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misterbean

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Nice recovery!
Yeah, win a war without losing too much MP, no AE and still get exactly out of it what I wanted. After 10 years in the basement, France needed it too.
 

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Chapter 16: Ending The Bloodfeud.

I get a statesman as advisor in 1533. His +5 Diplomatic Reputation will help a lot in speeding up the annexation of Hainaut and Galicia.
I make a note to try to stay out of HRE business for the next 20 years or so since all the princes hate us, with Austria as notable exception.

A large Dutch revolt in Zeeland finally convinces me to change their culture to Cosmopolitaine. 200 DP is a lot, but if it means I won’t have to keep a substantial army nearby at all times, it may be worth it. I am only sorry that Holland is protestant. Their culture cannot be changed until they have been converted. Which I cannot do yet.




A random “Border Dispute” event in 1534, gives me the choice between a claim on Rethel and a prestige hit. I decide to go for the claim. It can’t hurt to have something in your back pocket, just in case.




The king of Brabant is of Valois blood. He is still very young, however, and the chance of inheriting the throne seems pretty far fetched.




Austria has been at war with Castile and Hungary. Once again, Hungary ends up being the one to pay the price.




December 1534. Now that I do have that claim, I might as well take a look at what I would have to go up against. Only Savoy could be a bother in case of war. Not in and by themselves, of course, but they have a good number of allies, including all of northern Italy and Venice.
Then again, if they do decide to side with Aachen, that could be my way into Italy. Besides, Nice is a very beautiful city, my advisors tell me.

I get relations with Brabant up to 191, only to find out that my tax base is too low for them to be vassalised. The fact that they are HRE doesn’t help either.
Oh, yeah, I wasn’t going to mess with the Empire for a while.
***sigh***




To soothe my frustration, I start picking on Venice. Getting my hands on Parma would allow me to release Milan and feed them a bunch of Lombardian provinces.


Lothringen is converted in 1535, and I start working on Alençon. This makes them the only province in the kingdom with any revolt risk ( a measly 0.8). How things have changed.

I get the claim against Venice, and start working on another one.

One of the king’s ancestors in pronounced to be a saint, sending my stability up to +3.




Hainaut is incorporated into the kingdom in august 1536. My next mission is to increase Portugal’s opinion of me. They are only slightly annoyed and threatened by France, so this should be an easy +3 prestige.




I reach Diplomatic tech level 11 in february 1537. With Galicia annexed, I now have the range to start colonising. Unfortunately, I don’t have a colonist. It will have to wait 3 Admin levels.




My truce with Burgundy is over. In the immortal words of Jon Irenicus: "Let this end!"
I call Savoy into the war for the added relations boost. It might help if I move against Venice or Aachen in the near future.

The war is over in a heartbeat, but, as always, the sieging takes forever.




I am seven years ahead in Military research. This is a perfect moment to grab a new Defensive Idea.

April 1538. Burgundy is full sieged.




This is what I would like to do, but the +41 AE doesn’t strike me as very appealing. Besides, I don’t have 150 DP anyway.




This is not at all what I wanted, but it is the smart thing to do, with only +15 AE. I will just have to wait another 10 to 15 years before they dissapear forever.



The relationship with my newfound vassal is less than ideal, but that’s ok. It will be 10 years before I can annex them anyway. By that time, I should be able to get them up to +190 at least.




Louis XIV dies on 18 September 1538. I love the comment about my new king, and can only hope he dies as soon as Henri turns 15.




I start cultivating a relationship with Aragon, hoping to get them friendly enough that I can sponsor their struggle for freedom.

And now that the internal threat has been all but eliminated, we can finally get to work on Italy and/or Spain.
See you next time!
 

misterbean

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Burgundy is out then (or, rather, in). With Aragon there is the little issue of Roussillon, which you may want for yourself since it's north of the Pyrenees, but I guess that can be arranged at a later stage :)
they will get theirs eventually.
 

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Chapter 17: Italian Adventures.


