Kharijism isn't a heresy of Ibaditism!

[Ollum]

The Kharijism in Islam is a concept similar to the concept of Catholicism in Christianity, not heresy (Catholicism is branch of Christianity, Roman Catholicism is the branch of Catholicism and Kharijism is the branch of Islam, Ibaditism is the branch of Kharijism). Ibaditism is only a branch of Kharijitism. Why Kharijitism is presented in game as heresy of Ibaditism?

 

[WJS]

As you said, Ibadism is a branch of Kharijism. Now, unless Kharijism and Ibadism get along, then treating one as the heresy of the other makes sense.

But which is the heresy? It's whichever faith is in the minority. As the historical default, there are more Ibadi lands than Kharijite lands, so Kharijism is the heresy of Ibadism. However, if you simply invest in Kharijism a bit, it's easy to end up with more Kharijite lands than Ibadi lands, and suddenly Ibadism becomes the heresy of Kharijism. Kharijism gets the green crescent and Ibadism the red one, all that.

So feel free to prove to the world that Kharijism is the correct faith. You've got that chance.

 

[Ollum]

 

[Ollum]

I omitted other branches of Islam.

 

[SigurdStormhand]

The Kharijism in Islam is a concept similar to the concept of Catholicism in Christianity, not heresy (Catholicism is branch of Christianity, Roman Catholicism is the branch of Catholicism and Kharijism is the branch of Islam, Ibaditism is the branch of Kharijism). Ibaditism is only a branch of Kharijitism. Why Kharijitism is presented in game as heresy of Ibaditism?

Put simply - CKII's religious system is something of a blunt instrument.

There's no "Roman Catholicism" in CKII, just Catholicism and the concept of a specifically Roman Church that was universal only developed towards the later Middle Ages. In-game Catholicism is part of Nicene Christianity, like Orthodoxy, but the two are split into two branches to stop them fighting (ironically).

With Islam, as you say, there are three main branches early on - by the time of the game-start the Devs are modelling ibadism having become the dominant strand within the branch that also includes Kharijism. A little reading indicates that the two do not get on - the point of divergence apparently being when the Kharijism tried to assassinate Ali.

So it rather looks like one of them needs to be a heresy - the only alternative is to have multiple Kharijite groups as Ibadi heretics, and a look at Wikipedia doesn't seem to justify that - it would be rather like splitting Lollards (Catholic heresy) into Lollards and Wycliffites because they have slightly different cultural contexts.

 

[Karlington]

The Kharijism in Islam is a concept similar to the concept of Catholicism in Christianity, not heresy (Catholicism is branch of Christianity, Roman Catholicism is the branch of Catholicism and Kharijism is the branch of Islam, Ibaditism is the branch of Kharijism). Ibaditism is only a branch of Kharijitism. Why Kharijitism is presented in game as heresy of Ibaditism?

Sure, Ibadism originated from the Khawarij. Hence the Ibadis should be a heresy of Kharijism. However, Ibadis have become more numerous, which switches the heresy status around. The same as with every other religion in the game.

 

[Rubidium]

Note that the same thing can happen with any other religion. Catholicism can become a heresy of Catharism, Miaphysitism can become a heresy of Monophysitism (that one actually happens frequently in certain bookmarks without player intervention), etc, as long as the parent religion becomes less popular than the heresy.

CK2 just treats it as if the switch has already happened, as Ibadism is more common for all start dates.

 

[Arrnea]

Note that the same thing can happen with any other religion. Catholicism can become a heresy of Catharism, Miaphysitism can become a heresy of Monophysitism (that one actually happens frequently in certain bookmarks without player intervention)

Zoroastrianism and Manicheanism is another one that tends to happen in certain bookmarks without player intervention, as are Iconoclasm and Orthodoxy.