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A common mistake i've noticed, is that some people don't take into consideration the infrastructure. The difference of supplies that can pass through a 10 - 20% Infrastructure province to an 90-100% province is stagering.

I agree with Vhorthex and others who argue that aspects of the supply system are being overlooked by players. Huge swings in supply demand may be explained by units trying to replenish their 30 day supply-quickly.

Blitzkrieg advances through "garbage" territory is going to create supply problems. Remember that when a province is occupied, some damage to infrastructure occurs, more if the the province was defended.

I wonder if some folks are using a civ4 style "stack of doom" to conquer territory, and then are surprised when supply problems appear.

I suspect that poor attachment and HQ management may also be responsible. Even rear echelon forces will require structure, and their HQs must be within radio range.

Considering the ease HQs may be created, perhaps garrisons in home and occupied territories require a full command structure. A good position for old guard tools.
 

unmerged(12148)

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i can send you a saved game to see what im talking about, it isn't a stack of doom, i haven't seen japan and the US send 4,000,000 men to some bikini island and just sit on it, so thats already a fix from hoi2 :p However there are just some regions that refuse to get supply, all of my armies have their HQ right behind it, and the theatre HQ on the same continent.
 

nessin

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I was referring specifically to the European theater but I would be interested in what harbors were built in the Pacific that are/would be represented by harbors in HOI3.

Fairfax and Dutch Harbors are two I can think of off-hand that received considerable upgrades during WWII. Dozens of smaller local ports of call for built up overnight on occupied islands to support supply transfers to ground forces (such as those on the Santa Cruz Islands and Guadacanal) which could easily classify as a level 1 (able to support a combat fleet either directly tied to the port or off-shore via supply boats) or more port.

As for the European Theatre it is completely unreasonable to suggest that it wasn't possible for the Allies to construct port facilities in the war, whether they did it or not on a scale that measures against your expectations. The game is designed to allow you to play with history, and "historically" it was possible (and in my mind, done) for the Allies to ship material anywhere they wanted in quantities necessary with the required labor to build a port facility that could support anything up to a carrier battle group directly.
 

menasure

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i can send you a saved game to see what im talking about, it isn't a stack of doom, i haven't seen japan and the US send 4,000,000 men to some bikini island and just sit on it, so thats already a fix from hoi2 :p However there are just some regions that refuse to get supply, all of my armies have their HQ right behind it, and the theatre HQ on the same continent.

amen. then there are also provinces which 'trap' units by letting you in but at the occasional moments when you do get supply they manage to sap a fully suplied unit fast enough so they can't even get out of the province anymore. these points spread like virusses because the supplies are distributed and basically block your whole supply throughput after a while. i'm talking about the middle east and african provinces. it's like a vortex sucking every bit of supply dry in a whole region, which is basically blocking you from playing.

nevertheless i like some realism and this has the potential to be a good simulation but:
-the theater AI is incapable of handling the supply problems. it's like a general giving the 'drive till the last drop' order every single time instead of giving a 'we're at half fuel, time to hold or go back' order.
-there's no correct indication about the provinces infrastructure before you enter them and no significant warning when you're in danger of falling out of supply, no visible consumption indicator ... it's more guessing than workable info you get.
-allied AI's do not consider your potential supply problems for expeditionary forces.
-bomb the supply depot province and you probably get a worst case scenario. in reality it would hurt if a capital is bombed but it's not going to mean that units thousands of miles away are going to have permanent supply problems until this capital is rebuild, not for the big nations anyway.
 

Szun

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i currently have 1600+ brigades and if i hadnt changed the supply throughput half my army would be out of supplies, with 100 infra in all provinces...

I am inclined to change throughput tech to 3x the basevalue, unless one researches to 1950 tech in 1940, that is the only way beside changeing throughput values in laws...
 

Charles Louis

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So your position is you were invoking “historical” cases to show supply wasn’t working?

