Is my fleet power normal for the year?

[Tepacana]

I have a 16K fleet in the year 2330, I've seen multiple forum posts where people have had 50K fleets in the year 2250, so I'm feeling like I need some help with having a good fleet in general.

I'm playing as a materialist militarist and xenophile empire who focus on tech, military defences and diplomacy (kind of as an all-round empire).

I've also just had the grey tempest show itself, and I think I can destroy one of their fleets with some help from allies/starbases etc.

Any tips for having a better fleet power? Also I've never seen 1M fleet power ever in-game.

I've played Stellaris for 750 hours so far FYI.

The fleet power of 16K in 2330 seems good against the other AIs in the game (I play on Captain difficulty, only seeing the other forum posts as mentioned at the start of the post made me think about this.

And, if possible, could you limit your tips to the confines of said empire as well, that way I might be able to implement said tips in the game I have going currently.

 

[Belhedler]

At default settings, seems fair to me while probably low on the research side. 50K on 2250. Even in dreams, it's unlikely.

 

[supreme]

Well in my experience with 2.2 your 16k fleet power in 2330 is perfectly normal as the AI dont really have much more than that. Even on Grand Admiral difficulty the AI will not be fielding much more than 30k fleet power by that point. I think the changes made to the economy and using alloys for ships now has made fleet sizes smaller and made the AI super weak.

 

[Tepacana]

Ok cool, also the Grey Tempest have rekt everything XD.

I wish the AI didn't have such an L-Cluster boner.

 

[The-False-Being26]

You really should use the AI to judge where you should be in a game. The AI is notoriously bad at playing the game. 16k seem a little low.

 

[Tepacana]

You really should use the AI to judge where you should be in a game. The AI is notoriously bad at playing the game. 16k seem a little low.

A slight problem is also that I can't really expand beyond that, because my naval capacity is 110, and I've used all of my starbase slots with the ones I need for trades and the rest as anchorage, each being upgraded to the highest starbase level I have available.

I also find that, especially at the start of the game, I never build ships myself, I just focus on other things. Then when I meet another empire I go "O CRAP BUILD SOME BOIS" and then after I militarise to an acceptable level, I chill out again and keep up after that. I wonder if other people do that, or if they find AIs to be a mere nuisance.

 

[Belhedler]

Ah about that... what's your strategy for trade starbase exactly? I likely had a similar issue until someone explained where I was (very) wrong. btw the bad stuff I used was something widely used by streamers.

 

[Tepacana]

I try and build a trade starbase where there is a large concentration of trade value, and try and have them as close to the capital as I can to reduce piracy, while making sure all of the trade value in the area is in reach if I build the trade stations I can build. EG: at the start of the game where I can only have 2 trade outposts per starbase, I make sure all the trade value I want to get is within two jumps of that starbase. I pick a system which satisfies my conditions and build in it. Is there a more efficient way to build trade starbases? if so, please let me know.

 

[Belhedler]

How many trade modules and how do you place them? I used to do 3 trade hubs / 3 hangar bays (that's something widely used by streamers, or at least that was the case the last time I looked). I think you should read this and see if you already apply that or not. The difference is dramatic for your navy cap and piracy protection.

 

[Tepacana]

My issue with the need for more trade bases is the fact that I (right now at least) can only have a maximum of 4 modules on a starbase. Normally, I would use all of these module slots for trade hubs because I need the trade value collection range. I never seem to need to put any effort into trade protection anyway, despite clearly having way more trade value than the protection value.

(also how the hell does he have 217 alloys per month in 2340!? and enough minerals to convert and another 200 per month!?)

 

[Belhedler]

You can say you. It's me there too

I'm actually a bit low. I should be 15% higher than that.

The build I'm using is the Charismatic Materialist variant presented in details here

But tbh the main reason I'm quite successful here is that I have the Precusor event's ecumenopolis despite not having Megacorp DLC.

However that was my first touch with 2.2.3 and I failed to understand how to be successful in research in this version so I'm quite falling behind in research compared to the level I should have reached.

 

[Tepacana]

But you still have 6-module starbases and 400+ trade power in 2340?

This is also my 5th or so go game after 2.2.*, so I've gotten somewhat used to the new economy update.

(Also as a small aside, I live in England, and it's nearly midnight here, so don't be surprised if I stop replying suddenly due to new year's eve and stuff.)

 

[Belhedler]

But you still have 6-module starbases and 400+ trade power in 2340?

Yes I do. Is it too low? I haven't applied the gene-modding part of the guide I wrote yet, despite having unlocked the +2 traits long ago. So I'm actually quite below my expected research and trade value output (should be respectively +10% and +25%)

This is also my 5th or so go game after 2.2.*, so I've gotten somewhat used to the new economy update.

First one for me. Learning the ropes of the release in a non-iron man game in 2.2.3.

(Also as a small aside, I live in England, and it's nearly midnight here, so don't be surprised if I stop replying suddenly due to new year's eve and stuff.)

As you can see I'm French so it's the same for me

 

[Tepacana]

I'm amazed at how high the trade power is and how you have 6-module starbases by that time! I still only had starholds, and my trade power was about 190 10 years before that.