Aragon has a -1047 modifier to accept my support for their independence, so I stop improving our relations. There are better things I could be doing with my diplomats.




He is still on his way home, when Brabant decides to make a powerplay of its own. Of course I will stand by them, since it gives me an opening to use against Aachen. Losing the alliance with Savoy is unfortunate, but unavoidable. It does give me a mission to incorporate Savoy into the warm French embrace, with claims on every one of their provinces.

In March of 1539, Portugal steals the curia from me. In no time, they will have 3 cardinals to my 1. The unfortunate hazard of backing the wrong horses, it seems.


In oktober, I peace out Aachen, grabbing Rethel for myself and giving Limburg (the wargoal) to Brabant, to help offset the relations hit for a seperate peace.

Even though my alliance with Savoy has ended, they still give me military access, enabling me to declare war on Venice. The plan is to grab Parma and break off Milan, which I will then be able to feed additional provinces in later wars.
Unfortunately, I forget to dock my Genoa trade fleet. It does not take Venice long to find them and by the time I can break off combat, I have lost 5 trade ships.




The fighting is over quickly and most of the Venitian lands are sieged. I even manage to sneak 8 regiments onto Venice itself. Of course, they will be stuck there for the rest of the war, but it’s more than worth it.
The Venitians try a couple of naval landings, but I never get into any serious trouble.

While I am waiting for the sieges to finish, I finally have enough ducats to build the Embassy. The fact that it doubles the hostile coring costs of all French provinces is a very nice bonus, but I am more interested in the permanent extra diplomat. Having lost curia control does impede my diplomatic efforts significantly.

In August of 1541, I reach Admin level 11.

Modena is vassalised a month later. They have some cores and claims that seem interesting.

I am making a ton of money, even while at war, so I decide to go for the +2 Inquisitor. Unfortunately, he will pass away a few years later, much too quickly to have gained a lot of traction from him.



It takes until oktober of 1542 to make Venice see the error of their ways. Losing their Greek islands and Sardinia will at least force them to scale down their navy a little and will make it easier to reach all their provinces. I briefly contemplate diplo-vassalising Sardinia, but I am already at my diplo limit.

Ferrarra, Genoa and Tuscany enter a coalition against me, before I get the chance to break off Milan. Nobody else seems inclined to mess with France right now, so I am somewhat unimpressed. They will leave in a couple of years anyway.

Brabant has no heir right now, and if their 19-year-old king were to die without producing one, it would mean a succession war between France and Denmark. Given his young age, I am trying not to get my hopes up. Can’t I sneak a snake into his bedroom or force him to drown in a mud pit or something?

In early 1545, Castile gains a claim on Béarn through event.

In June of that same year, Austria goes to war against Bavaria. I answer the call to arms, but limit my assistance to cheering them on from the side lines. They will eventually manage to grab 2 Bavarian provinces.




On the 2nd of July, 1545, Castile integrates Aragon. Spain is born. They waste no time in putting me under an embargo. I pay them back by putting down claims on their provinces bordering France.

Sweden closes an alliance with Austria, which seems to little concern me.




Oktober 1547. Time to start building a land bridge to my Italian vassals. The war includes Aachen, Palatinate, Ferrarra, Mantua and Tuscany. Hesse will soon join them and bring a couple of extra HRE members along for the ride.




By March of the following year, all the German minors are being sieged.
I grab Military Tech level 12. After this war, I will be able to use Tercio infantry.

Sweden goes to war against Denmark. They each bring their ally with them to the party. Brabant vs. Austria. Not a very fair fight, but there is little I can do about it now.




It will take until oktober 1549 to end the war, but I am fairly pleased with it. The only AE I get is from the Italian peace deals. I feed Pisa to Modena and Mantua to Milan. For some reason, neither one is interested in Ferrarra, even though they both have claims there, but it does not matter. I will just release them as a vassal. Nice, of course, will be cored, regardless of what the Emperor thinks about “Unlawful Territory”.

