Laissez-faire and Capitalist AI
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After some decades of fascist rule I for role playing reasons decided to end the game as a democracy. I had passed all social reforms and wanted to give my people some well deserved political freedom as well. That turned out to be a big mistake. They voted for a liberal party. First thing that happened was that my income dropped to -350.000 per day (that is bad). Next thing that happened was that my industrial score went from 145.000 to 75.000 in little more than a week. It was still dropping rapidly when I quite the game for today.
With a minus 350.000 gold per month I will have to put my social spending slider very low. That means my POP won´t be able to afforded the goods that the factories produce. More factories will close and people will get unemployed. Instead of paying factory subsidiaries I will be paying unemployment subsidiaries.
So what has this game thought me? Two things. Fascism is great and a free market will ruin your economy. I love Paradox games because they are not always politically correct. But this is a little extreme even for my taste
Very well. The 1.2 patch did wonders for this game. But there is still some tweaking to be done.
Sounds like a realistic simulation of what happened to Russia in 1991
Laissez-Faire is a little buggy when capitalist decide to open or close a factory. I have a paper mill factory which have $300 profit a day, without subsidies. When a Laissez-Faire party win election, capitalist decide to close this factory. Capitalist lost money, my people lose jobs and I really don't know why.
I also notice capitalist never try to re-open a closed factory, even after output efficiency been improved a lot. I believe Paradox should work on decision-making of capitalist when it comes to build/open/close a factory. In 1.2, they prefer factory that produce highly demand goods too much, even they're not profitable, then a already-profitable one. In real life, most capitalist go for a profitable goods. Only small portion of capitalist would love to invest on highly-demand goods, even they are not profitable now. It's called venture capitalist.
I also notice capitalist never try to re-open a closed factory, even after output efficiency been improved a lot. I believe Paradox should work on decision-making of capitalist when it comes to build/open/close a factory. In 1.2, they prefer factory that produce highly demand goods too much, even they're not profitable, then a already-profitable one. In real life, most capitalist go for a profitable goods. Only small portion of capitalist would love to invest on highly-demand goods, even they are not profitable now. It's called venture capitalist.
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Laissez-faire is terrible at getting the economy going, but it's not that bad once you have an economy. What all the other policies do is artificially keep your Industry score high by pumping money into factories that make a loss - a bit of an odd policy. Yes, you'll lose a lot of factories at the start with L-F, but my Austria was almost back up to its original level by the time of the next elections and the government has now been liberal for the last 70 years, and it's the fourth industrial power (and fastest to rise now that it's Germany) even though I have no exotic colonial money makers and spent most of the game getting all those tiny German minors into my sphere while all the other countries were grabbing the big fish.
Of course, I don't have unemployment subsidies, so that might make a big difference .
Of course, I don't have unemployment subsidies, so that might make a big difference
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The problem I've found with L-F is that unless there are a large number of unemployed craftsmen as soon as the factory finishes, there are no workers for a week or so, and so the capitalists close down. Plus, they won't reopen factories, and won't delete the first closed factory in each state. So they tend to keep one closed factory in every state, because it couldn't make money in the first couple days it was open, but they don't delete the first closed factory per state.
Yeah and you end up with bunch of closed factories just waisitng space that youc ant close down due to stupid limitations.
Laissez-Faire can be great if you have a decent industrial base.
In my USA game I even managed to get a stronger industry than the UK without taking away India. I only took some parts of Canada. And this with the Republicans ruling for over 40 years. In the end I had many states with eight factories, all working with profit. And most of these factories were permanently extended.
In my USA game I even managed to get a stronger industry than the UK without taking away India. I only took some parts of Canada. And this with the Republicans ruling for over 40 years. In the end I had many states with eight factories, all working with profit. And most of these factories were permanently extended.
I've found that jolting from PE/SC to L-F = fail. However, using Interventionism to get things rolling them switching to L-F can = win.
yeah but the point is with L-F is it should arguably look after its self, If your going from interventionism to L-F your spoon feeding a retarded AI. ( I've tried this btw and i had a 4K automobile get closed down because all the slots were used to open a fertilizer factory... )
)I never used L-F myself. The capitalist AI is too retarded. I can't count the number of times I have to shut down the unprofitable, weapons and canned food factory.
