It would be cool if Hoi4 Adopthed the AoD Supply System

[Evilfisher]

Compared to the other Hoi2 supply systems the Arsenal of Democracy Supply system allowed units to survive with its own internal supply for a while before running out.. instead of running out just when they got surrounded.. and it allowed tanks and motorized divisions to play around inside the enemies territory without having to worry about losing supply immediately if they got locked inside a weak pocket

and seeing the division editor in Hoi4, once such a supply system would be in place it could easily be expanded by allowing Support Divisions to be added to different units, like Supply Trucks to Motorized Divisions so that they could last longer inside enemy territories than units without their own bonus supply

or maybe those supply units could have other roles like making supply depots out in the fields?

anyway that's just my opinion on what should be added to the supply system i think it would be cool to have something like that or similar to that

edit: i wanted to change the title to Unit Supply system but oh well.. added picture for reference !

 

[safe-keeper]

I especially like the idea of a support unit that gives units more supplies so that they last longer if encircled.

 

[Porkman]

A good idea from AOD or Darkest Hour will never be allowed in HOIx.

It's just the way that it is.

 

[Deathmachinept]

Never played AoD but that is a good feature to solve the short comings you mention. Being surrounded by a weak pocket and suffering an immediate out supply debuff was unrealistic.

Maybe oversupply or what it was called on HoI 2 could boost the amount of supply each unit could carry. You could more easily mimic the thrust from Germany on the soviet union, since units could prolong an offensive even despite having logistics problems but because they use an initial oversupply each unit could still prolong the fight before receiving the effects of poor logistic support.

 

[Vidkjaer]

Compared to the other Hoi2 supply systems the Arsenal of Democracy Supply system allowed units to survive with its own internal supply for a while before running out.. instead of running out just when they got surrounded.. and it allowed tanks and motorized divisions to play around inside the enemies territory without having to worry about losing supply immediately if they got locked inside a weak pocket

and seeing the division editor in Hoi4, once such a supply system would be in place it could easily be expanded by allowing Support Divisions to be added to different units, like Supply Trucks to Motorized Divisions so that they could last longer inside enemy territories than units without their own bonus supply

or maybe those supply units could have other roles like making supply depots out in the fields?

anyway that's just my opinion on what should be added to the supply system i think it would be cool to have something like that or similar to that

edit: i wanted to change the title to Unit Supply system but oh well.. added picture for reference !

In HOI3 each division stockpiled worth 30 days of supplies (if they were in supply). that limit could be modded. Isnt it that what you are looking for?

 

[adam_grif]

Yeah seriously not seeing how different this is from HoI3, conceptually. There was an encircled modifier for combat, but that was separate from being out of supply. Units would start getting lack of supply penalties and stop being able to reorg over time / take extra penalties in combat.

 

[podcat]

Yeah seriously not seeing how different this is from HoI3, conceptually. There was an encircled modifier for combat, but that was separate from being out of supply. Units would start getting lack of supply penalties and stop being able to reorg over time / take extra penalties in combat.

Yeah hoi3 already works like that (hoi4 works a bit differently, but you still have stored up supply).

 

[PB-DK]

Yeah hoi3 already works like that (hoi4 works a bit differently, but you still have stored up supply).

there is quite a bit of difference between AOD and hoi3, in hoi3 the supplies fart around depending on the demand, so that you have units that go out of supply immidiately on moving to or from provinces, something that AOD does not as it ensures the supplies stick with units.

an edit just for clarification; HOI 3 had supplies stocked in PROVINCES, AOD has it stocked in the UNITS, BOTH systems use provinces to measure the flow of supplies.

 

[TheOrangeGuy]

In HOI 3 divisions "requested" 30 days of supply to the province they stayed in. But they didn't share, one could have 1000 supplies, and the division in the province next to it had 0, and the division moving from a province always took as much as they needed, so they will take 30 days off supply and leave the province dry. HOI 2 "private" reserve worked a lot better.

 

[Art1985]

I am totally for supply battalions. With trucks for supply missions.
I want to have variety of battalions to choose from.

 

[Deathmachinept]

I am totally for supply battalions. With trucks for supply missions.
I want to have variety of battalions to choose from.

Same we need to be able to boost logistics by buildings more trucks or trains.. we can do with convoys there isn't a reason for not being able to make a brigade require x number of trucks, if these trucks were target by air you would need to replace them..

It would have more direct and precise impact on X division and brigades forcing production to be spend on truck rather than targeting logistics in a province that auto-heal themselves.

 

[Art1985]

Same we need to be able to boost logistics by buildings more trucks or trains.. we can do with convoys there isn't a reason for not being able to making a brigade should require x number of trucks, if this trucks were target by air you would need to replace them.

And supply battalions should increase moral and organization of the division (specialized supply unit give better meals for soldiers, better and faster repair for damaged equipment and so on). And combination with engineers should give even more bonuses in movement.

 

[Evilfisher]

I especially like the idea of a support unit that gives units more supplies so that they last longer if encircled.

i know right! so simple and yet it adds much more depth into the game!

Yeah hoi3 already works like that (hoi4 works a bit differently, but you still have stored up supply).

there is quite a bit of difference between AOD and hoi3, in hoi3 the supplies fart around depending on the demand, so that you have units that go out of supply immediately on moving to or from provinces, something that AOD does not as it ensures the supplies stick with units.

