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Dewirix

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Interesting stuff. By building medium armour you've effectively withdrawn from the Versailles limitations, but Germany's refusal to intervene in Austria must be worth something in the eyes of the western allies.

How will Italy's actions affect your attitude towards them? If they start interfering in Greece you'll have an international crisis on your hands.
 

Slan

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Interesting stuff. By building medium armour you've effectively withdrawn from the Versailles limitations, but Germany's refusal to intervene in Austria must be worth something in the eyes of the western allies.

This sounds kind of like saying that if a former convict doesn't rob a bank again, then he should be rewarded... There's nothing to intervene about in Austria. Oh yeah, there's that "Political Crisis in Austria" thing, but that's pretty overrated, is it not? :rolleyes:

How will Italy's actions affect your attitude towards them? If they start interfering in Greece you'll have an international crisis on your hands.

Italy won't make any steps in the Balkans without German encouragement. Italy's decisions to cause trouble in Albania relies upon German expansionism and the Ultimatum to Greece needs France to fall first. And in the version this AAR is written in, Italy doesn't actually has her warplans implemented yet... (I thought I made them, honest!...)
 

Rensslaer

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Don't think so either, the timeframe of the game is too short and you since diplomacy isn't exactly that much part of the game yet...

You know, it's possible that threat goes down over time, but very very slowly. What I'm seeing though (having played ahead a bit) is that neutrality seems to go back up at a slow but steady pace once the cause of the threat is gone (i.e. once a war is over). Is that a function of SF or HPP? Or am I imagining things (I'm pretty sure I'm not, because I've been watching carefully)?

Renss
 

Dewirix

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This sounds kind of like saying that if a former convict doesn't rob a bank again, then he should be rewarded... There's nothing to intervene about in Austria. Oh yeah, there's that "Political Crisis in Austria" thing, but that's pretty overrated, is it not? :rolleyes:

:) Point taken, but these things don't happen in a vaccum. There'd be political pressure from German and Austrian ultra-rightists for some kind of intervention, but the government would be seen to face it down and would presumably make sure that France and the UK knew their thinking on this. I'd think that would count for something, although Germany building up its armoured forces might cancel out any goodwill gained.
 

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Slan

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You know, it's possible that threat goes down over time, but very very slowly. What I'm seeing though (having played ahead a bit) is that neutrality seems to go back up at a slow but steady pace once the cause of the threat is gone (i.e. once a war is over). Is that a function of SF or HPP? Or am I imagining things (I'm pretty sure I'm not, because I've been watching carefully)?

Renss

There's no hidden factor to increase Neutrality nor to decrease Threat over time. There are Strategic Effects ("Neutrality" in general and the "Monroe Doctrine" for the USA) and ministers (Silent Lawyer and Pig-Headed Isolationist) that effect Neutrality, but there's no modifier to use for threat. (There's a "threat_impact", but that doesn't give or take threat directly either.) Then there are random events to effect it. Plus War Exhaustion increases Neutrality, but that is only present at war of course.
 

Rensslaer

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Supporting the nationalists and taking back Rhineland could be considered a little offensive. But on the other side I don’t think it is strange moves, I think these moves are kind of realistic, especially moving into Rhineland and taking back what is actually your land… I actually think the worst news in that update is a negative event against coal stockpiling, I can understand why these kind of penalties are included, but they are never nice to get. Still you are going to need that energy in the future so I guess you just have to live with the penalty and stockpile as much as possible…

I've played ahead a bit, and at one point the coal stockpiling penalty caused me to panic... :D Much interesting stuff ahead.

This is a very interesting concept/approach. I'm terribly curious as to how it will play out in the long run. Also, you're doing a fantastic job of showing off the HPP mod. After reading this, I definitely have to check it out.

Thanks, Nuarq! And Welcome! I'm glad you like it. I'm terribly curious too -- something I've tried before in HOI 2, but not so fully in HOI 3 yet.

I've never quite got into HOI3 (tried, several times, but it never got the spark), but I'll follow a Rensslaer AAR anyday. PS: Take Constantinople.

