Is it worth it to build an Italian Navy? If so what stragity would be most effective for the war?
Is it worth it to build an Italian Navy?
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I'd say Yes, in most games (depending on your goals)
A larger more modern navy would help you close the Suez, which is what you need to hurt the Brits. Also, it could lead to a total lockdown of the Med.
Carriers would be prefered, or a surface fleet if you can supply enough air cover to negate enemy CV's
A larger more modern navy would help you close the Suez, which is what you need to hurt the Brits. Also, it could lead to a total lockdown of the Med.
Carriers would be prefered, or a surface fleet if you can supply enough air cover to negate enemy CV's
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I always keep it with a strong navy in the med and leave the land warfare in europe to germany. I mostly concentrate on greece, albania and africa, which also needs a strong navy...so i say yes too
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CVs in the med? What a waste. It's full of islands that can support a far more effective naval air force.
As Italy, I'll stick with their four historical BBs and a suitable quantity of screens/escorts, and focus far more effort on land-based fighters and naval bombers to fight the Royal Navy and bomb supply convoys bound for Malta.
As Italy, I'll stick with their four historical BBs and a suitable quantity of screens/escorts, and focus far more effort on land-based fighters and naval bombers to fight the Royal Navy and bomb supply convoys bound for Malta.
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Depends on your strategy.
But yeah if you want to defend your supply lines and operations in your colonies in Africa you need a Navy along with support from your airforce
If you just want to do a Balkan empire and then turtle in Europe you can do with what you have.
But yeah if you want to defend your supply lines and operations in your colonies in Africa you need a Navy along with support from your airforce
If you just want to do a Balkan empire and then turtle in Europe you can do with what you have.
Interesting question. Assuming an Axis Italy I see two options:
1. turtle up in continental Europe. Abandon Africa, garrison ports and focus on air and land to support the Wehrmacht.
2. control the Med. Build up a mobile force and shift everything but the kitchen sink to Libya. In 1940 join Germany and blitz the hell out of the Desert Rats. Seize Egypt quickly and close the Suez Canal. Fortify Egypt and press on towards the oil fields of Iraq. Ideally take Gibraltar or at least Malta. Strong airforce to cover the Med. This will obviously mean that Germany is on her own against Russia.
I prefer the second option. You can still forget about the navy for the most part. It hinges upon you getting your invasion force to Africa while still at peace. Once at war you have to quickly meet your goals to close off the Med. Then you won't have to worry about the navy anymore. If everything goes according to plan then the initial navy should suffice.
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Absolutely - having a navy isn't an end in itself, but a tool for a purpose. Your purpose is to build a new Roman empire starting in North Africa, and Malta is the key. If Malta is defended by one man and his dog as it was in 3, just take it in a surprise attack. If it's not so easy this time around, then Aaronomus' advice looks good to me.
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You guys are correct, CVs are not a good idea for Italy until 1941 at the earliest. However if Italy starts with outstanding surface fleet technology like in Hoi3 I would recommend at least 2 more BBs. I don't know how this will fit in with Italy's economic situation in Hoi4, but BBs absorb a lot of damage and are great for whittling down escort ships - in addition to coastal bombardment uses, obviously.
Taking the Suez and Malta in '40 is the main objective, and if you can take Yugo, Albania, Greece before Italy enters the war you'll have an easier time.
Once the middle east is Axis controlled Turkey is an easy target. From there the Caucasus will be a nice little playground for all your excellent Alpine divisions.
Taking the Suez and Malta in '40 is the main objective, and if you can take Yugo, Albania, Greece before Italy enters the war you'll have an easier time.
Once the middle east is Axis controlled Turkey is an easy target. From there the Caucasus will be a nice little playground for all your excellent Alpine divisions.
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If it's a historical-ish diplomatic set-up, a more powerful Italian navy puts pressure on the RN (and USN later), and can make life easier for the Japanese, so from a perspective of 'what's best for the Axis as a whole', Italy's navy and air force are worth a bit of attention. If it's an ahistorical diplomatic set-up, it depends a lot on the set-up (and Italy allied with the UK need not worry, for example ).
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Italy havent already a navy?
i think would be not possible build up too large navy, cause a lack of oil....
I agree with @Aaronomus. With all the islands, I think a strong airforce can lock down the Med faily well. Cheaper too I bet. Though I would need a decent surface fleet for patrolling and invasions of Malta, Cyprus, and Crete.
As Italy, I would like to conquer Africa and the Middle East. Maybe go a little Alexander the Great on the East
As Italy, I would like to conquer Africa and the Middle East. Maybe go a little Alexander the Great on the East
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With the new air and naval mechanisms in Hoi4, I have become very interested in playing as Italy with the goal of locking down the Mediterranean from the British. From wikipedia, we can see Italy's ambitions.