I also, finally, begin integrating Burgundy. It will take more than 5 years, but in the end, they will disappear forever.



Of course, a ripple of concern goes through Europe. I don’t think I will be initiating any wars any time soon. Just to be on the safe side, I send a diplomat to suck up to Austria. Last thing I need right now is for them to break the alliance and join the coalition.



Brabant’s king Godfried I still has not produced an heir. What’s more, they have lost the RM with Denmark, because a Valois is next in line for the throne. Where is that snake charmer when you need him?
 

misterbean

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I must admit to being a bit uncertain on how to handle the Brabant throne. Do I claim their throne or do I wait until there is a Valois before doing so?
 

thedirtygerman

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I'm not quiet sure about Brabant but waiting might get you the Claim Throne CB. Regarding Ferrara you dont need to release them. Mailand or Modena will take it as soon as they have cored the provinces you just fed them. They just wont accept it as long as they are overextended.
 

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I'm not quiet sure about Brabant but waiting might get you the Claim Throne CB. Regarding Ferrara you dont need to release them. Mailand or Modena will take it as soon as they have cored the provinces you just fed them. They just wont accept it as long as they are overextended.
Judging from a post in the quick questions thread earlier today, it seems that I may have hit a known bug, where you can't sell provinces that you can't core. on the other hand, Ferrarra was not overland, so I should have been able to core it, had I wanted to. You may be right, then. I should have waited, but I wanted to get the OE down ASAP, along with some AE.
All moot now, of course.
re: Brabant. Again, it's one of the exciting things about Ironman. In most games, you can try something and if it doesn't work, just reload. Ironman does force you think carefully before making a move.
 

beartjah

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24 still is enough time to produce an heir, I think. Claiming the throne is probably an unnecesary hit on the relations(unless you want the alliance down ofc.)
If it isn't, wouldn't the new guy (from your dyansty) have no heir? Because then you can just claim the throne anyway, and use the cb.

And in chapter 16 brabant was of valois blood, but now it isn't. What happened in the mean time? (I think you missed an uportunity to force a pu there)
 

misterbean

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24 still is enough time to produce an heir, I think. Claiming the throne is probably an unnecesary hit on the relations(unless you want the alliance down ofc.)
If it isn't, wouldn't the new guy (from your dyansty) have no heir? Because then you can just claim the throne anyway, and use the cb.

And in chapter 16 brabant was of valois blood, but now it isn't. What happened in the mean time? (I think you missed an uportunity to force a pu there)
OMG. You are absolutely correct.
See, that's why I asked, because I keep s***ing these things up. For the record, let's see if I get it straight. My neighbour is of my dynasty. I use the diplo action "claim throne". If he dies without heir, I get them in a PU, at the cost of a relations hit with everyone else I have a RM with, or I get in a succession war with another claimant.
What if he does get an heir of my bloodline? The diplo action gets shelved? Do I lose the claim or does it just skip a generation?

edit: I know there was some trouble with rebels, so I think he got jumped by a pretender.
 

beartjah

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OMG. You are absolutely correct.
See, that's why I asked, because I keep s***ing these things up. For the record, let's see if I get it straight. My neighbour is of my dynasty. I use the diplo action "claim throne". If he dies without heir, I get them in a PU, at the cost of a relations hit with everyone else I have a RM with, or I get in a succession war with another claimant.
What if he does get an heir of my bloodline? The diplo action gets shelved? Do I lose the claim or does it just skip a generation?

edit: I know there was some trouble with rebels, so I think he got jumped by a pretender.
I haven't found any pattern in the claim throne effects, sometimes it gives a pu, sometimes it just gives dyansty, and sometimes it doens't change anything at all(this is for people without heirs), but I don't know what happens when.
If you claim a throne, I don't think a succesion war is possible(with someone who didn't claim, but I haven't seen the ai ever claim a throne)

If you claim a throne and he gets an heir, the claim simply vanishes. I have no idea what happens if he gets an heir with a weak claim(since you can also claim throne on them).
 

