Is there a point to buy this game?

[smeggy]

You will enter heaven once you can show 10 EU4 archievement to Petrus.

 

[panionios]

Well, the Hordes are pretty weak now - also consider the different starting date. But even when they expand the timeline back to 1399, I think they'll still be weak. And you no longer have them declaring war every five years nor the stupid "send colony" to take provinces.

I haven't played BYZ but I hear it is more difficult now. But again, they will probably get stronger when they expand the timeline back to 1399 since they get more provinces.

None of the DLC so far have added something meaningful. Not really worth buying.

The Art of War looks somewhat promising, though I am a bit cautious. It has some cool stuff but nothing really game-breaking. Actually, the free patch gives away more!

Overall: Definitely buy.

 

[lolciokuba]

I absolutely loved Eu2, and never really liked Eu3, in fact when I first installed it I was so disappointed

I do think Eu4 is a step in a right direction and I do enjoy this game immensely because it manages to blend those to titles together. I think its definitely worth buying and the dlc so far expanded the game in right direction, while AoW promises to be the best one yet.

 

[CaptRobau]

omg yes. if you buy any pdx game, buy eu4.

now, perhaps, pdx has now entered a stage where they make a total game cost about 120$ including DLCs adding content, but hey, you don't have to buy everything. Although EU4 is kind've bland without the expansion DLCs.

EU3 was more a $120 game than EU4. The base game + 4 expansions, all necessary if you wanted to keep playing multiplayer, have a nice bug-free game and be able to play mods. EU4 is also a $120 game, but only if you want it to be and without buying anything other than the base game you get to play MP with everyone, play almost all of the mods and have a patched game.

 

[AurochsAway]

EUIV is definitely playable with just the base game, not as feature-rich as it was on release, but still fun.

 

[RobRoy3]

EU3 was more a $120 game than EU4. The base game + 4 expansions, all necessary if you wanted to keep playing multiplayer, have a nice bug-free game and be able to play mods. EU4 is also a $120 game, but only if you want it to be and without buying anything other than the base game you get to play MP with everyone, play almost all of the mods and have a patched game.

And it took a LOT longer, before EU3 was clearly superior to its predecessor, the third expansion, IIRC. EU4 was a solid release, thoroughly enjoyable and better than its predecessor from Day 1.

While you do get a lot of stuff for free in the patches that accompany the DLC, there's enough behind the paywall, that it'll irritate you not to have them. If you perceive that as money-grubbing, that's unfortunate. I perceive it as the least offensive mechanism to get them to continue supporting/improving the game. But if money's tight, you've waited this long, wait for a sale. Generally, all but the most recent DLC are heavily discounted. Unfortunately, you just missed a big one.

 

[Big Blue Blob]

Don't buy. It's ahistorical tosh. Stick with watching DDRJake.

 

[petertel123]

omg yes. if you buy any pdx game, buy victoria 2

fixed that for you

 

[petertel123]

You will enter heaven once you can show 10 EU4 archievement to Petrus.

+1

 

[Gunnarr]

I am going to attempt something never done before... in my life at least. To respond to all of the replies !

I don't think you can turn vassals into bishops.
The struggle as Byzantium is as epic as one might guess.

Since I got into EU4 _without_ all that "$$$$-grubbing" prejudice you seem to suffer from, I really learned to love it and am enjoying all it's DLCs. The DLCs do add a lot to the game (mostly if you play outside of Europe). Important stuff is implemented along with DLCs for free anyways.

Got to decide for yourself if it is your cup of tea. The game is great though.

PS: Title sounds a lot like you're trolling - not sure if this is to attract more views and thus replies or what? But it's a pretty stupid title. Of course there is a point to buying it, in that you can then play it >.<

The way I turned vassals into bishops in EU3 is by taking all of their land so they where dead. Then, I "released then as vassal". In EU3, any vassal you release will automatically get the same government type as the master. (So, Venice releasing say, Ravenna would turn Ravenna into a republic vassal. I wish to know if this is still the same case in EU4, and if you can still have unlimited number of vassals.