Thanks, Grunthex! Welcome! I think if you try HOI 3 in the right way, you'll get hooked. It's actually my favorite of the Paradox games. I'll... Think about Constantinople. ;) Actually, no -- Constantinople is an ally. :p

Not sure what you plan to use your ships for, ...

Since you embargoed Japan, ...

I don't think it would hurt you too much, from an in-game or RP perspective, to annex Austria through diplomacy. ...

Finally, ouch, those tanks are expensive. ....

Wow. Long response! I'll try to respond to some of what you brought up. Yes, I'm following the commerce raiding model for my ships. Not expecting to go toe-to-toe with anyone, but if I do end up at war with the Allies I want to be able to impact their commerce. Yes, as a non-aggressor nation I've chosen to oppose Japan's aggressiveness, which hopefully will curry favor with the Allies. I definitely don't want Japan in the Axis. But China is a lost cause, so... More on that in the next update. I might be able to afford to raise Threat through the diplomatic actions, but I'm not willing to bet on it. Too much is at stake. As for the tanks -- I tend to do about half-and-half, reserve troops and active troops, when constructing. It means that if I do go into a war my troops aren't all at half-strength and I can respond more quickly. It also means my reinforcement needs aren't suddenly flooded at war start. I tend to prefer to do armoured units as non-reserve because they can be more important. That's good to know about the militia rules -- I was wondering what that "redistribution of old weapons" event was for. Thanks!

Bot how do you get the corridor if not with brute force? :eek:

Indeed, maybe I don't! :)

An interesting choice to decline the Anschluss - I thought you might go for the diplomatic option.

As for the Far East, you already seem to have made a diplomatic choice to support China over Japan. Since Japan seems to be doing rather well and China could be defeated, is this situation important enough to warrant direct German intervention? I would say not. Diplomatic support? Yes. War? No.

Thanks, SSmith, and Welcome! I decided I didn't want to risk it, but the option is not 100% off the table yet. Yes, China over Japan, but there's not much I can do about the situation.

Poland is pushed away because you have cores in Poland. I'm pretty sure it was not this way before, but recently the effect works both ways. It was removed from the later versions (1.9 and up) since being in the same faction allows you to give them the land peacefully, so that shouldn't make them worried, quite the contrary! Nice update by the way :)

Thanks! When you say give them the land peacefully, do you mean to give up claims on the land, or what? Would you recommend I switch to the new version, or would that invalidate my savegames?

Nice update. It is very interesting to read about a country vigorously eschewing the path of war while the world around it melts into chaos. I will enjoy this ride as an exercise in "practical politics." BTW - really like what I have seen of this mod - kudos to TheBromgrev & Slan!

Ideally, the world won't dissolve into as much chaos without my help! :D Welcome, WhisperingDeath! I'm enjoying the mod too. Great work went into it.

Doesn't threat degrade over time?

You've probably noticed we discussed this threat thing, and I'm still not convinced neutrality isn't increasing over time.

It's one of the things that make plausible post-war scenarios impossible. Pretty much every major country has extremely low neutrality and very high threat, which creates a mess out of diplomacy. Not to mention the fact that the AI can't disband parts of its army (or obsolete ships, or whatever) and the late-game performance is terrible. It's better in HPP than in HOI3 Vanilla, but still pretty much boring and flawed. HOI3 platform is simply poorly suited for such scenarios. Maybe it will get better with the next expansion.

That's partly why I'm wanting to do this odd experiment -- I'm wondering if the system at least allows for some scenario that keeps the peace (at least for Germany). I agree that can be a problem in late-game stuff. I'll see how it works.

Right, just as Semper Fi was focused on the Pacific War :) Still, the new wargoals system has potential and we will see how it will work in practice.

Are they going to apply the V2 wargoals system to HOI? That'll be interesting, and welcome, if so.

thank goodness for a new update. I was starting to worry, but it was really worth the wait.

