The Hive Mind civics we've seen so far are all "generic", true dat, but so are most civics, in fact. Consider that the three most unique civics are DLC content. Civics are clearly meant as something that will be expanded in the future. I would imagine that almost every subsequent DLC will feature new civics, some of which will offer major changes and some of those may be for Hive Minds.
Is there a list of all the new civics?
- Thread starter The Danish King
- Start date
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
All hive mind civics are also DLC content since the hive mind ethic is DLC content.
And Wiz has made a point of mentioning a few times that they may make some content aviable via multiple different DLC (a'la EU4).
While I would like to see more unique mechanics for Hive Minds than currently offered by the revealed Civics, I honestly cannot think of actual game mechanics to add to Hive Minds. What else would people like to see specifically for Hive Mind mechanics or Civics?
Since the primary way of gaining influence in utopia is through supporting faction (which hives don't have), I'm guessing that extra influence is there to compensate for that (still will probably put them on an lower average gain). The civic would then put them even more on par with the non-hives.
Has it by the way been stated how hiveminds will handle edicts? Do they still have them at all?
I really hope that they still have edicts, they would otherwise be horrendously underpowered.
So is government type still a thing? Or has it been split into authority and civics?
It seem you completely missed what I am saying.
I have NOTHING against lack of faction for Hive Mind govt type.
What I am trying to say is that lack of variety make Hive Mind even more likely to suffer from lack of replay value due to lack of choices. Not that they need faction under Hive Mind govt.... Where are you getting that idea from?
When I say "variety" I meant the kind of variety that make different empires unique. Like FTL type, color flag, starting weapon type, and other stuff... Since most variety like that are also available to non-Hive Mind govt type so those don't count as variety among Hive Mind Govt type. I was hoping for more variety from civic choices but it seem the only real variety is in ascension peaks and we are already restricted from picking non-biological paths so...
How do you expect people to keep playing Hive Mind empire if the 1000th game offer little to no replay value; at least compared to the first time?
Inclined to agree with Tavior.
Haven't seen anything in the Hive Mind civics so far that would significantly change gameplay for them. A (possibly advanced) civic that would allow non-Hive Minded pops to survive on the empire ("Psionic Translation Implants" allowing xenos to listen to and communicate with the hive mind even not being a full part of it), or one that removes their scientist traits in exchange for an increase in all types of research or additional research alternatives (could reuse the "Natural Neural Networks" for this one; scientists are just massive clone circuits focusing on different areas rather than autonomous drones with a personality or preference so improve their general efficiency at the cost of specialisation), or one that significantly increases the combat ability of only corvettes (reuse the "Strength of Legions" to represent the coordination inherent in a swarm of closely linked hive minded small units), those are all civics that actually change how the Hive Mind feels and interacts with the world around it rather than being a boring +1 influence or +20% army damage or whatever else we've seen so far.
Haven't seen anything in the Hive Mind civics so far that would significantly change gameplay for them. A (possibly advanced) civic that would allow non-Hive Minded pops to survive on the empire ("Psionic Translation Implants" allowing xenos to listen to and communicate with the hive mind even not being a full part of it), or one that removes their scientist traits in exchange for an increase in all types of research or additional research alternatives (could reuse the "Natural Neural Networks" for this one; scientists are just massive clone circuits focusing on different areas rather than autonomous drones with a personality or preference so improve their general efficiency at the cost of specialisation), or one that significantly increases the combat ability of only corvettes (reuse the "Strength of Legions" to represent the coordination inherent in a swarm of closely linked hive minded small units), those are all civics that actually change how the Hive Mind feels and interacts with the world around it rather than being a boring +1 influence or +20% army damage or whatever else we've seen so far.
If you want to be a homogenous blob on the galactic map, Hive Minds seem like the way to go. Devouring systems around you and expanding beyond the ability of others. Seems like the right design for the genre. But I do worry that Hive Minds will be more fun to play against than play as.
i'm pretty sure they have an innate +1 bonus to influence, but are still "designed" to end up with less influence overall since they won't need to do any internal political stuff.
WUT
By that logic, Starcraft is only good for 3 playthroughs. How do you expect people to play chess for the 1000th time if they haven't added any new pieces in centuries.
Replayability lies not just in trying something different. It's also in the mastery and in trying the familiar in a new environment. Check the statistics for EU4 - people do net keep trying new nations every game, they keep coming back to the big ones, time and time again. Where do they find the replayability if it can only be found in something completely different, I wonder.