misterbean

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I haven't found any pattern in the claim throne effects, sometimes it gives a pu, sometimes it just gives dyansty, and sometimes it doens't change anything at all(this is for people without heirs), but I don't know what happens when.
If you claim a throne, I don't think a succesion war is possible(with someone who didn't claim, but I haven't seen the ai ever claim a throne)

If you claim a throne and he gets an heir, the claim simply vanishes. I have no idea what happens if he gets an heir with a weak claim(since you can also claim throne on them).
I think I will try a couple of "practice runs" in standard games first, because I similarly don't understand why sometimes your RM dies with your current king and sometimes it doesn't. I don't think there is anyone who truly understands.

edit: I do know that prestige matters in terms of PU, so maybe it counts for claiming a throne of a weak heir as well.
 

beartjah

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I think I will try a couple of "practice runs" in standard games first, because I similarly don't understand why sometimes your RM dies with your current king and sometimes it doesn't. I don't think there is anyone who truly understands.

edit: I do know that prestige matters in terms of PU, so maybe it counts for claiming a throne of a weak heir as well.
I do know that claiming the throne of a weak hier only gives the cb(with same dynasty), but doens't actually change what happens on death of monarch
 

misterbean

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Royal Marriage test.

As Brandenburg, I closed a RM with Denmark.
Denmark had only “noble succeeds”.
Saved game.
I claim the throne, tag switch and kill the king. A Von Hohenzollern became the new king.
Upon tag switching back to Brandenburg, I lost the claim. Why? I suspect that my being a player has something to do with it.

Reload as Brandenburg.

Used the console to give Brandenburg 29 prestige, enough to overcome Denmark’s prestige.

Denmark had also closed a RM with Lithuania. Now a noble from house Jagiellon succeeds. Why? Is it a matter of relations? I married them first, so it’s not a matter of seniority. Maybe they had more prestige than me?

Claimed Denmark’s throne again.

This time I got a “claim throne” CB. The tooltip said a noble of my house would succeed to the Danish throne. Why? The diplo action’s tooltip said: “if the king dies without an heir, this will result in a personal union”. That is not what will happen, according to the tooltip.

Killed Denmark’s queen without tag switching, who had no heir and less prestige than me.
Lost the claim again, but not the CB.

This is so confusing, since you only get “lost the claim”, but not why you lost the claim.

Clearly, there is a third factor involved beyond prestige and heirdom, but what? relations? I don't have a clue.

edited to add: It might be diplomatic reputation, right?
 
Last edited:

beartjah

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Royal Marriage test.

As Brandenburg, I closed a RM with Denmark.
Denmark had only “noble succeeds”.
Saved game.
I claim the throne, tag switch and kill the king. A Von Hohenzollern became the new king.
Upon tag switching back to Brandenburg, I lost the claim. Why? I suspect that my being a player has something to do with it.

Reload as Brandenburg.

Used the console to give Brandenburg 29 prestige, enough to overcome Denmark’s prestige.

Denmark had also closed a RM with Lithuania. Now a noble from house Jagiellon succeeds. Why? Is it a matter of relations? I married them first, so it’s not a matter of seniority. Maybe they had more prestige than me?

Claimed Denmark’s throne again.

This time I got a “claim throne” CB. The tooltip said a noble of my house would succeed to the Danish throne. Why? The diplo action’s tooltip said: “if the king dies without an heir, this will result in a personal union”. That is not what will happen, according to the tooltip.

Killed Denmark’s queen without tag switching, who had no heir and less prestige than me.
Lost the claim again, but not the CB.

This is so confusing, since you only get “lost the claim”, but not why you lost the claim.

Clearly, there is a third factor involved beyond prestige and heirdom, but what? relations? I don't have a clue.

edited to add: It might be diplomatic reputation, right?
In case of multiple rms then country with the mpst prestige wins out.
Losing a claim can, if I'm not wrong, only happen if it is no longer possible to claim the throne(they had an heir).
The cb can only come from claiming a throne of a dynast(even one with a weak claim heir), I think retaining the cn after losing the claim might be that the cbs update only at the end of the month(I think), you also don't get an emmediate cb when you get a province claim.