Thanks, Misterbean! I haven't quite gotten into a rhythm with my updates for 4 simultaneous AARs yet. I'm still updating Siam more often, but this new one threw a wrench into my old 3-AAR system, and so there have been delays. I also have been busy this week. But I'll keep up with it. I have been playing the game this week, and having fun with it -- rising tensions!

Interesting stuff. By building medium armour you've effectively withdrawn from the Versailles limitations, but Germany's refusal to intervene in Austria must be worth something in the eyes of the western allies.

How will Italy's actions affect your attitude towards them? If they start interfering in Greece you'll have an international crisis on your hands.

You'll see me be very wary of any country that's liable to get into war. So I'm standing back from Italy for the time being.

Don't think so either, the timeframe of the game is too short and you since diplomacy isn't exactly that much part of the game yet...

Welcome, Baltasar! I responded to you individually, earlier, but wanted to say hi.

There's no hidden factor to increase Neutrality nor to decrease Threat over time. There are Strategic Effects ("Neutrality" in general and the "Monroe Doctrine" for the USA) and ministers (Silent Lawyer and Pig-Headed Isolationist) that effect Neutrality, but there's no modifier to use for threat. (There's a "threat_impact", but that doesn't give or take threat directly either.) Then there are random events to effect it. Plus War Exhaustion increases Neutrality, but that is only present at war of course.

I'm not so sure about this. As a for instance, I had Yugoslavia within 2 points -- 27.4 neutrality vs. threat of being able to join the Axis, and now they've backed off to 33 points. The threat didn't decrease, so I must conclude their neutrality increased, though I won't be able to prove that until I go back over my screenshots. I'll point it out in the AAR when I get there.

Hey, thanks everybody for your readership and comments! I'm expecting to do another update this week, hopefully before the weekend, but no guarantees. Weird week, schedulewise. Next update will be for Siam, and then comes Imperio Novo, then this. Hopefully all three before the weekend is up.

Rensslaer
 

misterbean

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quick off-topic question: is there an AAR that I can read to decide whether to buy Vic or not? and if so, which version would the experts recommend?

okay, those where two questions :D
 

Slan

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It is entirely possible that Yugoslavia's Neutrality increased. For example, they could have gotten a random event or two.

As for the effect of cores on threat, switching to the new version would invalidate your save since that uses a completely new map. (Alright, not completely, but still.) On the other hand, I could easily provide you with a personal fix for that particular problem :)
 

Rensslaer

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During the period mid-1938 to mid-1939 my research accomplished such things as medium tank advances, heavy tank brigades, submarine and cruiser improvements and training, etc. Our higher-tech initiatives advanced, too, with research into strategic rockets beginning, after initial success in creating useful engines.

Nanking.jpg


Remember those 2-brigade medium tank divisions we were building? Now we begin to build single-brigade self-propelled artillery to accompany them (I'll combine them later).

In China, the Japanese commit horrible atrocities which are reported by the worldwide news. The USA embargoes Japan -- Germany is proud to have issued such an embargo on lesser provocations. The Japanese set up a puppet government in Nanjing (HPP represents this government as a separate country, and as Japan takes territory from Nationalist China, they "cede" the land to this new government).

Partly because of our coal storage problems... Which very quickly also stack up (no pun intended) next to metal storage problems and oil storage problems (the penalties start applying after you hit 50,000 units, which means "hoarders" like me get hit alot!)... I push ahead-of-time research for improving efficiency for home production of coal and metal.

RadarFrance.jpg


In unsettling news... Poland seems to have become concerned enough about the USSR (noteworthily so, it's NOT US! :D) that they mobilize their army. Hmm... I'm wondering if they might have jumped the gun on this, but who knows, really? I start prioritizing more of my combat units and aircraft, etc. so that I might have more ready just in case. In fact, I start to get really nervous! :) Have we waited too late to build a large army? I start surveying my forces, seeing holes that I hadn't noticed before (perhaps even holes that don't really exist!).

Of course, I continue upgrading my Radar capacities. I have two stations, one in East Prussia, and another in Saarbrucken where they can keep an eye on the French (potential enemies, still).

