Let's All Play Together: Lan Na! Community Nation Discovery

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Axe99

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Man, Ming breaking up, friendly Ming...what is this nonsense :p. Ming WARNED me inside 10 years, guess they didn't like that I got Mong Yang first :(. Not that their warning meant anything, since the only nations I could declare on that bordered them were allies. They also got so much AE despite being heretic that I had to declare multi-wars a few times or I'd have had a coalition war on my hands. Even now they're a problem after ripping out Dali and a little more since they have 225 AE; literally anything else I piss off will join coalition alongside Ming if I let them do it on truce ending.

Haha, yes, forgot to mention that but I've played a few games since 1.12/1.13 and this is the first where Ming broke up all by itself (it broke up a couple of times in earlier games, but I gave it a little help so that doesn't count). As long as I can hold it together in south-east Asia, long-term it's looking pretty - am thinking I might have a crack at dominating the Chinese coastline and making a trade-based empire feeding into Bengal.
 

Dell19

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I've potentially lost in my current game. Unfortunately Ming and Ayutthaya have allied each other which then caused Ming to me. The situation in the west isn't great either as Orissa rivalled me first and then Bengal rivalled me so my only meaningful ally is Dai Viet. I just lost a war to Ming and they did briefly unrival me however it didn't last for long so in 3 years they will most likely declare war again. Not sure what to do really as a Ming collapse isn't looking likely. I might be able to get Brunei as an ally which might be enough to put them off from attacking but until their alliance with Ayutthaya ends there isn't much I can do.

fFwDn9B.jpg
 

josh127

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Ally Lan Xang, Arakan, Mong Yang. Built up to 9 units, declared on Hsenwi/Taungu along with Mong Yang. Sit in Taungu and Ayutthaya declares on me, marching 12 units across my land and straight at my army (nice move btw). That's OK, Arakan has 7 units next door. Before Arakan's units arrive (they started moving as soon as the battle began) the 12 vs 9 was a stack wipe.

When's the next one start? :p
 
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Axe99

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Ally Lan Xang, Arakan, Mong Yang. Built up to 9 units, declared on Hsenwi/Taungu along with Mong Yang. Sit in Taungu and Ayutthaya declares on me, marching 12 units across my land and straight at my army (nice move btw). That's OK, Arakan has 7 units next door. Before Arakan's units arrive (they started moving as soon as the battle began) the 12 vs 9 was a stack wipe.

When's the next one start? :p

Haha, something similar happened to me - Lan Na is a somewhat precarious start, and if it goes wrong early, it can go very wrong. No shame in re-starting :).
 

josh127

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Haha, something similar happened to me - Lan Na is a somewhat precarious start, and if it goes wrong early, it can go very wrong. No shame in re-starting :).
Second was funnier. Declared on Hsenwi and took Arakan as a vassal which made me war leader against Pegu along with pretty much all SEA on my side. So I took Pegu as a vassal too. Allied Mong Yang, Lan Xang (already allies), and Khmer to boot. Ayutthaya went in on Lan Xang and we started whipping up on most of SEA. Had it all under control until Ayutthaya ignored everyone else, sent 14 units in and stack wiped my 10 stack in Taungoo. You would think maybe I'd learn? Nah.

Of course, we were still going to destroy them, I just wasn't going to get all my claims occupied to have them given to me. But, without an army, my vassals went all hate, and Ava decided to call the coalition in on me to top it off.

Did I mention Ming had joined the coalition? :rolleyes:
 
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Axe99

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Did I mention Ming had joined the coalition? :rolleyes:

Ouch! Well, if you were going to get hit by a coalition, at least you did it right proper? :). Third time lucky?
 

josh127

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Ouch! Well, if you were going to get hit by a coalition, at least you did it right proper? :). Third time lucky?
It was a fun war. We actually had a nice little alliance going there too.

tIBmQXH.jpg
Nah, no third time for me. I'm not enjoying the game, but figured I'd give this one a try.
 

NoPants

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I've started a game and it's going pretty well. I'm not liking Theravada and I've never played Hindu, so I think I'll try switching, but I've never done that before. Does it go like this?

- take a Hindu province by force (there's one bordering me in Bengal now)
- send my missionary there with low maintenance so he never actually manages the conversion
- wait for Hindu rebels to pop out
- let the rebels occupy everything

Does the province automatically convert as soon as the rebels occupy it, or do I have to do something else?

Will one group of rebels roam around and convert lots of provinces, or will they disappear one I let once province convert?
 

TheMeInTeam

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FWIW, Ming would have (and still will) coalition me instantly if I don't keep hammering everyone on truce end. This start I spent more time at the start deliberating the opening than usual. I did a lot of bringing allies into wars against their allies via 3rd parties ASAP to plunge the region into chaos fast, but the opening DoW on Lan Xang (which reading through most people aren't opening that way) was a big factor in expansion speed. My initial target was going to be Pegu via the mission, but after looking at how alliances shook out I changed my mind.

I did have to double-tap ally Hsenwi and Ava though (send diplomat same-day), to ally them, Arakan, and Dai Viet. It was worth it for sure though.

