• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Mar 10, 2011
918
0
So, I've been playing around with sticking to different succession types, and now I've been trying out prolonged seniority. True, it has lots of disadvantages, such as being almost always with short reign penalty instead of long reign bonus, and being stuck more often with drooling incapable bed-ridden wreck of a man, but there is a number of advantages. The obvious is, it allows for an easy unification of lands ruled by your wide-spread dynasty. But you still have to work beforehand to propagate your kinsmen all over the map at first. Also it protects lands from going outside of your dynasty due to being inherited by someone married matrilineally (or by female married normally), but elective helps here better.

However, there are two pretty major advantage, that add up over long periods of seniority. First, your dynasty prestige rockets, as it counts number of different occasions of titles held, so ten geezers holding crown for a year each grant ten times as much prestige points for the dynasty as one average guy ruling for ten years (and often people tend to put some young boy for many decades of rule). As your dynasty prestige rises, your kinsman all get greater starting bonus to prestige(from birth), and tend to marry people of higher descent (not wishing to marry minors due to "prestige effects"). That is already pretty great an advantage, especially if your dynasty is big and mostly outside of your direct control.
Second advantage is perhaps debatable, as it affects only the final score, but still, it allows for some ridiculous numbers in it as well. As prestige and piety are added to your score after the death of your current character, but can accumulate pretty much before you start playing as him, switching through ten dukes or kings, that lived eventful lifes before being controlled by you for couple years, adds maybe not ten times as much as you could achieve over the lifetime of dedicated control over one ruler from childhood to seniority, but still, few times more. Add to that effect of increased "base" prestige from births (and intradynastic marriages), that at some point reaches into thousands with seniority, and you are ensured to beat score of anyone that doesn't use it.

That is, if you manage to survive and keep your realm from ever-persistent threat of falling apart. But, well, it's too boring to have a stable realm of electives or primogenitures anyway.
 

Comradebot

On Double Secret Probation
77 Badges
Feb 13, 2012
3.929
534
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Rome Gold
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Cities: Skylines - Mass Transit
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • 500k Club
With the exception of trying to unite a bunch of scattered realms under one banner, no, its not realy superior to much. The constant changing of rulers and difficulty in insuring a decent heir far outweigh and bonuses. Unless you're in a situation where you'd like to try and unite all those lands (which can be rare), it's pretty poop. Most of the time, I'd even prefer Gavelkind.
 

The Bishop

Captain
41 Badges
Sep 29, 2012
374
147
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Stellaris
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
From a purely prestige gathering point of view I suppose it would be superior, if I read your post correctly. I, however, like to keep my heirs meticulously controlled and would try get out of seniority succession as quickly as possible after it has served its practical purposes.
 

Kimberly

Lt. General
31 Badges
Sep 16, 2012
1.694
400
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Semper Fi
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
How exactly does seniority help unite the family lands? It only works if the land your dynasty owns is actually set to seniority succession. And to change it to seniority, you need to own it in the first place, which defeats the purpose of the exercise.
 

mechaerik

First Lieutenant
41 Badges
Mar 19, 2011
216
0
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Darkest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Mount & Blade: Warband
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
How exactly does seniority help unite the family lands? It only works if the land your dynasty owns is actually set to seniority succession. And to change it to seniority, you need to own it in the first place, which defeats the purpose of the exercise.

The idea is that you die, and another ruler of your dynasty inherits your previous land. Then you set the inheritance laws of the new land to Seniority, and so on and so forth.
 

Sarog

Deus Vult
82 Badges
Jul 10, 2012
661
213
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Imperator: Rome Deluxe Edition
  • Prison Architect
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall Deluxe edition
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • 500k Club
The idea is that you die, and another ruler of your dynasty inherits your previous land. Then you set the inheritance laws of the new land to Seniority, and so on and so forth.

With the Rurikoviches being the best example of how you can abuse this to build a kingdom.


I really enjoy seniority. Old rulers and short reign penalties are a pain to deal with, but it isn't so bad if you keep your dynasty tree small. What I appreciate it for is that you play the whole extended family rather than just the senior line. Normally I lose track of what is going on in junior branches of my dynasty after a generation or two, unless they are important vassals of mine. With seniority you have a more intimate relationship with junior lines and I find that makes for a nice dynasty narrative.

I especially had fun with it in my one Byzantine game, because of how born with the purple interacted with seniority succession. I ended up exclusively playing characters who were sired by a sitting emperor, so the pool of eventual heirs was smaller and more manageable. I'm not sure if it is still like that though. At some point it stopped working like that for me, returning to normal seniority as if without born in the purple, and I wasn't sure if it was a bug. I'm haven't checked it in quite a while.
 

unmerged(600321)

Corporal
1 Badges
Nov 17, 2012
43
0
  • Crusader Kings II
Seniority can be good in specific situations, for example, when you want to unite several lands under one banner. However, in general, elective or primogeniture is better (Agnatic-Open is best, IMO, but its only an option when playing Muslim). I like to have a high stewardship ruler, preferably with Midas Touch, and hopefully with Genius. Marrying genius wives and educating my children myself (if I have Midas Touch, or transferring them to someone with Midas Touch at age 15 so they have a better chance of getting it), helps make transitions nice.

Seniority is great early on when trying to unite lands in your Dynasty (e.g. Starts in Castille, Rus, Aragon, Leon, etc). I usually don't go seniority even with these starts, but it is a solid option when you want to unify dynasty lands under one banner. Otherwise, seniority sucks and going with primogeniture is probably best. Note, I prefer elective to primogeniture when I am small because it lets me give my lands to a genius child instead of my first born son (I don't save scum, so genius almost never happens with primogeniture since my first born son rarely has the trait, and killing sons to get your oldest son to have it can be difficult). But once your get big, elective is not a good option as you can easily lose your Empire in a transition. As a general rule of thumb, I go elective till I get 2+ Kingdoms or an Empire. At that point, I go primogeniture (right before making or usurping second Kingdom or Empire).
 

Pinstar

First Lieutenant
60 Badges
Jul 24, 2011
236
18
pinstar.wordpress.com
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Knights of Pen and Paper 2
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Warlock 2: Wrath of the Nagas
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Cities: Skylines - Green Cities
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Surviving Mars
  • BATTLETECH
  • BATTLETECH - Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife Pre-Order
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Cities: Skylines Industries
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Prison Architect
  • Cities: Skylines - Natural Disasters
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Age of Wonders: Planetfall
  • 500k Club
  • Warlock 2: The Exiled
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Victoria 2
Starting out as a greek count who was able to obtain a dutchy, I had to switch to Seniority because the Byz was in medium, not high crown authority and I would be losing stuff with Gavelkind. After my son died... I randomly inherited the Kingdom of Croatia. Apparently my AI kinsmen did some sneaky barging into family trees on their own and I ended up accidentally doubling my holdings.