4am yesterday i actually ended up forgetting how the Hoi3 system worked thats why i used the other Hoi2 games as an example.. but still if they run into a new province and there is not enough supply it simply runs to 0% instantly instead of the units having any reserves.. which would be really usefull in such situations where the supply system breaks down for some reason.. but i haven't played Hoi3 in a long time so i can be wrong

regardless of how the new system will work, having features like supply trucks or other supplying methods to divisions only adds more depth in my opinion! if you know they are gonna be in hard-to-supply places, like mountain divisions could need some bonus supply... maybe not trucks on mountains but something else?

 

[potski]

Units in HOI3 didn't take supplies with them. But at midnight on the day they arrived in a new province they would start to draw supplies from adjoining friendly provinces.

The exception to this was amphibious landings - they got (I think) 20 days worth landed on the beaches with them.

It's just possible that an advancing unit could be counter-attacked within a few hours of arriving in a province, and be out of supply. But this was very unlikely as they captured whatever enemy supplies had been in the province. It would be pretty unlikely for them to arrive in a province where there was zero supplies.

A combination of picking up enemy supplies and your own supplies arriving with hours, and being able to advance quicker than the quickest unit, meant you could never outrun your supplies however far and quickly you advanced. I hope this is not repeated in HOI4.

Podcat: when do we get that long promised DD?

 

[Alex_brunius]

Yeah hoi3 already works like that

Almost true

In HoI3 units determine how much supplies will be stored in a province, but in AoD the supplies are actually carried by the units themself. There is a subtle but important difference here in how the end result appear.

In HoI3 for example if a fresh unit with 30days worth of stockpile enters a province containing zero supplies and an identical unit they both share it 50/50 and both have 15 days. When one of the unit exit the province it takes all 30 days worth of supplies with it again, and leave the province empty. So one unit can "steal" supplies, and this is what happens when you make a strategic redeployment.

In AoD the units won't share supplies with each other, but need to be stationed long enough in good enough infrastructure to build up their own stockpile. And fleets also can only spend a limited time out on the seas before they need to return back to port to refill their stockpile of fuel and supplies. If ships are sunk or units are lost so is the supplies and fuel they carry ( unlike in HoI3 where the port/province needs to be captured ).

I agree with OP that the AoD way of taking care of supplies is better.


The coolest possibilities by tying this to unit stats IMO is if you can add supply capacity to supply units inside the division (like OP requested ) and also use it as a natural way to limit offensives if fuel consumption rate when moving is >>> fuel stockpiling rates of most mobile divisions.

 

[Beagá]

Good post agree 100% that AoD did better

And seriosuly people - don´t criticize a game you didn´t even play, and jump to defend HOI3 anytime it´s mentioned. It´s not rational.

On the other hand AoD worked well because there was less provinces and less ports, making supply paths a bit easier, at least regarding performance.

 

[Deathmachinept]

Units in HOI3 didn't take supplies with them. But at midnight on the day they arrived in a new province they would start to draw supplies from adjoining friendly provinces.
The exception to this was amphibious landings - they got (I think) 20 days worth landed on the beaches with them.
It's just possible that an advancing unit could be counter-attacked within a few hours of arriving in a province, and be out of supply. But this was very unlikely as they captured whatever enemy supplies had been in the province. It would be pretty unlikely for them to arrive in a province where there was zero supplies.
A combination of picking up enemy supplies and your own supplies arriving with hours, and being able to advance quicker than the quickest unit, meant you could never outrun your supplies however far and quickly you advanced. I hope this is not repeated in HOI4.

But if a province had no units... there wouldn't be any supplies to be use right?

I think units should be able to take some supplies with them but they should retain the need to draw from province supplies maybe the quantity of supplies you take could impacted your attack speed?
Or the simple standard reserve would also be great and much more realistic than HoI 3.

Only now I understand why moving my units would make provinces run of supplies or have 1 province full supplied when another neighbor was out of supply.

 

[Balesir]

On the other hand AoD worked well because there was less provinces and less ports, making supply paths a bit easier, at least regarding performance.

Actually, the supply replenishment in AoD relied on a fairly straightforward flood-fill calculation that just gave the ESE calculated by the best route available from your supply sources to the province. While it could be a tad slow on older machines, on modern rigs I think it could happily deal with a lot more provinces fairly easily - the grunt work is proportional to total province numbers, rather than an exponential function.

 

[Will Steel]

In HoI3, all units carried a month's supply on themselves. This allowed them to survive after being cut off for some time. It was only after that they ran out of those 'emergency supplies' that they would face critical situation, and had to capture enemy supply depots and routes to feed/arm themselves, until they can find their way back to friendly zone.

It worked nicely as far as I have played. Units would have to fight hard but they had a chance to survive and fight their way out. Oil was the most critical resource, because armour divisions couldn't do anything if they didn't capture enemy fuel in the depots.

Isn't this exactly what OP is asking? Mobile supply depots would be nice indeed.

 

[CocoCincinnati]

What would be great would be if the OOB* and higher level HQ's from HOI3 could be brought back and then used to implement a supply system, which would have the added bonus of also being realistic. I would assume all divisions of the day had a supply element responsible for keeping several days, at least, of supplies on hand to support the division, and this could be easily reflected in game without actualy needing to show it.

*My apologies in advance for bringing up such a touchy subject.