Kingdom of Jerusalem (KoJ)..

[Windspear]

So do you have to be a Christian to establish KoJ?

Because I am playing as Abbasid and I have completed all the requirements to establish it but I can't, the requirement tooltip shows red 'X' again 'Must be a Christian' but it seems kind of strange to have that requirement......so that's why I am asking , may be if there is a way around this....

 

[Thure]

Why would it be strange? Otherwise the Muslims would form the Kingdom every game. And a Muslim Kingdom of Jerusalem would be strange.

 

[Lingvort]

So do you have to be a Christian to establish KoJ?

Because I am playing as Abbasid and I have completed all the requirements to establish it but I can't, the requirement tooltip shows red 'X' again 'Must be a Christian' but it seems kind of strange to have that requirement......so that's why I am asking , may be if there is a way around this....

How so? Kingdom of Jerusalem was a Christian state, established by Christian rulers. Its very idea is Christian in origin. Why should it be createable by anyone else?

 

[Ilion]

So do you have to be a Christian to establish KoJ?

Because I am playing as Abbasid and I have completed all the requirements to establish it but I can't, the requirement tooltip shows red 'X' again 'Must be a Christian' but it seems kind of strange to have that requirement......so that's why I am asking , may be if there is a way around this....

Under the right circumstances, Jewish characters can also create the KoJ title. But, yeah, a Moslem (mucj less a pagan) creating the KoJ doesn't make sense. It would be like a Christian creating the Caliphate. I think the game's AI would explode: *that*does*not*compute*

 

[Windspear]

But allowing only Christians to do it doesn't make sense, since I can form European/English duchies and empires with my Hindu Raja character.......

Why is Jerusalem restricted , I control everything else in that region so I should be able to organise that region under a single kingdom..........

Btw I am playing Hindu character........

EDIT: just formed Kingdom of Mesepotemia (or however its spelled) as Hindu, I know it for a fact that no Hindu Rajhistani Raja ever set foot in Mesepotemia with his Armies but I just formed it, so why KoJ is an exception?

(To me it seems like you'all got something against Muslim Jerusalem )

 

[Ultima_Ratio]

It wouldn't be a "Muslim/whatever Kingdom of Jerusalem", it would be the "*Dynasty name* Sultanate" to fill a de jure kingdom in the area. It's fine being restricted for the AI but I don't see why a player shouldn't be able to form it just like a player can form all the other AI-restricted titles.

 

[Thure]

It wouldn't be a "Muslim/whatever Kingdom of Jerusalem", it would be the "*Dynasty name* Sultanate" to fill a de jure kingdom in the area. It's fine being restricted for the AI but I don't see why a player shouldn't be able to form it just like a player can form all the other AI-restricted titles.

Eh... No. Dynastic Sultante has nothing to do with religion but with culture. It would be way to easy to form for the Muslims in nearly all start dates.

 

[Caspoi]

On a related subject shouldn't the kingdom of Israel replace the Kingdom of Jerusalem's de jure lands if you create it?

 

[Ultima_Ratio]

Eh... No. Dynastic Sultante has nothing to do with religion but with culture. It would be way to easy to form for the Muslims in nearly all start dates.

That wasn't the point. The point is that you're too hung up on the idea of a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem to notice that it is a de jure kingdom that other religions can't form. Why wouldn't a Muslim player in the area (or a Hindu player who wants to delegate it to a vassal king) want to create the kingdom?

 

[similan]

That wasn't the point. The point is that you're too hung up on the idea of a Christian Kingdom of Jerusalem to notice that it is a de jure kingdom that other religions can't form. Why wouldn't a Muslim player in the area (or a Hindu player who wants to delegate it to a vassal king) want to create the kingdom?

Why would you create a kingdom of a city with no importance to your religion? You don't. If you want a kingdom of Jerusalem change the name of Syria to Jerusalem.

 

[Keizer Harm]

Why would you create a kingdom of a city with no importance to your religion? You don't. If you want a kingdom of Jerusalem change the name of Syria to Jerusalem.

Someone would want a kingdom that covers those four duchies. You cannot have a vassal king of Syria which controls the de jure Jerusalem area, because you cannot transfer dukes to kings that aren't their de jure liege.

There should be a non-Christian non-Jewish generic name for the area, just to fill the de jure gap. Kingdom of the Levant?

 

[Thure]

There should be a non-Christian non-Jewish generic name for the area, just to fill the de jure gap. Kingdom of the Levant?

Palestine?

 

[Keizer Harm]

Palestine?

That actually would be a very valid name. It has been around since the Romans, and used for that exact region. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_(region)

 

[Thure]

That actually would be a very valid name. It has been around since the Romans, and used for that exact region. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_(region)

The Muslims used this name during the Middle Ages too for this region.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jund_Filastin

 

[similan]

Someone would want a kingdom that covers those four duchies. You cannot have a vassal king of Syria which controls the de jure Jerusalem area, because you cannot transfer dukes to kings that aren't their de jure liege.

There should be a non-Christian non-Jewish generic name for the area, just to fill the de jure gap. Kingdom of the Levant?

You do make a point there.

 

[RenevB]

There used to be cultural and/or religous requirements for the creation of most if not all kingdoms and empires. They still exist for AI rulers. This religious requirement for Jerusalem and the cultural requirements for Hungary are the most restrictive that still apply to players.

 

[Windspear]

Someone would want a kingdom that covers those four duchies. You cannot have a vassal king of Syria which controls the de jure Jerusalem area, because you cannot transfer dukes to kings that aren't their de jure liege.

There should be a non-Christian non-Jewish generic name for the area, just to fill the de jure gap. Kingdom of the Levant?

Exactly one of the reasons why I created this topic.............also if I am able to create European Kingdoms and Duchy titles as a Hindu Raja , then it makes no sense for KoJ to be restricted to Christians, specially when I control everything around it............ let other religions also organise the counties and duchies in the area under a specific title, the name of the title doesn't have to be KoJ it could be Sultanate of Palestine or whatever, but at least other religions should be able to form a collective title for that area......

 

[similan]

Exactly one of the reasons why I created this topic.............also if I am able to create European Kingdoms and Duchy titles as a Hindu Raja , then it makes no sense for KoJ to be restricted to Christians, specially when I control everything around it............ let other religions also organise the counties and duchies in the area under a specific title, the name of the title doesn't have to be KoJ it could be Sultanate of Palestine or whatever, but at least other religions should be able to form a collective title for that area......

It has to do with the prestige you get from creating the title and the previous versions of Ck 2. KoJ is also restricted because it is a religious title. Same as the caliphate titles, same as India.

 

[Caspoi]

There used to be cultural and/or religous requirements for the creation of most if not all kingdoms and empires. They still exist for AI rulers. This religious requirement for Jerusalem and the cultural requirements for Hungary are the most restrictive that still apply to players.

Don't forget the kingdom of Saxony.

 

[Keizer Harm]

It has to do with the prestige you get from creating the title and the previous versions of Ck 2. KoJ is also restricted because it is a religious title. Same as the caliphate titles, same as India.

Kingdom of Jerusalem is different from those two because it is landed.