About DLC, I preferred the expansions because Mods to the game filled much of the void. For example, in EU3 I liked to use the mod Death and Taxes. When certain DLCs are being pushed out (such as , from what I remember a day 1 dlc for the Byzantines) it is adding things that a modder can already do, or do better. (I saw this a lot with CKII dress and facial dlc. By having it decided this shall be dlc, mods for those specific things are extremely difficult. Even worse, the DLC is worse quality than many modders/artists have been putting out) With the DLC in the way it just makes it more of a hassle to mod. I wonder how well the modding community is for EU4, is it as great as it was for EU3?

Sorry for my bad title, it was like 6 AM and that is around my bed time (night shifts).

EU4 is a better and richer game than EU3, and you can do everything you did in the previous games. Try it, or watch some let's plays, read some reviews, and make a decision. If you like the features added by the DLCs, get them. If you're not interested, don't. Paradox have been excellent with their support of the game, adding new features and fixing bugs for everyone in the community, whether they bought add-ons or not, so there's no plausible justification to suggest they're moneygrubbers.

My justification to call moneygrubbing is some examples of DLC which already could be added by modders in better quality. Of course, the convenience for the day 1 dlc is that you dont need to wait for modders to create it. I have only noticed it in CKII at the moment, but I suspected it would occur in EU4 because they stated before release that the CKII DLC policy (versus expansions) was more profitable and it would be the rule for now on to do DLC instead of expansions. I posted here to find out, if in fact I can still do some of the things I did in EU3 (which I listed). I forgot though to mention, how well is the modding community compared to EU3?

The DLC's fine and adds meaningful content, though you'll also get plenty with each patch even if you don't get the DLC.

The day 1 DLC was all minor (Byzzie and Muslim event packs and a few unit packs) but nice if you're playing the relevant regions.

The start date is 11-11-1444 instead of some time in 1399 (never played EU3), so Muscovy's actually quite a strong start. For more challenging (and thus, fun) and a similar-ish experience, play Novgorod and hold off Muscovy and become Russia yourself. Alternatively, play the hordes and fight against their historical fate.

Nomads are potentially powerful in the early game, but the AI derps pretty hard as them (mostly just expands into other hordes) and Paradox keeps nerfing them patch after patch, even though, other than the Timmies, they all underperform. By 1600, they're just easy land for "civilized" nations.

The Byzantine struggle is always there, and if you want to do it, I recommend getting Purple Phoenix for the Byzzie events.

The Pope can declare the Kingdom of God, but it sucks (just gives cultural union and a little manpower and prestige while disabling the Curia mechanics). Also, I don't think nations you release will be theocracies, but I could be wrong there, since I never really played theocracies.

The day 1 event packs are what bothers me, it seems like things modders could already do, or have done in EU3. Or things that there is no reason to take out of the game to sell as DLC. Anyway, you have reminded me of a big reason I was weary of EU4! The later start date! I always liked playing earlier, and even in the mod Death and Taxes (which I used) I could start a few years earlier than that. I am assuming there are mods out there to have earlier start dates though (there better be).

Your info about the nomads are troubling for me, that does not sound as challenging as EU3 nomads. And with the later start date, I guess it only makes it worse (less challenging to play in Russia).

Kingdom of God, it sounds like almost same even as in EU3. I think I always waited until late in the game to click it, because I love the Curia and Papacy mechanics (I also loved that each Cardinal had a location where they came from, and also a name that fits their culture, heck they even had names for Greek or Russian cardinals of the catholic church, in case you ever had that happen somehow!)

Struggling against hordes sadly isn't really a thing any more. This is partly due to the later start date, when compared to EU3 with expansions, and partly due to underpowered hordes (except for Timurids). Your papal game would run into problems, because the number of relation slots is limited. You start out with 4-5 and can usually get it up to 8 or so, but it's costly to have as many vassals, as you described. Keeping Byzantium alive is now even more of a struggle though and the strategies are changed after each patch.

I think EU4 is certainly already better than EU3, there's just more to do. You can still have similar games, as you described, just those specific ones won't go the same way.

That is very disappointing... thank you for letting me know

omg yes. if you buy any pdx game, buy eu4.

now, perhaps, pdx has now entered a stage where they make a total game cost about 120$ including DLCs adding content, but hey, you don't have to buy everything. Although EU4 is kind've bland without the expansion DLCs.

