The fact that he isn't part of the Empire and isn't eligible for the title.
In order for the Kingdom of Germany to exist, that territory has to have left the Empire by conquest or rebellion.
'King of Germany' or 'King of the Romans'?
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The fact that he isn't part of the Empire and isn't eligible for the title.
In order for the Kingdom of Germany to exist, that territory has to have left the Empire by conquest or rebellion.
Nothing really like there is nothing to prevent any king to be elected. Why should there be when even Bohemian kings were Emperors in one point in history.
Well thats not true. You don't need to be part of the empire to be elected to be the emperor. You can be totally independent as long as you have a duke tittle in the empire as then you can vote and nominate people to be the emperor.
I have never seen the title created but I'm pretty sure that the German king can be elected Emperor and that the title can be created without rebellion.
Then we should fix the a-historical Byzantine Empire while we're at it. Also the Latin Empire if that's renamed incorrectly too.
Honestly, are you asking for the Kingdom of Germany to be renamed to the Kingdom of the Romans? That's what it sounds like. Whilst rex germanicum isn't used until much later (I forgot to write down the first appearance when told it since I thought it was trivial), contemporary sources refer to Germany, and to the king's "reign in germany", example
"These acts took place in the year from the Incarnation of the Lord 1220, ninth of the indiction, in the reign of the lord Frederick II, most glorious King of the Romans and of Sicily, in the eighth year of his reign in Germany, twenty-third in Sicily."
Or do you just want the title to be "King of the Romans" yet keep Kingdom of Germany on the map?
EDIT: Coincidentally I'd like to know if someone other than the King of Germany can hold the HRE title, e.g. Berengar I (of Italy) in 915. Ugh that's strange, did that grant him sovereignty over Germany? Just goes to show the title itself was nothing but a special badge to wear...
Honestly, are you asking for the Kingdom of Germany to be renamed to the Kingdom of the Romans? That's what it sounds like. Whilst rex germanicum isn't used until much later (I forgot to write down the first appearance when told it since I thought it was trivial), contemporary sources refer to Germany, and to the king's "reign in germany", example
"These acts took place in the year from the Incarnation of the Lord 1220, ninth of the indiction, in the reign of the lord Frederick II, most glorious King of the Romans and of Sicily, in the eighth year of his reign in Germany, twenty-third in Sicily."
Or do you just want the title to be "King of the Romans" yet keep Kingdom of Germany on the map?
EDIT: Coincidentally I'd like to know if someone other than the King of Germany can hold the HRE title, e.g. Berengar I (of Italy) in 915. Ugh that's strange, did that grant him sovereignty over Germany? Just goes to show the title itself was nothing but a special badge to wear...
King of Germany is a totally separate title from the Imperial title. It does not exist at game-start, and the game is specifically designed so that it can only be created under certain extreme circumstances. None of these circumstances allow an Emperor to create the title.
Someone who isn't Emperor has to own 50% of Germany. This can only happen if a) the Empire totally collapses and some foreigner takes control of half of it, or b) an enterprising Duke from outside the Imperial dynasty manages to gain most of the Duke-titles. Presumably a) could only happen if the Muslims did incredibly well, because there's no way France can vassalize half of Germany within game-mechanics, and b) would be the next to last-step before the new King of Germany usurped the Imperial title proper and ended the old dynasty.
In other words CK2's "Kingdom of Germany" should probably not be compared to anything that actually existed historically, because nothing that actually existed historically compares to it.
Nick
I assume that's directed at me? I read the entire thread, thanks.
I was trying to make the distinction between the King of Germany and the Emperor, Nick. If the Germans elected someone as their King, but the Pope bequeaths the Imperial title to somebody else, what happens?
From the sounds of it the game treats the King of Germany and the HRE as the same thing, which I suppose by convention is correct but there are still distinctions.
Maybe I'm just incorrect in seeing the Emperor title as separate to the Kingdoms of Germany, Burgundy, Italy and Sicily.
Let me repeat:
There is no King of Germany.
The title can only be created by somebody who owns 50% of Germany's provinces who is not an Emperor. In game terms this means that the Muslims are more likely to conquer Paris then anyone receive the title "King of Germany."
The nobles of Germany cannot elect a King of Germany. The Pope has nothing to do with who becomes Emperor in-game.
What will happen is simple. Historical Emperor/Kings of the HRE/Germany will only be Emperors. There will be no Kings at all in Germany. The Imperial title is only different from France, England, or the Duchy of York because it's higher tier. It's only different from the Byzantines because it's on a different bit of the map.
Nick
There is no King of Germany.
The title can only be created by somebody who owns 50% of Germany's provinces who is not an Emperor. In game terms this means that the Muslims are more likely to conquer Paris then anyone receive the title "King of Germany."
The nobles of Germany cannot elect a King of Germany. The Pope has nothing to do with who becomes Emperor in-game.
What will happen is simple. Historical Emperor/Kings of the HRE/Germany will only be Emperors. There will be no Kings at all in Germany. The Imperial title is only different from France, England, or the Duchy of York because it's higher tier. It's only different from the Byzantines because it's on a different bit of the map.
Nick