Does the province automatically convert as soon as the rebels occupy it, or do I have to do something else?

Rebels convert when they occupy. Don't let them occupy your capital and enforce that way until they have at least 50% of your provinces converted though. You can only actually switch if a majority of your provinces are Hindu.

Juggling those rebels and fighting Ming at the same time (after they removed the mandate lost penalty inside 3-4 years) was probably my hardest war to this point, though inheriting Ayuthaya war and stalling until ally WE dipped enough to call them was close too.
 
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NoPants

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Rebels convert when they occupy. Don't let them occupy your capital and enforce that way until they have at least 50% of your provinces converted though. You can only actually switch if a majority of your provinces are Hindu.

Ok, so I do the steps above, but park my army in my capital until 50% of provinces are converted, then let them take the capital?

It's not 50% by development or anything fancy like that, right?
 

TheMeInTeam

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Ok, so I do the steps above, but park my army in my capital until 50% of provinces are converted, then let them take the capital?

It's not 50% by development or anything fancy like that, right?

Not sure. I usually let them go until I can accept demands, and let them keep converting afterwards because this kind of move tanks your unity and you will eat rebels for a while, not fun with the -50 prestige.

Don't kill the rebels. If they siege your cap you have a little while to unsiege it. Rebels don't seem as amenable to steering now as they used to be. For stuff like pretenders and revolutionaries that's really freaking annoying, those should be beelining capitals if possible.
 
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Axe99

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It was a fun war. We actually had a nice little alliance going there too.

tIBmQXH.jpg
Nah, no third time for me. I'm not enjoying the game, but figured I'd give this one a try.

That's a very scary looking diplo view ;). Best of luck for whatever you play next :).
 

fingernisk

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Fits of all big thanks to net.split for organizing this, I think it is an awesome idea. I missed the first part, but I decided to give this on a go, even though it is my first game in the far east.
Here is my 1500 check point:
nDuAkgL.jpg

Hsenwi and Dai Viet are my vassels. I am playing 1.12, and this is my second attempt (technical 3rd but one of them was just me being stupid).
It has been a great ride, and I have enjoyed Lan Na a lot more than I had thought. I have been through a regency counsel, seen my 5/5/4 heir die in a riding accident and fought wars constantly. Great fun. I think it is the same oping as most, all though I have used Lan Xang and Mong Yang as allie since Ayutthaya was hostile to me day 1. I need a little more time to chew up the peninsular, but other wise I am looking to expand south to claim the trade node. Haven't gotten my first idea set yet, but I am thinking exploration. I am diplomatically fighting to keep Ming off my back. Is there a way to see if they loose mandate of heaven? Any advise on how to destabilize them?

I hope everyone is having as much fun as I am :)
 
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Dell19

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For a while the game looked hopeless whilst Ayutthaya and Ming were allied together. Happily Ayutthaya started the second war so I was able to agree a separate peace with Ming for three provinces and then take 5 off Ayutthaya and finally break the alliance. Since then I've been able to gradually grab their remaining provinces (was slowed down by a 14 year regency) and they are now my vassal. I think Malacca will be next although I'm a little worried about Ming or a western nation attacking me at the same time. I think Ming won't attack as we share two allies (Manchu and Korea).

Btw Scandinavia was shockingly created by Denmark. I thought only Sweden was allowed to form it...

PYOFw9w.jpg
 
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Batzorio

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My progress so far:

SoiGmPJ.jpg


Probably moving a bit too slow, but I'm satisfied with what I've been able to accomplish so far.
Luckily Ming imploded so i don't really have anyone around that can challenge me for now.

Also I should probably get Expansion ideas as soon as possible so I can colonize the Phillipines and the rest of Indonesia.
 
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LordAnubis

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It has been a while since I've played some EUIV. I tend to binge and get burned out on strategy games in general, but this idea got me interested again. My start was rather funny, before the first year is out I get a negative prestige event. By 1517 my map looks like the screenshot in the spoiler. Also Ming is currently hostile, but hasn't acted on that hostility despite my land border. I've started colonizing.
2015-08-22_00003.jpg~original
 
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TheMeInTeam

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On to around 1570:

After 1st kind of tough war with Ming I was able to trash them during a civil war and tanked their prestige so hard they couldn't beat crap. Eventually they lost mandate of heaven (maybe due to internal conflicts stabhit and prestige drain on legitimacy?) and broke up. I got some quality vassal feed there. I also have taken care of the Malayan/Sumatra stuff, just need Brunei/Maja gone still.

Vassal --> double annex is going well enough.



I am also 100% Hindu, only two missionaries from religious ideas but I have a lot of power:



So if I ever get Rome I can quickly tear up swaths despite using Hindu. Civil war (ruler died w/o heir) really tanked prestige so I took that opportunity to do SIkh --> save burning world --> back.

I want to westernize but Europe is really slow this game for some reason. I can no-CB Najd and use their cores on QQ to move north into Caucuses, PLC took western decision so I could use them. If I'm going to put pants on my head in addition to all of India/China then I'll be wanting admin efficiency.
 