I wonder how much EU3 cost in its life period, if compared to the current life period of EU4. But thank you for the recommendation anyway

Regarding Muscovy, in 1444 (game start in EU IV) it starts in a much better position than in the 1399 EU III start.

Regarding the whole game, it is all EU III was and much more. Wait for a sale, if you are worried about its price counting the DLCs.

But I like having to get destroyed for 9 games and in the 10th finally surviving! And of course, always good idea for sales. Thanks

Yes. It's a good game, and the DLC is no more "money-grubbing" than CK2, so if you had no problem with that you shouldn't have any problem with EU4.

I do have a problem with the CKII dlc, enough that I do not want to play it any longer. I enjoyed it for awhile, back when it hardly had any DLC, and there were mods that fixed the problems I had, or I could just modify it myself. There is just so much dlc now though I cannot enjoy it. I have not agreed with some of the main decisions/direction of some of their more recent patches in the last months, so it further put me off. Having so many DLCs start to conflict with each other, or conflict with the vanilla mechanics.

If you liked EU3 I'd say yes, its entirely worth it.

The DLC isn't mandatory at all. Most are fluff or such, important features so far were patched in for free. I guess Paradox is likely to someday release a compilation version with DLCs bundled in, but it's only worth waiting for if you have truly deep seated objections to piecemeal DLC, it could be years away.

For a EU3 fan, buy the base game for sure. Wait for a sale if you must but try it out. AoW is probably the first DLC that has some features I'd *really* miss if I only had the base game.

Thanks for explaining the DLC situation, if I buy it I will make sure to get AoW in the least.

Pdx above most publishers put "pointless stuff" in their DLC

COD etc DLC: gun + map packs
PDX: music, unit skins, etc.. nothing you NEED to play , just pure fluff

so dont worry too much, and yes it is worth it for immersion, unless like me you turn music off.. but nowhere near neccesary

So kind of like the CKII music dlc and portrait dlcs. (Even though I can just get a playlist of music that would work just as well or better on youtube, or some talented artists mod portraits themselves) thanks for the info

Nah, your AI hordes(Golden Horde+Timurids) don't attempt world conquests in EU 4

I don't blame them, they would never get through the BBB anyway!

What about Wealth of nations? Art of War? I don't worry about it at all, but I recognize that I spent about 100+$ buying all the CK2 game content DLCs (even ignoring the music/sprite pack ones). And EU4 will probably be the same.

I'd do it again, though. It really is a fun game, especially in multi (imo)

I have never played multiplayer in EU3, or .. actually any paradox game... probably because I have no friends that would play such games as this. lol. Oh is wealth of nations a dlc that should be bought for sure?

With regards to DLC...

I've only recently bought some, as they were on sale on Steam, but I haven't actually played a game with them on, and haven't even installed them. I'm waiting for the changes from the upcoming Art of War expansion to kick in before playing again, basically.

So I can say that I've enjoyed EU4 immensely without ANY DLC, and can wholeheartedly say that it isn't a DLC cash grab-type game.

In addition, PDX has been excellent about giving out a LOT of free stuff in the updates. For instance, Art of War looks to be their biggest expansion yet, and they've just released patch notes which are neatly divided into both free content and stuff you get if you pay for AoW. The list of free changes FAR outnumbers the paid for changes.

Overall, recommend the game strongly.

Thanks!

Conquest of Paradise is largely meaningless unless you want to play a North American tribe or a(n ex-)colonial nation.
Wealth of Nations is worthwhile for the trade companies and extra CBs
RP is worth it for National Focus
AoW is basically EU5.

Also, when AoW comes out, the other DLC will likely go on sale, and it will likely do so again during the Steam Holiday Sale, so consider picking it up at one of those times.

By ex-colonial nation do you mean such things as the Thirteen colonies and such? Those things never worked very well in EU3, so if they are working properly in EU4 that would be a nice plus. What is national focus btw?

Thanks for your reply

You only need to look at the patch notes of AoW.

I never played the game, so not sure what many of the actual notes do, nor do I know how it affects the gameplay.

If you loved EU3, you'll love EU4. You don't need any the DLC to have fun with this game.