The increasing amounts of intelligence I'm getting are interesting. I have a before and after shot above -- before I upgraded, and then my new intel capacity after, reaching all the way to the English Channel. Nice.

RadarSoviet.jpg


My main radar/intel station at Lyck, East Prussia, is growing into a massive system. It has to be in order to see beyond Poland (who is NOT my enemy) into the USSR (who is!). I have a reasonably good eyeball on their frontier forces, but I'll boost the power of this station gradually until I can see even more.

We begin researching Heavy Fighters, otherwise known as fighter-bombers or duel-role (multi-purpose) fighters. This is a big deal because the interceptor fighters just aren't quite worth what I pay for them comparatively.

Poland, in late 1938, is making good progress in building an alliance structure just like the one I've been wanting to create. I'd just as soon they do it, as it has basically the same effect.

NatChina.jpg


Nationalist China is really taking it on the chin, now. By coicidence, they ask if they can join the Axis. I don't tell them no. I just ignore them. Persistently.

About this time, we get hints from the Soviets that they might want to collaborate with us on a project related to Poland. Obviously, the Poles are aware of their interest, but the Soviets are not aware of our particular bent on this subject. The event involves conditions (capture of Prague) which do not (won't) exist, and would also lower Allied neutrality, so we ignore the option. No Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact.

Molotov.jpg


We're getting those Oil Storage problems now, but we're pushing through them to try to continually increase those stockpiles. We're flush with money, and we're using it to continue stockpiling despite the obstacles.

Although Germany certainly desires a peaceful relationship with the Allies, we are not blind to the possibility of eventual war, and so we're preparing by building a coastal watch radar station at Wilhelmshaven, increasing anti-aircraft capabilities there, and continuing to research more effective AA technology. We've been gradually building up AA capabilities around all of our major cities, especially in the east, where we expect the Soviets may try to use their massive strategic bombers to injure our factories.

Wilhelmshaven.jpg


We're also able to begin building Airborne Infantry, now, which will come in handy in the future (not right away).

Here's a look at our whole production schedule right now:

ProductionApr1939.jpg


Not shown are several nearly-complete ships, airwings, or armor/infantry units which I don't want to complete and deploy yet because of the Threat they would generate. They're like my "production reserve" -- I can deploy them if I get into a war (this, obviously, is a little bit of an exploit, which maybe they'll fix in future versions).

Our radar advances yet again! So does our reach from Lyck, East Prussia. The Assault Weapons are something interesting to note -- HPP has separated out certain key techs like this so that you can advance many different unit types with the same research.

RadarAssault.jpg


Our efforts to build a Diplomatic coalition against all enemies, but particularly and most obviously against Russia, continues. We feel like we're very close to gettting Hungary to join in (they're already allied to Poland). It's July 1939.

Alignment.jpg


You can see the spread of other countries moving into the Axis sphere too -- Bulgaria, Lithuania, Portugal, Yugoslavia are closest. Latvia, Rumania, Greece, Poland and the Netherlands are further out but still steadily moving our way. Does it help that we're not hostile and increasing our Threat toward them? Possibly, though I've seen similar spreads in normal games.

Our tech advances help us with our Industry, and our nuclear research is moving right along. We begin to acquire a "nuclear pile" for a reactor. We also begin building a third radar/intel receiving station at Oppeln, south of East Prussia (the next-nearest German land to the USSR).

ChinaJuly39.jpg


China is not doing well against Japan. The ghost is almost given up. We lose our access to Chinese ores. It may be because all but one of their ports is now occupied by the enemy, but I surmise it is actually because the mines are located in the interior, and now the Japanese have split the Chinese interior from the coast and these supplies cannot navigate through Guangxi territory. The Chinese are still trying to join the Axis. This is a terribly cynical, unsympathetic perspective, but in the world or realpolitik we wonder, won't they just go away?

