Learning from Prussia - a Rise of Prussia AAR against a real player - for beginners

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Narwhal

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Part XCI – January 1760 – Austria concedes

On the Austrian front, the Austrian army is destroyed once and for all.

In Torgau, with the mopping up of the last enemy forces starving for supplies :

Destruction1.jpg


In Magdeburg, where the still relatively strong army of Kheul is anniliated :

Destruction3fromsmallforce.jpg


In Munster, where Charles de Soubise forces are chased :

Destruction2-1.jpg


While Charles de Soubise’s forces are still on the map, the defeat on Munster means that all the forces East of Munster, trapped in the snow, are bound to disappear by lack of supplies.

The NM situation is 24 for the Austrians and 183 for Prussia.
With no more Austrian troops (< 4000 men), about 30 000 French troops left (excluding those bound to starve) and the Russian force (<50 000 men) much too far and not enough numerous to change the situation, Baris finally threw in the towel and conceded defeat. We played a few more turns (until Early March) to test a couple issues, but of course they were no opposition to my moves toward Paris in Westh and Prag in the South…

Also late January, God decided to punish England by flooding the whole island, which disappeared from the map (except Scotland and for some reason the city of Hull). [Not showed]

Fin.jpg
 
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loki100

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well that was an impressive and hard won victory ... thanks to both of you for such an entertaining and informative game. Not only a brilliant read but did so much to get me confident enough to actually understand how the AGEOD games work.

Given how big your win, its worth remembering how close Baris came to a decisive position on a number of occasions
 

Stuyvesant

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And so it ends... Quite the crushing victory. :) thanks to both of you for the write-up, it's been very informative. Who knows, I might actually play one of my AGEOD games, one of these days, armed with the knowledge I've gained from the AAR. ;)
 

Matnjord

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Felicitation for such a stunning victory Narwhal and thanks to both player for providing such a great demonstration of the engine and such an interesting game, huzzah!
 

Merrick Chance'

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Huzzah
huzzah
huzzah
 

Kodos666

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Do you already have plans for another AAR?
 

baris30

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Thanks to all those who have read and made comments about this AAR :) Which was very encouraging for Narwhal for putting all his best efforts to demonstrate 100+ turns of gameplay . And my special thanks to Narwhal for presenting this AAR from both sides perspective very accurately.
As said "Sentences gets old pretty much quickly, better to say something new.. " Maybe in another AAR or a game.. :)
 

Narwhal

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Thank you everyone. And thank you Baris !

First - a simple question. Did any of you bought the game / actually played the game because of the AAR. That was my first objective (getting people to "discover" the game) so I want to know how "efficient" I was.

Second - a few points about that game.

I think the key moments of the game were the following :

- My initial failure in a quick assault on Prag, which gave Baris a starting advantage. Next games, I will follow Anazagar advice and build a depot on the way to Prague to be able to siege the place.

- My failure to wipe out the Swedes, which forced me to allocate a corp to "threaten them". At least the front was frozen (no pun intended)

- My success against the Russians (prepared A LOT against the AI in my previous games), which not only allowed me to have "one less" front, but gave me an outstanding amount of NM. I now believe that as a Russian, you cannot just throw everything you have in Königsberg. I believe if I am ever in Baris situation, I would organise my force in one or two cavalry groups and one "heavy group". I would wait for good weather, then send first the cavalry groups so they arrive at different moments (two days apart, maybe by mixing some light infantry) to damage cohesion, then the "heavy group" arrives while the cavalry has retreated back. I need to test this.
Also, good weather might play a role.

- The splendid resistance to siege, twice, of Kassel - without which Baris could not move troops from one front to another.

- The turning point was Baris offensive in Saxony, while the French and the Prussians were fighting undecisively in Hannover. The almost complete destruction of the Austrian forces gave me an oustanding NM edge and a capacity to concentrate my forces in Hannover. From that point onward, I never felt very seriously threatened, as Baris never managed to recover his NM. He could have "waited" one year, but for AAR sakes he decided not to. Thank you for this.


I believe Baris did three crippling mistakes :
- He rarely did attack at the same time on both fronts when he could. I am thinking more particularly of the moment when all my armies were moving from Kassel to Saxony to push the Austrians back. I had absolutely no one in Hannover, but Baris, a very cautious player, waited several months before trying to do something in the area. Lack of scouts or afraid of a trap ? I think he would have had the time to take Hannover and threaten Brunschwig and Magdeburg, which would have forced me to move immediately from Saxony to the North without spending one more month to destroy what was left of the Austrians in that depot.

- He did not concentrate his forces enough in Saxony, allowing me to destroy them. A concentrated army led by Von Daun would have stopped me dead. I believe Baris wanted to take as much territory as possible while there was no one to defend them, but probably he should have regrouped when he saw Frederick coming his way. This is actually a bit surprising from Baris, who is usually, as I said, very, very cautious.

It is possible that I underestimate the chaos Baris had to go through due to unpaid troops refusing to move / unactivated generals / etc.

- Ill-timing the risky Russian attacks with the rest of the offensives : Baris attacked in Russia just before he attacked on the other fronts, giving me NM just when I wanted. If the first attack is a failure, I suppose Russians should attack at the end of the campaigning season, so the "NM" loss is recovered 5 / turn during winter.


