Is sunny Ottomans supposed to help the emperor in league wars? Then what to do?

[FreeSoc]

The curious thing is not that they became involved (because that makes sense - pretty much everyone with a stake in Europe did, IRL); but that they joined Austria's side, which obviously shouldn't happen in this situation - Austrian emperor of considerable strength and with a lot of land in the Ottoman's sphere of influence.

Russia appears to be in the Protestant League; perhaps the Ottomans joined the Catholic League not because of anything concerning Austria or Prussia, but because they were opposing Russia.

 

[Yuri_Kenobi]

I don't quite know how the AI mechanics work. But seeing as how you're a rival of the Ottomans and they hate your guts, it makes sense for them to side with Austria.

 

[Gunburned]

this was historical, and is meant to happen in game.

 

[FreeSoc]

this was historical, and is meant to happen in game.

Ottomans joining the Catholic League is not historical. Ottomans interfering in the Thirty Years' War to a greater or lesser extent is historical, but them buddying up with Austria on the Catholic side is not.

I have no objection to it happening, because if the in-game circumstances (Austria and the Ottomans both being worried about other powers more than each other) are right then there's no reason for it not to, but it is wrong to brand the Ottomans joining the Catholic League as historical.

 

[Peanutcat]

sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny sunny

 

[Thrake]

The curious thing is not that they became involved (because that makes sense - pretty much everyone with a stake in Europe did, IRL); but that they joined Austria's side, which obviously shouldn't happen in this situation - Austrian emperor of considerable strength and with a lot of land in the Ottoman's sphere of influence.

If they were to back Prussia, it would be worse with a powerful Prussian Emperor (which seems to have Smolensk as vassal btw). I would back Austria as well if I were Ottos.

 

[birincikalite]

Russia appears to be in the Protestant League; perhaps the Ottomans joined the Catholic League not because of anything concerning Austria or Prussia, but because they were opposing Russia.

Probably both Russia and Prussia

 

[Saintlukas]

It seems like we get this thread every week, yes nations that are not christian can throw their Lot in with either league

 

[Ultima_Ratio]

I don't see any reason why muslims/other faiths should be able to join a religious league in the empire. The Ottomans will have plenty of opportunity to take advantage of an emperor weakened by a league war anyway, and the way it works now it's just completely ahistorical how they are ready to see their whole country burn in defense of Austria, of all countries. The reason they'd want to intervene is conquest, anyway, and they gain nothing even if they join the protestant league to weaken Austria instead.

 

[birincikalite]

I don't see any reason why muslims/other faiths should be able to join a religious league in the empire. The Ottomans will have plenty of opportunity to take advantage of an emperor weakened by a league war anyway, and the way it works now it's just completely ahistorical how they are ready to see their whole country burn in defense of Austria, of all countries. The reason they'd want to intervene is conquest, anyway, and they gain nothing even if they join the protestant league to weaken Austria instead.

Show me how can it be ahistorical... Are you sure you aren't making up things and speaking by history?

 

[Ultima_Ratio]

Show me how can it be ahistorical... Are you sure you aren't making up things and speaking by history?

When, exactly, did the Ottomans fight to the point where half their country was occupied by outside powers to protect the emperor and Catholicism in the empire?

 

[AurochsAway]

It seems like we get this thread every week, yes nations that are not christian can throw their Lot in with either league

We've never had the Ottomans described as "sunny" before though!

 

[grommile]

When, exactly, did the Ottomans fight to the point where half their country was occupied by outside powers to protect the emperor and Catholicism in the empire?

When, exactly, was there anyone in 16th century Europe capable of occupying half the Ottoman Empire?

 

[Ultima_Ratio]

When, exactly, was there anyone in 16th century Europe capable of occupying half the Ottoman Empire?

Practically every game where the Ottomans for some nonsensical reason join the Catholic league.

 

[grommile]

Practically every game where the Ottomans for some nonsensical reason join the Catholic league.

Which is to say "never, outside of our computers".

 

[Ultima_Ratio]

Which is to say "never, outside of our computers".

Which is exactly what I'm talking about? There is absolutely no reason, ever, why the Ottomans should join the Catholic league. There might be some historical sense in non-christians supporting the non-official side, but the war itself is outside their interest and any interference is better done in the form of subsidies and independent wars to take advantage of the empire's weakened state.

 

[Saintlukas]

We've never had the Ottomans described as "sunny" before though!

I can see a game now, ottoman empire, Inca's Sun religion, PRAISE IT!

 

[Chamboozer]

Which is exactly what I'm talking about? There is absolutely no reason, ever, why the Ottomans should join the Catholic league. There might be some historical sense in non-christians supporting the non-official side, but the war itself is outside their interest and any interference is better done in the form of subsidies and independent wars to take advantage of the empire's weakened state.

Yes. Everyone claiming that the Ottomans fought in the Thirty Years War seem to be forgetting that they did so indirectly and through a Protestant proxy, the Princes of Transylvania Gabriel Bethlen and George I Rakoczi. Non-Christians should never be directly joining either Protestant or Catholic leagues, intervention should come about through alliances with the members or separate wars.

 

[Rubidium]

Yes. Everyone claiming that the Ottomans fought in the Thirty Years War seem to be forgetting that they did so indirectly and through a Protestant proxy, the Princes of Transylvania Gabriel Bethlen and George I Rakoczi. Non-Christians should never be directly joining either Protestant or Catholic leagues, intervention should come about through alliances with the members or separate wars.

Part of the problem is that vassals can't fight their own wars that way.

 

[AurochsAway]

Yes. Everyone claiming that the Ottomans fought in the Thirty Years War seem to be forgetting that they did so indirectly and through a Protestant proxy, the Princes of Transylvania Gabriel Bethlen and George I Rakoczi. Non-Christians should never be directly joining either Protestant or Catholic leagues, intervention should come about through alliances with the members or separate wars.

This doesn't really work in the mechanics of EUIV though. Until that point I think joining is a fair abstraction.