I've found LF quite effective with USA (1.1)
Can't remember anyone else that's really given me the sucess I wanted
Not that everyone else has been a hell after going LF, but only the US has been really sucessfull (and I've only played them once.. in 1.1)
Can't remember anyone else that's really given me the sucess I wanted
Not that everyone else has been a hell after going LF, but only the US has been really sucessfull (and I've only played them once.. in 1.1)
In your post you stated that due to low social spending your pops wont be able to afford factory produced goods, which is wrong. Even without any social reforms where you need to spend money in your pops will still earn money (aslong as they're employed, as far as I know only clerks & craftsmen can be unemployed) from wages.
Farmers and Laborers can become unemployed if there are more of them than jobs available, and they have not yet promoted/emigrated. Easy to do when you have health care.
I like L-F once you get your economy going! I have a game as Germany in 1920 where I have about half of Europe, and my industrial score dwarfs everyone else's, even the UK's, and I've been L-F since around 1850.
The main problem I've found with L-F is that it doesn't work unless the factory can be staffed immediately. Many times, what happens is:
1. Factory opens
2. 20 people go to work in the factory
3. Factory cannot pay its upkeep
4. Factory has no money to hire new people
5. Factory closes
6. Capis see that there are unemployed people and extra factory slots, so they repeat the cycle.
I've had luck breaking this cycle by putting a NF-craftsmen about 6-12 months before the factory opens.
The main problem I've found with L-F is that it doesn't work unless the factory can be staffed immediately. Many times, what happens is:
1. Factory opens
2. 20 people go to work in the factory
3. Factory cannot pay its upkeep
4. Factory has no money to hire new people
5. Factory closes
6. Capis see that there are unemployed people and extra factory slots, so they repeat the cycle.
I've had luck breaking this cycle by putting a NF-craftsmen about 6-12 months before the factory opens.
I played (or am Playing) an Austrian game with a handful of good, solid factories and a steady rising industry score. I put in a LF faction and my industry boomed. Several Steel, Winery, and successful Canned food factories with my score booming. Usually other countries LF limits or levels off industry, but in a growing economy it is pretty good.
Summary: Put in LF when your economy is already built and busy with wars and such.
Summary: Put in LF when your economy is already built and busy with wars and such.
LF is working nice under some circumstances and badly under others.
To test it a bit, I set a modifier for input -100%. Without subsidies, all factories close for no reason at all (even without craftmen they can't loose money).
So there must be something wrong in their behaviour of closing.
Otherwise, in normal game, I always go into LF when I have some nice factories, and then it's the economical boom. Never had a real problem. They do some stupid things, but they correct themself most of the time.
To test it a bit, I set a modifier for input -100%. Without subsidies, all factories close for no reason at all (even without craftmen they can't loose money).
So there must be something wrong in their behaviour of closing.
Otherwise, in normal game, I always go into LF when I have some nice factories, and then it's the economical boom. Never had a real problem. They do some stupid things, but they correct themself most of the time.
I do think they are trigger happy. But once you're rolling, if you stick with L-F, you can have a booming economy. The key is not to switch between L-F and SC/PE or vice versa, or you'll hit a brick wall.
Factories going bankrupt
So in my latest game with Sweden I just changed to a liberal government, which means I can't build or close any factories. No problem, I already have a nice wood industry, which is running fine and making a nice profit, in the north.
But since I changed to a liberal government the Capis are building factories in the empty states, but the ones they are building are going bankrupt in about 2 or 3 months. Anything that can be done, maybe in a next run so it won't happen again? I can't change the ruling party and I don't think I'll get another government anytime soon.
So in my latest game with Sweden I just changed to a liberal government, which means I can't build or close any factories. No problem, I already have a nice wood industry, which is running fine and making a nice profit, in the north.
But since I changed to a liberal government the Capis are building factories in the empty states, but the ones they are building are going bankrupt in about 2 or 3 months. Anything that can be done, maybe in a next run so it won't happen again? I can't change the ruling party and I don't think I'll get another government anytime soon.
Honestly, don't worry about it. Most of Sweden's states have ~100k people, so you're not losing out on any significant amount of industrial score. If you were a country with more than 1-2 million people, then it'd be a problem, but Sweden isn't one of those.
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