But I have no idea how to predict the effect of claiming a throne
 

misterbean

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at any rate, I have also posted this in the Quick Questions thread. If I ever want to have a game as, say, Austria or Venice or some such, I will need to know.
 

loup99

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That Venice was really big! And finally some italian ambitions! For the PU I don't know.
 

Seelmeister

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Great update, looking forward to seeing how long it takes for Spain to attempt to wrest back control of Galicia. Will their rivalry with you take them overseas to the Italian peninsula?
 

misterbean

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Great update, looking forward to seeing how long it takes for Spain to attempt to wrest back control of Galicia. Will their rivalry with you take them overseas to the Italian peninsula?
Aragon had 2 provinces in central Italy, so we might collide at some point. Thankfully, they have lost Napels a long time ago. The only one having any claims on them right now, is France, until 1561 I believe. If they want to have some fun, let them come!
 

misterbean

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Chapter 18: The Spanish Grain.




Henri, the 4-3-4 heir to the throne of France, dies in may 1555, leaving the king to find solace in the church at the age of 54. If I want control of the curia back, I need that papal influence. Besides, with so many enemies all around us, the last thing we need is an heir with a weak claim.
For about a week, it seems like my next king will be a Von habsburg, before a new heir is produced, another Henri. This one is already 34, and he is only a 4-1-3, but I’ll take it.




The king of Hesse dies, and the electors of the HRE unanimously decide to reinstate Austria. Even Bohemia voted for them!




Time of celebration! Brandenburg is no more. After all this time, and all those wars, they have finally given in to the inevitable. France, at last, is whole again!

Utrecht leaves the coalition in march of 1558, hopefully the first of many.

Artois is converted, and we begin work on Calais.




Austria calls me to arms against Bavaria. I go along, but do nothing. It’s pretty obvious from the start that Austria has things well in hand. After 17 months, Bavaria cedes Memmingen and Nürnberg to Austria and pays 96 ducats.

I spend another 2 years peacefully taking care of things at home, building star forts everywhere. Once the relations with my vassals and allies have maxed out, I begin talking to the coalition members.




May, 1561. France is once again in control of the curia. The extra diplomat is quite literally a Godsend.




In oktober, 1561, Spain gets into a succession war against Austria over the Palatinate. I don’t really want Austria to get more powerful, but on the other hand, weakening Spain sounds like a very good idea. Spain has 71 active regiments, 28 of which are sitting in Palermo.




With all my armies converging on the Spanish border, I get the jump on a Portugese trade fleet and sink them before any of Spain’s or Portugal’s battlewagons get there.




A fairly large Spanish army tries to go on the offensive, but, with the help of Milan, I manage to convince them otherwise.
At the same time, another French army reaches Barcelona before our enemies do. They get a river crossing. I win the battle.




After that, the war has been all but decided. I have 1 army in Southern France as reserve, 1 army carpet sieging most of former Aragon, and 2 armies rampaging across Spain and Portugal. From Madrid, across Toledo, to Lisboa, they are stomped into the ground.




By early februari, 1564 I feel confident enough to start carpet sieging the rest of Spain, but just as I do, Austria calls for peace.
As part of the settlement, Navarra is released and I waste no time marrying them and allying with them. If Spain wants her back, they will have to go through France to get it. Not that they will be a threat anytime soon. According to the ledger, they have banked their capital on mercs, they have only a few thousand MP and 20 active regiments (most of which seem to be in the colonies).

With Spain in the ropes, I have a lot of options in the near future. Going back into Italy, or making sure Spain will not recover from this defeat seem the two most obvious choices.
Unfortunately, while we were at war, our claims on Savoy have ended. Now I will have to start making new claims.
Maybe I’ll head back into Spain in 5 years time. Breaking them first sounds more enticing by the day.




Even God seems to agree with me. See you next time!