Apart from this, and until I had that huge NM advantage (unbalanced ?), Baris cautious play shined in the first few years, during which I could NOT find an opening in his march. In Prag, later in Rhineland, I had the impression of banging on the wall. Baris great defenses really destroyed me as Poland in another game where I was in the offensive (until my armies were destroyed - the scenario ended with the Soviets two provinces away from Warsaw), and I believe playing against a French Baris in the French & Indian War must be very, very frustating.
 
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loki100

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well I'd bought it, played the Saxony scenario, read the manual and had no idea at all how it all fitted together. So your AAR actually encouraged me to start playing and gave me one way of understanding how some mechanics work and how to 'read' the map and to move on it in a sensible manner
 

Stuyvesant

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Well, I didn't buy ROP because of this AAR, but I think it did contribute to my decision to buy Pride of Nations. Mind you, I've yet to really play any of the handful of AGEOD games I own, but I like to think that I would, if I had enough time. :)

Thanks for the AAR, it helped me a lot to get a sense for all the concepts that AGEOD games have that are not in Paradox games. It helps a lot to shift your perspective, to know what to look for.
 

alvaro

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I didn;t buy it because I already have it but it clarified a few points that really motivates to try things yourself.
 

TheExecuter

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This AAR, and loki's...and your combined AAR...have really made me WANT to buy the game.

But the sad reality is that my laptop is unable to even play AGEOD's civil war game (which is a few years old)...so, until I raise the resources for a new computer...I shall continue to read your AAR's as a poor man's substitute.

Speaking of which, when is your next AAR?
:D
 

DanSez

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I got the game after reading the beginning of this AAR - I'd heard aboutAGEOD games from a few comments in the HoI3 forum. After getting RoP and test starting a few time, Paradox had a Wars in America giveaway and I learned more about the AGEOD system there (simpler I guess) - I want to get back to RoP over the coming Thanksgiving/Christmas holiday. Thanks for the entertaining and educational AAR.

I am interested in the Russian Revolution game AGEOD developed and that might be my next game purchase - poor start to Sword of the Stars has me rethinking buying "new" games and instead getting games that have been around a year or more.
 

unmerged(23444)

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@Narwhal: Thanks for this fantastic AAR!

@DanSez: I highly recommend Revolution Under Siege - I think it may be my favourite of the AGE games I've played so far. I bought all of them except for NCP and BOA after getting hooked on AACW, haven't played ROP yet though.
 

Malkael

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Bit late to the discussion I know, but you might be pleased to know that I've bought and installed RoP in an attempt to gradually learn the game thanks to your AAR. So add +1 to your objective score ;).
 

Sol Invictus

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Sorry to be so late to the thread but I just found this AAR a few days ago and have read it to completion. I read it because I had already decided to finally start a pbem game now that the game is patched to an acceptable level and now seems solid. I bought the game over a year ago but the early bugs really deterred me from even stating a game so I just waited. I wanted to get some insight and hints on gameplay from this AAR and boy what a treasure trove. It was very enjoyable and enlightening to read the gameplay between two masters. The Swedish trap and the use of Bateux to attempt to escape it were both brilliant. The one thing that troubles me is the way that the Russian efforts against Koenigsburg played out. It just doesn't sit well with me and doesn't seem very plausible. It also essentially nullified Russia for the entire game and was simply a large source of NM for Prussia. I hope that scenario is something that is a very rare event. Aside from that the gameplay was very enjoyable to follow. I now feel that I am somewhat competent to play my first pbem game.
 
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Matnjord

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First - a simple question. Did any of you bought the game / actually played the game because of the AAR. That was my first objective (getting people to "discover" the game) so I want to know how "efficient" I was.

Well, in the end I didn't buy Rise of Prussia but Revolution Under Siege as the setting is more interesting to me, but without your's (and Loki's) AARs I would have never comtemplated buying an AGEOD game, now look at me, I even played a MP game! (http://forums.ederon.net/default.aspx?g=posts&t=2655) And won! All thanks to you Narwhal, Merci beaucoup!
 

loki100

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Sorry to be so late to the thread but I just found this AAR a few days ago and have read it to completion. I read it because I had already decided to finally start a pbem game now that the game is patched to an acceptable level and now seems solid. I bought the game over a year ago but the early bugs really deterred me from even stating a game so I just waited. I wanted to get some insight and hints on gameplay from this AAR and boy what a treasure trove. It was very enjoyable and enlightening to read the gameplay between two masters. The Swedish trap and the use of Bateux to attempt to escape it were both brilliant. The one thing that troubles me is the way that the Russian efforts against Koenigsburg played out. It just doesn't sit well with me and doesn't seem very plausible. It also essentially nullified Russia for the entire game and was simply a large source of NM for Prussia. I hope that scenario is something that is a very rare event. Aside from that the gameplay was very enjoyable to follow. I now feel that I am somewhat competent to play my first pbem game.

Narwhal can probably answer better but I'm currently playing him in an another PBEM. The AI effectively abandons Koenigratz, now the garrison will take time to destroy and inflict losses on the Russians but I'd say by about 1759 they should be in Prussia proper. Narwhal likes to put a large army there and stop the Russians dead (so to speak). In our current game (late 58) he has a mobile force of about 25,000 and the garrison of about 10.000. Due to the terrain, even if I committed the entire Russian army I'd lose (frontage negating my numerical gain).

So its his gambit, he's tied up a corps, and hopes to tie up the Russian army, so then no threat to Kolberg etc. Now it so happens, I think there is a solution to his plan that effectively just takes his corps out the game, but till we get well into 1759 I ain't going to put it in writing anywhere ... :)