No, I was saying that getting more ports will ease supply problems if you have exceeded the capacity of the ports. Working-not-working didn't enter into it. That's your particular hobby horse and the lens through which you misinterpret my post. As for me, I'm more interested in playing the game, than declaring it good or bad. If I need to take more ports, I'll take more ports, historically sometimes people had to take ports. That's all.

I answered the specific question asked, and didn't turn it into an invitation to offer my approval or disapproval of the game.
 
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unmerged(12148)

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Ok here is another one, i'm not sure if i should move to the bug forum or what, because the more i read the more I think im doing something wrong, i simply don't have a clue what.

So france is now secured, i've moved into belgium in the north, i've taken brugee, the port, and the province below brugee krjiewj or something along those lines is the supply dump, the units IN the supply dump will not receive supplies, but everyone else that has advanced into belgium in the south does, from the same supply depot.

I don't understand what i am doing wrong.
 

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Fairfax and Dutch Harbors are two I can think of off-hand that received considerable upgrades during WWII. Dozens of smaller local ports of call for built up overnight on occupied islands to support supply transfers to ground forces (such as those on the Santa Cruz Islands and Guadacanal) which could easily classify as a level 1 (able to support a combat fleet either directly tied to the port or off-shore via supply boats) or more port.

As for the European Theatre it is completely unreasonable to suggest that it wasn't possible for the Allies to construct port facilities in the war, whether they did it or not on a scale that measures against your expectations. The game is designed to allow you to play with history, and "historically" it was possible (and in my mind, done) for the Allies to ship material anywhere they wanted in quantities necessary with the required labor to build a port facility that could support anything up to a carrier battle group directly.

Fairfax: "The harbor was well established prior to WWII, including the seaplane base."1

Dutch Harbors: Appears to be pre-WWII harbor as well.

Not sure how these are examples.

'Mulberry' Artificial Harbors are not what the harbors in HOI3 represent, in my opinion.
 

CavScout

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No, I was saying that getting more ports will ease supply problems if you have exceeded the capacity of the ports. Working-not-working didn't enter into it. That's your particular hobby horse and the lens through which you misinterpret my post. As for me, I'm more interested in playing the game, than declaring it good or bad. If I need to take more ports, I'll take more ports, historically sometimes people had to take ports. That's all.

I answered the specific question asked, and didn't turn it into an invitation to offer my approval or disapproval of the game.

So, you didn't cite history to show it wasn't working. You didn't cite history to show it was working. Why exactly then did you cite history?
 

gamer42_au

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Surely most provinces with more than basic level of IC are capable of producing HOI3 supplies - we are talking ammunition and replacement parts here. The basic concept that all supplies originate at the capital and are distributed from there is fundamentally flawed (although much easier to implement) - the only exception might be a minor which only has any material IC at its capital.

Proposal:
Supply production is distributed pro-rata to IC among the provinces which:
1) have at least X IC
2) are not rebuilding from damage (so you don't get supply from newly captured provinces; also makes strat bombing have extra effects)
3) have access to needed resources (so not in isolated pockets, unless pocket includes needed resources).

Failing this (which would be complex to implement), the game would seem to need a "national province" adjustment, greatly increasing the supply flow through national provinces, so that logistics are only a serious problem when on the offensive.

Also, IRL supply over long distances is done by railroads (if they exist) or by shipping (and then railroad if possible). Where a supply route passes through a province with less than 80% infra (or is longer than X provinces), then there should be an option (followed by the AI in most cases) which instead routes supply from a nearby port if available. I also wonder if there shouldn't be some allowance for coastal shipping, ie having better flows of supplies between provinces that share a coast line.
 

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Hey guys, trying to find the best place to post this. I'm having a supply problem that I'd run into before on 1.1 but hasnt been an issue until now. I've been running the game from 36 all the way to 44 and my supply demands have always been fairly steady. They might go up and down a bit (drop to 0 IC demand and shoot up to 75) but they always stabilised.

Now for whatever reason my Head HQ is reading anywhere between -1000 and -3000 Supplies every other day, with the in between days reading 0 demand. The only thing diffrient I've been doing is moving 1 army into an area with low infrastructre and a division into a puppert state's Territory.