But can I make my Catholic Theocracy Europe or not!?

EUIV is, in itself, a good game, but there'sa patch coming out soon, so you won't be able to play it for a week+ after that (as, since 1.5, Paradox has a history of introducing severe bugs with each patch and requiring a hotfix to make it playable again). As well, the current policy seems that they focus on adding new (sometimes unnecessary or simply bad-thought out) mechanics via pay-DLCs, instead of fixing older mechanics that direly need changes (f.e. naval combat).

In the end, it's your call whether you want to support Paradox. The game itself is worth the money, but I wouldn't buy it again at this point.

Oh, I understand the way Paradox works with their patches and their fetish with having the playerbase be bug testers... (It reminds me of CKII, where in a major Patch/DLC all Bishops had the Pope's vestments... how do they not catch that?)

Your mention of unnecessary or bad-thought out reminds me a lot of some of the CKII DLC, so that worries me. Especially the part of not fixing older mechanics (this is a bad problem in CKII as well). Thanks for your reply

Just look at AOW, what developer is generous enough to release EU4.5 for free?

TANSTAAFL!

EU4 is very enjoyable & a big improvement on EU3. My only disappointment is Paradox's refusal to go back to the earlier start, as that is the only DLC I would likely buy as the others don't interest me at all.

Refusal as in, they will not allow it to be modded? Or refusal as in they will not put it in as a DLC?

Yes buy it.

It took me a long time to get over EU3...but everything is good now.

I shall see

 

[Gunnarr]

Oh guys I forgot something. I never liked the new EU4 map, since the mountains jut out in such a large way it just makes it look so wrong. I much preferred a flatter map like in EU3 or Victoria II, or Hearts of Iron. Heck even the colors look kind of off. Are there mods that force a flat map? or is that impossible

You will enter heaven once you can show 10 EU4 archievement to Petrus.

Eww achievements... and what is this Petrus?

Well, the Hordes are pretty weak now - also consider the different starting date. But even when they expand the timeline back to 1399, I think they'll still be weak. And you no longer have them declaring war every five years nor the stupid "send colony" to take provinces.

I haven't played BYZ but I hear it is more difficult now. But again, they will probably get stronger when they expand the timeline back to 1399 since they get more provinces.

None of the DLC so far have added something meaningful. Not really worth buying.

The Art of War looks somewhat promising, though I am a bit cautious. It has some cool stuff but nothing really game-breaking. Actually, the free patch gives away more!

Overall: Definitely buy.

Your my kind of guy! lol Thank you for that information, very helpful

I absolutely loved Eu2, and never really liked Eu3, in fact when I first installed it I was so disappointed

I do think Eu4 is a step in a right direction and I do enjoy this game immensely because it manages to blend those to titles together. I think its definitely worth buying and the dlc so far expanded the game in right direction, while AoW promises to be the best one yet.

I never played EU2, perhaps I should just get that instead? :ninja:

EU3 was more a $120 game than EU4. The base game + 4 expansions, all necessary if you wanted to keep playing multiplayer, have a nice bug-free game and be able to play mods. EU4 is also a $120 game, but only if you want it to be and without buying anything other than the base game you get to play MP with everyone, play almost all of the mods and have a patched game.

Hmm, well for me I did not buy EU3 till they were done with expansions, and on sale. I got it very cheap. (Never played multiplayer though, no friends!) Maybe I should just wait a few years until they are all done adding things. But then again, it might make me not want it at all then, because of DLC bloat. (again, I think DLC creates a problem that once you have so many, they can start to conflict badly with each other and the base mechanics. What is worse they done seem to dislike touching DLC mechanics for months, years, or never)

EUIV is definitely playable with just the base game, not as feature-rich as it was on release, but still fun.

Thanks!

And it took a LOT longer, before EU3 was clearly superior to its predecessor, the third expansion, IIRC. EU4 was a solid release, thoroughly enjoyable and better than its predecessor from Day 1.

While you do get a lot of stuff for free in the patches that accompany the DLC, there's enough behind the paywall, that it'll irritate you not to have them. If you perceive that as money-grubbing, that's unfortunate. I perceive it as the least offensive mechanism to get them to continue supporting/improving the game. But if money's tight, you've waited this long, wait for a sale. Generally, all but the most recent DLC are heavily discounted. Unfortunately, you just missed a big one.