Im just speculating here, but as other have mentioned above, I think major priority should be given to the air force in dealing with British shipping in the Med. Naval bombers would be a much cheaper and expendable option. However, that doesn't negate the navy and submarines by any means. The Italian Navy needs to be rebuilt, but it will be weak initially and must avoid major battles with the British until it is of proper strength. Italy will need natural resources and oil, as well as, lots of coastline to produce shipping.
I think Greece and Yugoslavia will be easy pickings. Spain, Gibraltar, French African colonies followed by British Egypt, Syria, and other rich oil fields in the region would ultimately be my goals.
Im just speculating here, but as other have mentioned above, I think major priority should be given to the air force in dealing with British shipping in the Med. Naval bombers would be a much cheaper and expendable option. However, that doesn't negate the navy and submarines by any means. The Italian Navy needs to be rebuilt, but it will be weak initially and must avoid major battles with the British until it is of proper strength. Italy will need natural resources and oil, as well as, lots of coastline to produce shipping.
I think Greece and Yugoslavia will be easy pickings. Spain, Gibraltar, French African colonies followed by British Egypt, Syria, and other rich oil fields in the region would ultimately be my goals.
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I don't know about you but so far I have seen that building a large air force of both land and sea based aircraft and have them patrol all Mediterranean, can grant a major safety net against British ships for some time, at least until you take Egypt and Suez, after which you can close off the sea completely.
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Yes you should build up your navy if you want to be overlord of the Mediterranean. Update your navy, Without an updated navy you will lose your grip on the Med unless you plan on using a lot of air support. Also another thing do not build aircraft carriers you have plenty of bases you can station planes in to support your navy. Only build aircraft carriers if you plan on expanding outside the Med.
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so CV vs BB is a lot like galley vs line ships in eu4. obviously for entirely different reasons, but the idea is, if you can project your air force from shore effectively, you dont need to bring it out to bear on board a ship.
This is a follow up to my earlier post, but here we can see Italy's resource production....
I has no oil, rubber, Tungsten, or chromium. This is not a really good situation.
However, we can see on the very right chromium in Albania and Yugoslavia.
Anyone find a map with the resource values of regions?
I has no oil, rubber, Tungsten, or chromium. This is not a really good situation.
However, we can see on the very right chromium in Albania and Yugoslavia.
Anyone find a map with the resource values of regions?
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As GuderianTA has outlined, the Italian player will need to develop his resources before he can really do much, but given German superiority on land, it can definitely be worth it to build up the Italian Navy. Using a stronger navy, Italy can knock out Malta, take control of shipping through the Suez, and perhaps even take Gibraltar. Once you have used your limited land forces to capture additional territory in the Balkans (and hey, if you're committed you could probably beat down Spain too), then you can afford to gear up for war and really make a push on North Africa and the Middle East.
Of course, much of this is really just fantasizing. Build up your navy and handle the Brits. That will do a lot for the Axis cause in the Mediterranean. Then begin that slow Roman expansion in the Balkans (and hey, why stop there?).
Of course, much of this is really just fantasizing. Build up your navy and handle the Brits. That will do a lot for the Axis cause in the Mediterranean. Then begin that slow Roman expansion in the Balkans (and hey, why stop there?).
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The biggest question is what happens to Britain. If Germany doesn't go after the USSR and fights the British to the death instead, an Italian navy could be very useful for breaking out of the Mediterranean to help in a decisive battle (assuming Germany focused on building the Kriegsmarine). If Britain isn't a major objective for Germany post-France, Italy should use land based air and rush to lock down the Med, and then focus on grabbing the Middle East and linking up with Germany in Baku. After that, they would have the resources and hopefully industry to do whatever is necessary to hold these gains.
I suspect resources is something that will be balanced in the beta so even if there is a resource map it may change before release. It looks like Italy needs France for steel and Balkans for chromium.
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A navy and more important a LAND based airforce is very important for italy if it wants to compete in the Mediterranean. BBs with Destroyers and other smaller ships to act as an escort would be vital along with Interceptors with good range and naval bombers.
Planning a carrier fleet for italy vastly over estimates its resources and production power and after all you have the unsinkable "carriers" of the Italian peninsula, sicily, sardania, and provinces in north Africa that just need an airport that will give you the same effect for much cheaper.
Planning a carrier fleet for italy vastly over estimates its resources and production power and after all you have the unsinkable "carriers" of the Italian peninsula, sicily, sardania, and provinces in north Africa that just need an airport that will give you the same effect for much cheaper.
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