me I am gaining :S for no reasons.
 

Numahr

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To be more specific on Carthage... In our timeline Arian Vandals have elevated Carthage to the status of an alternative Rome. It is now a beating heart of Christian theological debates, to a much larger extant than it ever was IRL. Therefore no one can claim supremacy on the Christian world without imposing his spiritual views on the Church of Carthage.
 

Mr. Alipin

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To be more specific on Carthage... In our timeline Arian Vandals have elevated Carthage to the status of an alternative Rome. It is now a beating heart of Christian theological debates, to a much larger extant than it ever was IRL. Therefore no one can claim supremacy on the Christian world without imposing his spiritual views on the Church of Carthage.
Ah so I have every reason to burn it into the ground like the Romans before me
 

DeathLawlie

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I tried with the last Github version to play with the shia caliphate and will playing I notice something : Jihad seems to be restricted to some area (Like Anatolia, Greece, North Africa, Persia, Arabia and the eastern coast of Mediterranean sea) is this intended? It's not a big deal because I'm still far from taking all of that (And I don't really want to ) but just wanted to know :)
 
Last edited:

spendabuck

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I tried with the last Github version to play with the shia caliphate and will playing I notice something : Jihad seems to be restricted to some area (Like Anatolia, Greece, North Africa, Persia, Arabia and the eastern coast of Mediterranean sea) is this intended? It's not a big deal because I'm still far from taking all of that (And I don't really want to ) but just wanted to know :)
I don't know, but it seems to make sense if this is the case; this prevents Jihads being called in Scandinavia or the steppe, for example.
 

Numahr

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I don't know, but it seems to make sense if this is the case; this prevents Jihads being called in Scandinavia or the steppe, for example.
Exactly. Djihads and equivalents in other religions capable of great holy war have a given geographic scope with weights (for AI) for selection based on the importance of different areas in the lore. For religions less known, the great holy war geographic scope corresponds more or less to the area defined by the holy sites.
 

spendabuck

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I'd also like to ask this question again, especially after hearing that Lux Invicta is getting 2.7.X compatibility relatively soon; what are the plans for societies in Lux Invicta, if there are any at all? Obviously, if they are implemented, not every religion is going to get a society (just because there are so many), but I am curious about if any new societies will be added to the game for the new religions.
 

tsf4

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I'd also like to ask this question again, especially after hearing that Lux Invicta is getting 2.7.X compatibility relatively soon; what are the plans for societies in Lux Invicta, if there are any at all? Obviously, if they are implemented, not every religion is going to get a society (just because there are so many), but I am curious about if any new societies will be added to the game for the new religions.

I plan on adding in the secret religion code at some point. Other societies will be done at some point too.
 

Ufnal

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To be more specific on Carthage... In our timeline Arian Vandals have elevated Carthage to the status of an alternative Rome. It is now a beating heart of Christian theological debates, to a much larger extant than it ever was IRL. Therefore no one can claim supremacy on the Christian world without imposing his spiritual views on the Church of Carthage.

I haven't checked latest LI builds in a while, but - I think this kind of stuff would be awesome material for special buildings such as, for example, in the A Game of Thrones mod, where the most important and iconic locations have buildings with descriptions that explain their significance in the setting.
 

futuregary

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Is there any lore on the theology of Kong Tanrili other than being a blend of Tengriism and Confucianism?

I don't remember if I had written it yet or planned to, but there was some lore on it in the works. It may end up being revised, though.

I don't know, but it seems to make sense if this is the case; this prevents Jihads being called in Scandinavia or the steppe, for example.

Exactly. Djihads and equivalents in other religions capable of great holy war have a given geographic scope with weights (for AI) for selection based on the importance of different areas in the lore. For religions less known, the great holy war geographic scope corresponds more or less to the area defined by the holy sites.

While I would like for it to eventually be possible to call jihads on outlier kingdoms, the weight should definitely be microscopic in comparison to more important areas.
 

Numahr

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. I understand the Proselyte, and Bastion mentalities but what is the Ancestor mentality about? Also if I wanted to change an aspect of the religion, (say change the Doctrine status from Local to mainstream) for personal preference where would I make the change?

Ancestral religion = unreformed religion, simple as that. The religion has not gone through a conscious effort at codification and is the result of slow, spontaneous evolution. As such it is not very coherent yet and is weak in the conversion game (weak at converting others / vulnerable at being converted).

Changing a religion involves using the Matrix to see what attributes and features it changes and applying the changes in the game files. Most are in 00religion.txt but not all. Things like CB, laws etc. are in the relevant files. Good luck and let me know if you actually did it successfully!
 

Numahr

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Hello guys

We have a long-lasting discussion about what to do with the pacifist features brought in by Raja of India.

In LI some of the Indian or Buddhist civilization religions are not really pacifist. Some even have a martial soul. Heck, the Sejuks are Buddhist... so applying pacifist features would not make a lot of sense.

I was considering applying the features to any religion from the buddhist civilization with a statist or clerical soul. Let me know if you have views on this...?
 

Iustinus Tempus

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If I recall correctly, adding the pacifist features to non-martial soul Buddhist religions has always been the plan. Here on this post, made by tsf4 after consulting the Dev Team, has a image of what religions should get the pacifist features but nothing had happened for almost a whole year which is why I mentioned the issue on the Discord server. This was also why I mentioned that fact you wanted to check out my suggestions because the image was in the midst of the suggestions.

Looking over the image, there are a few religions that isn't a statist or clerical soul religion: Jaina (Messianic), Buddha-Mazdan (Traditional), Buddhaksetra (Messianic), and Vajrayana (Messianic). Would you be been with giving them those features? Also, I would argue Buddha-Mazdan (and by extension, it's reformed counterpart, Mahadipika) should get those features because right in its description, it states it is "characterized by a pacifist stance".
 

spendabuck

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If I recall correctly, adding the pacifist features to non-martial soul Buddhist religions has always been the plan. Here on this post, made by tsf4 after consulting the Dev Team, has a image of what religions should get the pacifist features but nothing had happened for almost a whole year which is why I mentioned the issue on the Discord server. This was also why I mentioned that fact you wanted to check out my suggestions because the image was in the midst of the suggestions.

Looking over the image, there are a few religions that isn't a statist or clerical soul religion: Jaina (Messianic), Buddha-Mazdan (Traditional), Buddhaksetra (Messianic), and Vajrayana (Messianic). Would you be been with giving them those features? Also, I would argue Buddha-Mazdan (and by extension, it's reformed counterpart, Mahadipika) should get those features because right in its description, it states it is "characterized by a pacifist stance".
Buddhaksetra is the form of Buddhism followed by the Seljuks, right? I was under the impression that it was one of the more martial forms of Buddhism, but regardless, it probably shouldn’t be pacifist since it’s the religion being followed by the Seljuks. All the other religions in that list seem like they could be pacifist though.