Our wide range of intelligence on the USSR is yielding impressive results. We have 10 spies active in Russia, all of them working to increase the Soviet threat to their (our) neighbors, thus pushing them into our camp. But those spies also gather information about other things, as do our radar/intel stations.

SovietIntel.jpg


Besides now having a picture of their deployments all along the border, we also notice that they have medium bombers staged along the border, they still rely in places upon cavalry, but they're starting to also deploy light tanks. There may be other armored units -- surely are -- which we don't know about.

Germany really hasn't deployed any armored divisions yet. Maybe one or two. The rest are waiting in production, though some of them are in that "production reserve."

For now, Germany, and Europe as a whole, remains at peace. It's August, 1939.
 

Stuyvesant

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Clearly, you're planning for a war with the Soviet Union (I'm not saying you want to invade, but you're clearly preparing for the possibility of conflict with them). Given your tech-heavy, force-light buildup, when would you expect to be ready for such a conflict, if it comes your way?
 

TheBromgrev

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Lots of economic buildup, but what does your Wehrmacht look like? Could we get a screenshot next update?

About the loss of rares from China. I'm assuming their capital was moved to Chongqing, and since it was cut off from the ports, the "no convoy" flag was set. You'll lose the effect if China has no ports, no convoys (what I think happened here), or you recognized Manchukuo. China will also lose its officer recruitment bonus, which will only make the situation worse for them. Japan's doing unusually well in your game, although what I see in that 2nd to last screenshot is a good thing. I don't like how that war works in vanilla, where it's decided in the first year. I'd rather see a stalemate or very slow progress, like what you've shown.

Any luck getting Poland into your corner, or do they keep getting pushed away due to cores? If they keep getting pushed away, I can send you a hotfix to stop the problem, as the cores were added by a sub-mod I didn't thoroughly check :rolleyes:. When the Soviets inevitably attack Poland, you'll either need to be allied with them or have them in the Axis in order for the supply system to work correctly. I have no clue when the Soviets will actually attack though, but the only time I've seen them do so was in 1942. They're scripted to attack Poland, but only when the AI thinks it's ready, so the timing can be pretty random.
 

EnDSchultz

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but I -think- that projects left in the production queue for too long without IC allocated to them will start to depreciate. If that's the case it's not too exploit-y to leave "reserve" units in your production queue.
 

loki100

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what I really like about this, apart from your usual careful explanations as to what you're doing and why, is a feeling of tension. Combination of the HPP mod (that I keep on eyeing up but never actually use) & your unusual strategy leaves a really nice feeling of not knowing how its all going to work out ... unlike a typical German start up where the only differences are around particular force combinations and research priorities.
 

Dewirix

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From an in-world perspective, building, but not deploying units should certainly carry a much-reduced threat impact. It's not much of an immediate threat because you'd have to deploy them and wait for them to organise before you can do anything.

The fact that Poland's started to mobilise in fear of Soviet intentions should also leave you with slightly more breathing space when it comes to international doubt as to your intentions.

I have to say that from your production schedule it certainly looks like you're not planning on a shooting war in the next year or two. You must have a fairly high construction practical by now though.
 

Cybvep

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The Soviets will attack you sooner or later, so preparing your defences is a good strategy. And when they attack and Poland is NOT in the Axis, then you should manually add it in.

I quickly got annoyed by forces in East Prussia being out-of-supply, lack of control over infra/airbases buildup, Polish embargo (which doesn't make sense in that context) and all that Soviet territory in Polish control (you don't have control over occupation policies, either). Moreover, sometimes retreating is impossible because Polish territory is considered to be "foreign". It can be extremely annoying.
 

Stuyvesant

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August 39 and peace?
Something is so terribly wrong!

Tsk, tsk, getting a little sloppy with your dates there. ;) In the last screenshot, Germany still has a whopping 27 days to go to war by the historical time table. I know that won't happen, but you're still jumping the gun a little here. :)
 

Tallfellow

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Hmmm, i'm looking forward to seeing what happens if the USSR attacks Poland, if the Allies will attack, or just sit back and at watch it happen.