But even if we agree to write off 75% of all replayability, that still matters little. The real replayability killer is the ability to change your ethics in-game, because it means you can try all the ethics, sans Hive Mind, in a single playthrough, albeit a long one. Same goes for civics and government in general. Basically, the game has been reduced to 3 ascention patchs (as those are mutually exclusive, HIve Minds and those fixed civics (Machinist, Convergent Evolution). Everything else can be tested in a single playtrough.
And why would you care for people to play a 1000 times anyway? Whichever fanatic does that is clearly not concerned with replayability as defined by you anyway. What concerns the devs is a player who plays enough to keep coming back when a new DLC is released, or a new iteration of the game. And as each DLC and iteration changes the replayability, the only concern is giving people enough content to play enough games in between those, to be interested in having more. Which isn't even 50 games for most players, much less 1000.
i hope +inf civic will not be "must have for every hivemind no matter what"
idk...judging by the description hivemind offers stability and control over your empire. if it's true then for me the answer to your question will be "with great pleasure"
I like playing Orthodox countries, in EU 4, because of the stability discount and among other reasons. Due to 1444 game start date, there is not lot of variety. I do come back to them from time to time. But lately I got really bored with them. I want a change for once so I went and did Empire Strike Back achievement for fun.
I do like vareity. It doesn't meant that I play "everything once" and be done with it. No far from it.
The kind of variety I would have liked to see more of would be like playing a tall vs wide trading empire. There is so many possible way to do this. I will probability never get tried of "republic" anything. Ibadi merchant trading republic? Lets have fun! American Natives tall trading merchant republic? Sure why not!
Does it have to be powerful? Naw just a different way of something. Right now Hive Mind Govt only real choices that make them different from other Hive Mind is fairly limited to a select few items and most of those are ALREADY used by other non-Hive Mind. Think species portrait, flag color/symbols, starting FTL/weapon type, civic choices, and ascension peak.
Civic choices and Ascension Peak is the only things that would mark an unique set of playing styles at least when it comes to unique Hive Mind features. On the other hand non-Hive Mind has FAR more diversity going on that you can't really play the "same" game twice.
For example, Suppose if you want to start as a fanatic Xenophobe and start up a new game. You start right next to a fallen xenophile empire. So in 1.5 you are forced to give up "purge everything" stance and go bit softer. In another game you have 15 "great" solar system next door to your home system and nobody can fight you in the end.
IE for Hive Mind diversity play style examples; going for full tall, space habitation and superstructure, with full biological ascension. Or gain "Defender of the Galaxy" and wide game play ascension peaks while avoiding biological ascension peaks.
There is only so many combination, between ascension peak and civic picks, you can try before you got bored. I am asking for more variety in few ways. Make it possible to go full PSI ascension Hive Mind or Cybernetic Hive Mind would help mitigation this issue.
I was hoping that Hive Mind civic choices would be more different than non-Hive Mind civic. What I have seen so thus far is disappoint on score of diversity.
Erm... Sure I guess.
I may get so bored enough to actually get into mod making to change up around bit more personally.
hm? but why? there are plenty of other playstyles: authoritarians, egalitarians, pacifists, psi-spiritualists, robotic-materialists...purifiers.
but the time you'll get bored of every one of them there may be plenty of more
Not enough variety to play a mechanic/cybernetic Hive Mind nor PSI Hive Mind to name a few possibilities.
In the same sense you can play a "tyrannic ruthless taking over the world republic" or "benevolent tall interventionist merchant republic" or "colonization expansion constitution republic" in EU 4.
Sure there are plenty of non-HIve Mind play style but what if I want something different and still be Hive Mind? I am just afraid it might not be enough to have "boring" civic choices, ascension peaks, and whatever @Wiz calls "flavor". His word not mine.
That’s completely arbitrary. What if I want to play as a time-bending nation or an a nation of clones? I play Endless Space. What if I want to play an all consuming swarm or a race of ancient space-samurai? I play Starcraft.
Could we have those in Stellaris? Possibly, but their lack is not a flaw. You can never please every single player.
But how many combinations do you want? Just by using civics, ascensions and traits one can create dozens of combinations. How many Hive Mind games do you expect to play before the next DLC adds even more combinations? 10? 20? I doubt I'll have time for more than 2-3. That's way more combinations than games. Most players will spend more time playing non-Hive Minds, making use of other DLC features. Hive Minds are just one of many ways to play the game.
Last edited:
The latter: your government is now your authority type plus your civics.
Government type is now just a name and flavor text, generated by your choice of Ethics, Civics, and Authority.