Thanks for the advice! But I do not believe, that Paradox will go under if they did not follow this DLC path, but instead used the older Expansions path . I think Paradox can survive without "event dlcs", and would be better without it anyway

Don't buy. It's ahistorical tosh. Stick with watching DDRJake.

Who is DDRJake? I look him up, and he is playing shamanistic Scandinavia. Sounds pretty weird to me

fixed that for you

I agree!

 

[BaZERGer]

Small clarification, in effect, the number of diplomatic relations you have is not a limit, but is rather the number of relations you can have for free, each number going over that costs 1 diplomatic points per month. Unless the ruler's diplomatic skill sucks, there's no issue with going a bit over it, even long term.

The ability to play as a colonial nation requires Conquest of Paradise, but creation of colonial nation subjects does not, the generated colonial nations are based on colonial regions, once you have 5 core provinces in the same region, it'll automaticaly form a colonial nation, which can start wars with natives and other colonial nations on their own without involving their overlords. Any new province colonized in the region is also automaticaly transfered to the colonial nation.
They seem to have fixed the issues with breaking of alliances due to length of war when an overlord of one nation tries to enforce peace on another nation, though it seems the length of war factor is getting completely removed now.

National Focus lets you set one of the 3 monarch point types as a focus, which adds +2 monarch points per month to it, while subtracting 1 from each of the other 2 per month. Can only be changed once every 25 years though.

 

[balmung60]

The current challenge in nomads is playing as them instead of against them, and Russia is plenty challenging if you start as someone other than Muscovy. For bonus points, do it as a horde.

Currently, the 1399 start is pretty easily restored as the history files are largely carried over from EU3, but Art of War and 1.8 will probably break that by adding about 900 provinces. Not that such a thing will stop modders.

Colonial nations are special subjects formed by having at least five cores in an overseas (different continent) colonial region (distinct from normal regions) that are relatively autonomous and can wage their own wars against other nations' colonial nations and the natives (though you can jump in if you want). They will automatically receive any additional provinces you get in their colonial region. If they get a high enough library desire (linked to tariffs and events), they'll try to declare independence, after which, they can form certain nations, such as the USA and Haiti.

 

[donkixot]

Day 1 DLC was cosmetic stuff and couple of events, nothing serious. Even if you don't want to buy the DLC's (which aren't required) you can still buy the base game on sale for $10 which happen very often. You won't regret it.

 

[Big Blue Blob]

Oh guys I forgot something. I never liked the new EU4 map, since the mountains jut out in such a large way it just makes it look so wrong. I much preferred a flatter map like in EU3 or Victoria II, or Hearts of Iron. Heck even the colors look kind of off. Are there mods that force a flat map? or is that impossible



Eww achievements... and what is this Petrus?



Your my kind of guy! lol Thank you for that information, very helpful



I never played EU2, perhaps I should just get that instead? :ninja:



Hmm, well for me I did not buy EU3 till they were done with expansions, and on sale. I got it very cheap. (Never played multiplayer though, no friends!) Maybe I should just wait a few years until they are all done adding things. But then again, it might make me not want it at all then, because of DLC bloat. (again, I think DLC creates a problem that once you have so many, they can start to conflict badly with each other and the base mechanics. What is worse they done seem to dislike touching DLC mechanics for months, years, or never)



Thanks!



Thanks for the advice! But I do not believe, that Paradox will go under if they did not follow this DLC path, but instead used the older Expansions path . I think Paradox can survive without "event dlcs", and would be better without it anyway



Who is DDRJake? I look him up, and he is playing shamanistic Scandinavia. Sounds pretty weird to me



I agree!

DDRJake is the closest thing EU4 has to a demigod. He undestands that the game bears about as much resemblance to history as 1066 And All That does, and therefore seeks to play the craziest games possible, either mass conquests with one-province nations or achievement runs like Jihad (converting a vast number of provinces as Najd) or The Great Khan (conquering big areas of Eurasia as Mongolia). In his most recent game, he turned Sweden into a shamanist one province nation and proceeded to dominate the HRE and convert Rome.