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Axe99

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Really enjoying this nation - it shows one of the strengths of EU4, as there can be a fair bit of a variety in terms of how it plays out, even from the same start. How do I know? I'm onto my fifth run now :confused:. My second run (first was a bit of a disaster) was going well until I had a lapse in attention and dow'd Hsenwi not realising that they'd just allied with my ally Ava, so in one silly mistake I've lost an ally, and bit off more than I could chew. The second mistake was being stubborn, and instead of peacing out and losing a few provinces, the late stage of the war looked like this:

And then things went not so well!.jpg

I was left with four provinces (original three and the one under Pu'er), -2 stability and no manpower or troops (after going bankrupt), and no allies - I can't recall where my prestige was, but it wasn't pretty either. Given it was pretty much only a matter of time before I was finished off, I started over, and the next two games didn't end well. The third start was just unlucky, I wasn't able to ally anyone particularly helpful (I think Ava and Arakan, but not Dai Viet, who was been a regular and helpful starting ally in most of these games) and got stomped by Ayyuthaya and their mates early. The fourth I got a little further, but again fell in a whole, it was over pretty quickly, but I think two of my allies self-destructed, leaving me unable to withstand Ayyuthaya again.

And then there was start the fifth. What I've liked about all these starts is that they've all been different, and it's stayed interesting all the way through (well, up until now, at least). This game kicked off with allying Arakan, Ava, Dai Viet and Mong Yang but everyone else wasn't interested due to how the rivalries had lined up. The 'tough start, so it takes a few goes to get established (well, if you're an average player like me - I'm sure TMIT wouldn't have had the same trouble :)) shows how different it is each time, and that there are interesting and different decisions to be made. At no point are you 'going through the motions'.

It started off poorly, as I was Ava's only ally, and Ava attacked Taungu (allied with Pegu, Ayyuthaya and Hsenwi - so about twice our combined troops - this qualifies as 'silly' in my book, so while I usually help out my allies when they ask, if it's a ridiculously poor judgement, I leave them to it). Poor old Ava then got eaten up by Taungu and Bengal, and I was feeling a bit weak, and had to wait and bide my time for Pegu to be isolated to take a bite from them. After that, though, I was able, with my allies, to chip away at Lan Xang and Pegu/Taungu/Ava and Hsenwi, and got established.

Ming allied Ayuthayya at one stage, but I attacked one of Ayuthayya's allies that wasn't allied to Ming and used that war to bring them down a notch. Then Ming politely went and disintegrated, and I was able to ally Dali and vassalise Shan.

In the screenie below, Khmer, Dali and Arakan are my allies (I try and always support my allies, and will only turn on them if they rival me - Dai Viet made that mistake ;) ), Taungu and Shan my vassals and Ming is no longer allied with Ayuthayya (and even if they were, wouldn't be that much of a threat). Biggest challenge going forward is likely to be Bengal and Bahmanis, which are allied and have both rivalled me, but am hoping through consolidation towards Malacca and up the Chinese coast will give me the strength to take them on.

As an aside, check out where Hsenwi ended up :).

Lan Na established.jpg
 

Angeleyed

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I've played my run to 1500:



Ming is slightly butthurt, something like 125 AE. Ayuthaya was over 200 but they squished. Ming lost mandate so it might be time to make a run on them. I don't have DLC so no karma garbage, just boring bland religion. Though I finally got those zealot rebels so that could help. Sunni is tempting too, and I'm annexing Ligore.

Obviously I'm a LITTLE points-starved here, something about blowing it all on picking up more land. Oh well.

This is only possible if you keep the pedal down and truce lock out the coalitions. 1st war was bringing in 4 people on Lan Xang and co belligerent Mong Yang and Pegu (vassaled them, took like 5 provinces off Lan Xang). Ayuthaya piled on Pegu and so I inherited that war. A *defensive* war, which allowed me to bring in all my allies. Since everyone in the region who wasn't allied abhorred me already I just never stopped :p.

I obviously have no interest in exploration. Maybe religious, maybe diplomatic, maybe influence. I took enforced heritage so probably not humanist...this is why I am thinking Sunni. I can no-CB some shlub near middle east that isn't too popular and make a run on Mecca or something, open another front.

Having played Hindu Sukhothai, I need suggestions on what religion to convert to. Maybe Shinto? Japanese as primary culture is also quite strong due to all the sick events.



You know you want to go animist ---> no CB into shamanist or Tengri :D.

This guy conquered all of SE Asia in 50 years and people are still crying that Buddhism is a problematic religion.

Well guess what, if you conquered half the number of provinces as France then even Lan Na would be in a coalition against you....

Buddhism is great and SE Asia is interesting so stop crying people.

P.s. Good work there mate
 
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Freudia

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This guy conquered all of SE Asia in 50 years and people are still crying that Buddhism is a problematic religion.

Well guess what, if you conquered half the number of provinces as France then even Lan Na would be in a coalition against you....

Buddhism is great and SE Asia is interesting so stop crying people.

P.s. Good work there mate

He doesn't have CS, which means he gets to ignore all the problems with Buddhism that exist in the DLC.

Should fact-check before asserting baseless claims, guy.