Zij is correct, it is a vanilla bug up and down. Also, they still haven't completely fixed everything surrounding the whacked out seduction mess, because you still see children getting the "the unchaste" nickname from time to time.
'Known Murderer' trait bug?
- Thread starter mlsmith45
- Start date
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Zij is correct, it is a vanilla bug up and down. Also, they still haven't completely fixed everything surrounding the whacked out seduction mess, because you still see children getting the "the unchaste" nickname from time to time.
Yeah I have seen the 'unchaste' bug as well...Ok thanks for the info guys. Back to politely nagging the devs about this issue then... :/
The devs probably aren't going to do anything without a concrete report in the Bug Reports forum, which AFAIK no one has posted. This is fairly reasonable because I'm sure they have loads of bugs in their to-do list already, but unfortunately I'm not sure what can be said about reproducing it besides "er, play the game for a while."
Problem is they'll only accept a vanilla save, and I will never play the vanilla map. It's horrifying.
I might take one for the team and endure a few hours of the vanilla map this weekend so I can log the bug...wish me luck.
.png){kind=avatar}
It's OK. I fix vanilla bugs all the time in EMF/PB. I just prefer to give the devs a chance at fixing them first so that EMF doesn't end-up unnecessarily overriding a bunch of files with a different fix to the observed issue than one vanilla may add in the future. Barring something truly demonic going-on, there will be no 'known murderer modifier' bug for you guys by the time that I release the next version of EMF (and the EMF beta is also very accessible in terms of seeing what's incrementally being added and installing it cleanly-- see the EMF thread for details). I just didn't expect this blatant bug to still be around by now, so I'd bet on Paradox handling it.
The 'known murderer' bug seems like it may be easy enough to chase down (my clues are that there's a character modifier localised as "Known Murder" that gives -10 general_opinion, and I'll trace back from there). The 'the Unchaste' bug is less well-defined for me. I know that this nickname is given by event when caught cuckolding someone. I'm quite confused as to how a baby could receive it. Those events would have to be _very_ confused.
The 'known murderer' bug seems like it may be easy enough to chase down (my clues are that there's a character modifier localised as "Known Murder" that gives -10 general_opinion, and I'll trace back from there). The 'the Unchaste' bug is less well-defined for me. I know that this nickname is given by event when caught cuckolding someone. I'm quite confused as to how a baby could receive it. Those events would have to be _very_ confused.
If you figure out where it's coming from and how to stop it, please post how to do so in the Bug Reports forum. Based on the dev comments in the latest patch thread about exactly this bug, none of the devs were aware of it, and they are working from a queue maintained by the QA team, while the QA team gets them from the reports. So yeah, if there's nothing about it in the Bug Reports, there's a slim chance it's ever going to get fixed in vanilla because the devs will just always be working on other bugs instead.
(I've been trying to figure out how it happens, but no success. It pretty much has to be from somewhere that calls event 10, since that seems to be the only place the known_murder modifier ever gets applied in vanilla, but...)
(I've been trying to figure out how it happens, but no success. It pretty much has to be from somewhere that calls event 10, since that seems to be the only place the known_murder modifier ever gets applied in vanilla, but...)
Thanks for this thread. You have vindicated my 5 yr old heir. I died young and blamed him, and have been haunting him a la Hamlet ever since. Now my soul can rest. Cheers.
It's not a trait. It's a character modifier. There is no command.
OK, so I've done some cursory testing to try to reproduce this issue. After investigating all the places that call the event (id = 10) that applies known_murderer and cross-referencing the differences in those which HIP overrides (only 1), I can't see a reasonable cause. However, it occurred to me that I've only technically seen this bug in HIP installs with VIET Events enabled. I've not seen it otherwise.
Thus, I installed HIP w/ no VIET Events and ran an observe for about 20 years. Manual inspection of rulers and their families (incl. children) hasn't revealed a single 'Known Murderer' modifier on any character.
Can somebody please try a HIP game without VIET Events installed (everything else default) and let me know whether they run into the 'Known Murderer' bug?
My theory is that something might be malformatted or typoed in the VIET Events 00_on_actions.txt. The ID '10' would be very easy to screw up like this in this type of file, which uses tons of '10 = <some other id>' style statements, where the 10 in that example is supposed to specify the random weight. However, a missing '=' or something of that matter might make the engine randomly call event 10 on characters, leading to this bug.
A little testing help would be appreciated, as it's time-consuming waiting for this bug to happen and locating it. But, hey, my quick test run w/o VIET Events seemed fine.
Thus, I installed HIP w/ no VIET Events and ran an observe for about 20 years. Manual inspection of rulers and their families (incl. children) hasn't revealed a single 'Known Murderer' modifier on any character.
Can somebody please try a HIP game without VIET Events installed (everything else default) and let me know whether they run into the 'Known Murderer' bug?
My theory is that something might be malformatted or typoed in the VIET Events 00_on_actions.txt. The ID '10' would be very easy to screw up like this in this type of file, which uses tons of '10 = <some other id>' style statements, where the 10 in that example is supposed to specify the random weight. However, a missing '=' or something of that matter might make the engine randomly call event 10 on characters, leading to this bug.
A little testing help would be appreciated, as it's time-consuming waiting for this bug to happen and locating it. But, hey, my quick test run w/o VIET Events seemed fine.
For what it's worth, I recently experienced this bug in a vanilla MP game. My brother had a child who was suddenly sporting Known Murderer for seemingly no reason.
Oh, phew. Well, then, we're fucked and stuff, because there's about 40 independent call sites [of the event which applies the modifier] for which to code-review the full event chains.
I'll probably use the new 'log' effect to debug this then (since we know it's vanilla, the search space for the bug is much larger). Simply log every single point-of-invocation of event 10 with a unique ID to identify the call site and the character ID that's about to have a known_murderer slapped on them. Then, in event 10, log every single time a child is given known_murderer. Run observe for 30+ years. Scan game.log for the first point at which a child was made a known_murderer (since we know these cases are definitely bogus, though obviously the bug might not be about children per se). Directly preceding that log entry should be the identifying information for the event chain call site that caused it.
EDIT: I've created a minimod that's instrumented with said logging and am plugging it into CK2 w/ HIP for an observe game to collect data now.
EDIT: I've created a minimod that's instrumented with said logging and am plugging it into CK2 w/ HIP for an observe game to collect data now.
Last edited:
Hmm, 50 years still and no children in the entire game that have been branded as known murderers. [Not just manual, random inspection of characters; there are literally no children in the game which have the modifier.] This is EMF+SWMH without VIET Events on observe mode.
EDIT: And past 80 years and the same... It seems like this either doesn't occur when in observe mode (which is preposterous...) or doesn't occur w/o VIET Events currently.
EDIT: And past 80 years and the same... It seems like this either doesn't occur when in observe mode (which is preposterous...) or doesn't occur w/o VIET Events currently.
Last edited:
Hi,
I and my half-brother started with this modifier... In the latest patch, not earlier one.
Rgds, Oldtimer
Made it past 110 years w/ EMF+SWMH and _no_ VIET Events and _not a single_ character under the age of 16 that had the known_murderer character modifier ever having existed in those 110 years of the game. So...
EDIT: And I manually played the last 10 years just to ensure it wasn't the fact that it was an observe game that was stopping the bug from appearing.
EDIT2: Now installing HIP w/ VIET Events enabled and going to perform the same test.
EDIT: And I manually played the last 10 years just to ensure it wasn't the fact that it was an observe game that was stopping the bug from appearing.
EDIT2: Now installing HIP w/ VIET Events enabled and going to perform the same test.