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Bismarck1899

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Hi,
could you name a few pro and cons in HIP when it comes to nomads.
I want to become a jewish superpower. Would it be more effective to be feudal to convert the steppes ?
Anything I need to know about the nomad feudal transformation ?
 

zijistark

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Hi,
could you name a few pro and cons in HIP when it comes to nomads.
I want to become a jewish superpower. Would it be more effective to be feudal to convert the steppes ?
Anything I need to know about the nomad feudal transformation ?
Uh, hmm. Pretty open-ended question there.

I will say that EMF has much-improved-over-vanilla settlement mechanics for nomads. It minimizes border gore due to nomadic settlement, settles your people in provinces in a very plausible and organic way clustered around your new capital, tries to ensure that you won't have to deal with the titular empire titles that settlement normally generates in vanilla (de jure king titles instead usually), etc.

Nomads + Khazaria as a Jew would be very effective in 867 (only start on EMF+SWMH in which Khazaria existed) for making significant conquests-- and as long as your clans like you, they should follow your religion for the most part. However, for actual long-term *provincial conversion* to Judaism, you'd probably eventually want to settle somewhere nice and rich (I suggest the fabled Queen of Cities just to the West beyond the Black Sea) and become a non-nomad, because you can't do stuff like 'Demand Religious Conversion' as a nomad-- it's live and let live.
 
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StarlightTW

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Just...conquer. Invade. Pillage. Maybe do a bit of plundering on the side. If you're starting as Khazaria, I'd work my way down through the Caucasus mountains, especially along the Caspian Sea coast, and wait for moments of weakness to invade Mesopotamia and the Levant. From there it's pretty easy to invade into Egypt. Just be wary of the Byzantines at your back as with this route you'd be caught between the Empire and the Caliphate. But don't take too long, or you could be facing a resurgent power in either one of them. Or the Turks.
 
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Bismarck1899

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Just...conquer. Invade. Pillage. Maybe do a bit of plundering on the side. If you're starting as Khazaria, I'd work my way down through the Caucasus mountains, especially along the Caspian Sea coast, and wait for moments of weakness to invade Mesopotamia and the Levant. From there it's pretty easy to invade into Egypt. Just be wary of the Byzantines at your back as with this route you'd be caught between the Empire and the Caliphate. But don't take too long, or you could be facing a resurgent power in either one of them. Or the Turks.

I'm going to try :)
 

Ecnahc

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I#m so confused by all the nomad mechanics.
Could somebody give me a few pointers how nomads work ?
Gain land, and distribute it in a way they keeps the clans happy. Most of the time the goal is to go feudal, but if staying nomadic could be interesting. Basically, you just raze and destroy every province you take, leaving nothing but grassland and the endless sky. The mechanics behind it, well nomads really seem to have a few positives. First, they can create large armies, and call upon more troops when at war I believe. You can hold many provinces, and have few vassals. Arguably the best tool at their disposal is the various CBs given, always them to attack anyone. As well as the ability to raze provinces for loot like I previously said. Don't forget you can loot when you aren't at war. Just finished a war with someone, and have a truce? Doesn't stop you from being able to loot border provinces. Or you can loot provinces before declaring war, denying levies from the looted provinces. I believe you can raze temples while looting as well.

Nomads are very basic. Loot, Pillage, Raze, Repeat. The clan dynamic might be the only confusing thing. Basically, you can have so many clans, the number changing depending on how much land you own. If you go over the clan limit, you need to attack one of them and assimilate the lands. If you have too few, you need to give away some of your land and form a new clan. each clan will want the same amount of counties as the others, and you, have. So make sure you distribute your land properly, and stay at your clan limit.
 

Ecnahc

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How would I actually conquer for example Egypt or Palastine as nomads ?? Never played as a nomadic state.
Well you would need to conquer the territories between you and Palestine. You can always give independence to your other lands, and have a kind of artificial migration as you move towards them. You won't be able to just attack Palestine. Your country will have to be near it, or close enough where you can produce a claim on a county in it. It would be interesting to be a Jewish ERE, and have the Imperial Reconquest CBs, which would allow you to get to Jerusalem much faster.

There is no specific CB for a Jewish nation to conquer the Holy Land, while being across the sea. It would be interesting to give them one, as becoming Jewish is hard enough for you to do in HIP. You are really stuck with Khazaria as they are the only country that will be Jewish from the start. One could argue that if the Christians have Crusades, and the Muslims Jihads, the Jews should be able to get a CB for Jerusalem. It isn't really historical though as that never happened, and doesn't fit into HIP.
 
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Bismarck1899

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Well you would need to conquer the territories between you and Palestine. You can always give independence to your other lands, and have a kind of artificial migration as you move towards them. You won't be able to just attack Palestine. Your country will have to be near it, or close enough where you can produce a claim on a county in it. It would be interesting to be a Jewish ERE, and have the Imperial Reconquest CBs, which would allow you to get to Jerusalem much faster.

There is no specific CB for a Jewish nation to conquer the Holy Land, while being across the sea. It would be interesting to give them one, as becoming Jewish is hard enough for you to do in HIP. You are really stuck with Khazaria as they are the only country that will be Jewish from the start. One could argue that if the Christians have Crusades, and the Muslims Jihads, the Jews should be able to get a CB for Jerusalem. It isn't really historical though as that never happened, and doesn't fit into HIP.
First of all, thanks for your help. Much appreciated !
How would this migration work. Right now I cannot use the Invasion cbs because I need a clan (my clan) population of 30000 for that. So it is one county after another and do I really need to destroy/raze everything in my path to the holy land ? Can I have as much feudal vassals as I want ?
Yeah and I'm raiding as much as I can. especially the ERE because it hurts them like crazy sending their levies up there all the time :cool:
I also think that it is very ironic that the nomads, people who don't need/ build cities castles have the most fleshed out building system while the feudal states have the simplest one... :mad:
And why do I lose all the provinces that are owned by the other clans even if they have cities or temples in their demesne when I become tribal/feudal?
 
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Ecnahc

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And why do I lose all the provinces that are owned by the other clans even if they have cities or temples in their demesne when I become tribal/feudal?
That sounds like a bug. You should lose provinces when you go feudal. I don't believe it is WAD at least. By migration, I just meant giving the provinces you want to "migrate" out of independence. Instead of dealing with all of that land, and presumably hitting a vassal limit, create friendly states as you move towards the Holy Land. They can continue to attempt conversions on their own.

It is one county after another, and you do have to raze everything in provinces you own, if you are tribal. You are allowed Feudal Vassals however. Going Feudal yourself wouldn't make getting to the Holy Land easier, because of fewer CBs, but it would allow forced conversion like Zijistark said. Another reason for granting provinces independence, the opinion malus for being Jewish. Keeping conquered vassals in line will be very hard without converting them, in cases where you cannot install your own people. Just keeping building up your capital until you reach that population limit. I believe you can move the capital more than once. If not, you should still move it closer as you progress. I might start up a Nomad game and see what I can do.
 

IoannesBarbarus

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When you go feudal, it’s just your clan making that decision. The other clans aren’t going to give up their feudal land.