(Also happy new year)

 

[Belhedler]

I'm amazed at how high the trade power is and how you have 6-module starbases by that time! I still only had starholds, and my trade power was about 190 10 years before that.

I think the key is to focus on research and spam the research edict as soon as you stopped expanding. tbh I'm behind schedule and I haven't used the +10% research ascension perk either (4 perks unlocked but only 2 taken and 2 in waiting). Also it took me too long to understand how exotic gas was critical for a strong research. I should be much higher in research at this point and this should have increased even more my economy and navy. I'm at tier 3 regarding ship loadout. Just unlocked battleship.

(Also happy new year)

Happy new year to you too.

 

[Tepacana]

I'm at a similar point on tech, but with tier 4 shields and tier 2 speciality weapons, (plasma, auto-cannon etc.), which I've worked out are equivalent to tier 4 things.

I tend to do quite well on strategic resources, however, and I never have +0 of any of the three base ones after I get them going at around 2270 / 2280. Spamming researchers definitely is the way to go on top of Technological Ascendancy and having science ships assist research, I agree on those fronts.

I guess these things will come with practice, and that won't be a problem, because I love Stellaris, it's my favourite game.

Getting back to the issue at hand, I'll try and keep a 30K fleet by 2350 as a goal, and keep optimising my way towards that through experimentation and practice, as I usually do when I want to start a new learning curve in this game. If I do that, I'll set a goal at 40K by that year and so on.

I kinda miss the 2.0 version where I could have a 90K fleet with two titans by 2400. But alas, this is not so. But it will be again. *Queue inspiring speech by current leader*

 

[Sinister2202]

Fleet power seem okay in 2300s. But how about your research income?

 

[Badesumofu]

My usual benchmarks are that I aim to have a big enough fleet to kill marauders before 2350. By around 2350 - 2360 I'll aim to have about 3 full fleets of Giga-Neutron BBs alongside a couple of fleets of 180 vettes. I use those to kill an FE and steal their tech. Then I incorporate that tech into my fleet and usually aim to get a 4th BB fleet ready and go steamroll the remaining FEs to make sure they are not going to mess things up (and take their stuff) this should be done by 2400 (so they can't wake up which they will very quickly if you have previously taken one out). Then you basically have 50 years to prepare for the crisis. You should have a very powerful economy by this point and aim to field as many as 10 full BB fleets and possibly more.

Sometime between 2280 and 2320 your economy should explode - you go from 20 or 30k fleet power to a couple of hundred K pretty quickly.

 

[B3ndolf]

whilst it is easily possible to have much bigger fleet numbers than you have at that date it isnt really necessary when playing on captain so your doing fine as long as you can deal with all the AI, the only problems you might have with that size of fleet are things like the grey tempest and the khan.

as for how to pay for bigger fleets by that time get an ecumenopolis

also for fleet power dont forget that once you get an early tech your soldier pops all give you 2 fleet power, once i have a decent pop and established economy i make sure i have at least one stronghold on each planet for extra soldier pops for the fleet power bonus. if you have 10 planets thats 40 fleet power and some unity for a minimal cost. since i always take ecumenopoli i usually have the spare motes to upgrade most of them too.

try to spread your trade starbases so you collect as much trade as possible with as few starbases as possible, i generally dont worry about collecting every last drop of trade in the early game, i will get it all eventually once i get the tech to upgrade the starbases and it really doesnt matter if you miss a couple of trade power here or there, the vast majority of trade comes from planets anyway so make sure you have all of them covered. for a moderate sized empire you can usually get away with 2 or at most 3 trade starbases once they are fully upgraded.

and remember unless you want to go conquering you only need to keep your fleet at about the same size as your neighbours, any more than that is wasted maintenance. outside of that there are only a couple of points in the game you might want to increase the fleet size, firstly at 2300 to deal with the khan, whenever you want to open the l-gate or whenever the ai open it to deal with the grey tempest, whenever you want to deal with your first fe and at 2400 to deal with crises.

 

[Tim_Ward]

I've seen multiple forum posts where people have had 50K fleets in the year 2250

Those people are either following some kind of crazy min-maxing snowball esque strategy not relevant for normal play, or lying.

Also? Any resources spent on the military are *wasted* unless the military is doing one of the following things:

a) Expanding your territory
b) Preventing someone from expanding into your territory
c) Deterring someone from expanding into your territory
d) Convincing someone that you'd make a real cool ally, in the aid of b) or c)

Thus, having a fleet power wildly in excess of what the AI has on a given date is pointless, and likely a sign that you're playing on too low a difficulty level. Or that you need to install Glavius stat.

The only guide for what your fleet power should be is 'can I win the next war with it', not what some min-maxers or more experienced players are doing, or claim they're doing on the forum.

Any tips for having a better fleet power?

Have a plan for getting a solid alloy income and make it a priority.

That was my mistake when I started with 2.2. I was used to 2.0 where you could just build whatever ships you wanted from your massive mineral income, and its actually quite easy to just sort of drift into not having enough alloys what with everything else demanding your attention, then suddenly you're like "oh shit, why does it take forever to build a fleet".