Should I take this to the actual tech support section of the Forum? Or am I just doing something wrong?

EDIT: Ever since this glitch started none of my enemies have launched attacks. Is it possible it's effecting every country?
 
Last edited:

GLENN

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Supply has been fixed in 1.3.

I can't help you with your problem.

but I have loaded a saved game and choose the AI USSR.

When I played them I could not get your bug to go away.

zero demand then 5,000 demand. then it would settle out. About once a week it would swing like this.

The only thing I noticed was; It coincided with the auto sliders.

The auto sliders switch to making zero of something and then alot.

When I switched the production to manual the samething occured.

It's like the supply is stuck in the background to match the swing in production.

I tried to fix the swing by increaseing the infrastucture throughput, techs, and capacity cap. Each parameter was adjusted seperately and each game was started fresh. The supply through-put would increase but I could not fix the supply demand swing!

A screwy bug! :eek:
 
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Defender_16

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Well it's good to know that I'm not the only person running into this thing. :rolleyes:

I've just remembered however that for a few days I'd accidentally set the Production for AI control. After I noticed it I returned to to manual control then the bug started. :wacko:
 

plasticpanzers

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sorry, we do not have 1.3 yet so its totally unknown how or if supply has been fixed or changed.
I think we will have to wait before it can be claimed to be "fixed" in 1.3. After all there were alot
of bugs that came thru in 1.2. I really do hope it does get fixed tho!
 

CommanderCody

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I had an interesting phenomenon which may or may not help this discussion. I'm playing Germany on Hard (should be VH, but hey, this is the first time). On my Eastern front, Hungary is an ally and I DOW'd Yugo and Romania (they would not join Axis, despite being very close to lower right on the matrix). So, just prior to Operation Barbarossa the front goes Germany, Hungary, Germany in terms of control.

I go pretty deep into Russia and the Hungarians get bogged down in the Pripyat Marshes. Up to this point my forces are bifurcated. Then I decide to connect my forces and round up the huge pocket in and around the marshes. Well, once my front went from two distinct fronts to one supply went to hell. All manner of units were randomly not getting supplies--to the tune of about 20% unsupplied at any time.

So, I went back to a previous save and have kept my forces bifurcated since and voila, no supply issues (other than the usual one or two divisions missing supply once a week or so--i.e. a very minor nuisance). It looks pretty silly to have two groups of forces separated by 2-3 provinces going deep into Russia, but at least supply works.
 

GLENN

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Well it's good to know that I'm not the only person running into this thing. :rolleyes:

I've just remembered however that for a few days I'd accidentally set the Production for AI control. After I noticed it I returned to to manual control then the bug started. :wacko:

Oh crap..... don't tell me I have to do more testing.

I don't believe this bug has been reported.

Can anyone else confirm the relationship between auto AI production and Swinging demand of supplies?
 

nessin

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Fairfax: "The harbor was well established prior to WWII, including the seaplane base."1

Dutch Harbors: Appears to be pre-WWII harbor as well.

Not sure how these are examples.

'Mulberry' Artificial Harbors are not what the harbors in HOI3 represent, in my opinion.

Bit of an old response since I didn't see it till someone bumped up the thread. However, I will point out you completely mis-read my post. That was a pretty critical mistake since I said "Fairfax and Dutch Harbors are two I can think of off-hand that received considerable upgrades during WWII." Upgrades, as in not new construction, but extensive re-construction of the present facilities.
 

unmerged(223060)

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How does supply from allies work? I'm playing as england in 1940 and i have my army in the netherlands to fend off germany, and suddenly a bunch of my dudes are out of supply. They are all 1-3 provinces away from Amsterdam, which has a massive amount of supplies, because obviously it's the capital.

All the infrastructure is obviously 100%, and there seems to be supply in the country elsewhere, because all the netherlands' own armies are in blue (surplus supply) regions, receiving their full supply. Netherlands has joined the Allies so it seems like they should be supplying my armies. What am i doing wrong?

Note: the netherlands has a big ass stockpile of supplies and fuel, but they are running a supply deficit, could that be related?