Is it just me or are the Ottomans completely insane in 1.33?

[Vapiritapiri]

How did Hungary protect against the ottomans IRL?

 

[AvengedK1ng]

How did Hungary protect against the ottomans IRL?

Protecting serbia for ages
Not pissing off Venice
Getting papal sunsidies
Proactively intervening in wallachia
Hunyadi getting parts of bohemia and Austria under his belt
Centralising realm and Hungary not having true feudalism until later

 

[BennBenn]

I noticed something else in my recent run as knights. At around 1460~70 I was at mil tech 6, Otto at 5 without embracing renaissance. All my allies were at 4 or 5, in this case Austria+Hungary, Poland, Papal States (+ my own vassal Byzantium, not sure about their tech), I think most of them with renaissance. Half way through the war the Ottos had reached tech 7, I was still ahead of time and could have taken tech 7 for +10%, all my allies were still at 5, Poland even at 4! Now in this case I understand why they won’t engage any battle or why we loose these so significantly even when outnumbering the Ottoman 2:1.

So how come the Ottomans are so effective in rushing mil tech ahead of whole Europe, even though they are embracing institutions later? Or how can I make sure that my allies tech up in time? Delaying the dow would help the Ottomans becoming even stronger I guess…

 

[AvengedK1ng]

I noticed something else in my recent run as knights. At around 1460~70 I was at mil tech 6, Otto at 5 without embracing renaissance. All my allies were at 4 or 5, in this case Austria+Hungary, Poland, Papal States (+ my own vassal Byzantium, not sure about their tech), I think most of them with renaissance. Half way through the war the Ottos had reached tech 7, I was still ahead of time and could have taken tech 7 for +10%, all my allies were still at 5, Poland even at 4! Now in this case I understand why they won’t engage any battle or why we loose these so significantly even when outnumbering the Ottoman 2:1.

So how come the Ottomans are so effective in rushing mil tech ahead of whole Europe, even though they are embracing institutions later? Or how can I make sure that my allies tech up in time? Delaying the dow would help the Ottomans becoming even stronger I guess…

Mehmed is 6/4/6 and has economy for good advisors

 

[Ferdinand_Bardamu]

I have an Oirat > Yuan game right now. The year is 1527. I've conquered all of China (East Asia in general), the Steppes (except for Crimea), Moscow, a significant chunk of Persia.

The Ottomans have eliminated Poland, 1/3 of Lithuania and the Mamluks.

They have a forceimit of 250k and are running near it...

Like I've said a million times, I know I can win the war, it's just so .... boring. It's so boring to fight this same stupid war over and over again. And you know what will happen right? I'll blow all my professionalism and mil points fighting this war to beat them, and then they'll just immediately turn round and annex Hungary or Austria.

The closest I've come to quitting EU4 is my frustration at how boring these Ottoman wars are. At least if I had to face a super strong Russia or PLC it'd be new...

Really struggle to see how the developers don't see an issue with one nation being so ridiculously overpowered but whatever.

Above all else, please ban Quantity ideas Ottomans. It's just a joke at this point.

 

[Ferdinand_Bardamu]

I'll give specifics to the post above...

The year is 1527.

They have a forcelimit of 240k.

They have 156k men right now with 142k manpower.

Muscovy who are huge have a forcelimit of 65k before I even beaten them...

And this isn't an issue because 'reasons'. I'm fairly sure whenever I discover France on the map they'll only have 60-70k.

 

[AvengedK1ng]

I have an Oirat > Yuan game right now. The year is 1527. I've conquered all of China (East Asia in general), the Steppes (except for Crimea), Moscow, a significant chunk of Persia.

The Ottomans have eliminated Poland, 1/3 of Lithuania and the Mamluks.

Screenshot? Sounds really weird ai would do that unless diet missions

They have a forceimit of 250k and are running near it...

Like I've said a million times, I know I can win the war, it's just so .... boring. It's so boring to fight this same stupid war over and over again. And you know what will happen right? I'll blow all my professionalism and mil points fighting this war to beat them,

Why do you need to fight them?

and then they'll just immediately turn round and annex Hungary or Austria.

You could guarantee AH or threaten Ottos and snake to every other tag

The closest I've come to quitting EU4 is my frustration at how boring these Ottoman wars are. At least if I had to face a super strong Russia or PLC it'd be new...

But they wouldn't have as good an economy

Really struggle to see how the developers don't see an issue with one nation being so ridiculously overpowered but whatever.

Because ottomans were the major power in the eastern med for 400 years?

Above all else, please ban Quantity ideas Ottomans. It's just a joke at this point.

Should we ban it from france or Austria considering how absurd their fl can get?

 

[Opanashc]

How did Hungary protect against the ottomans IRL?

Logistics. By the time an Ottoman army reached the Danube, campaigning season would be almost over.

 

[Sukramo]

Here is my current game. Utterly insane beyond even whats normal. Yes I am gimping myself due to doing the Mullhouse run and thus getting the completly garbage "Richkrieg" instead of revoke the priviligia. But still. Protestant miliatry bonuses, max tier defender of faith, Quantity, Offensive, Quality, golden era, military advisor, max army professionalism. I started the war by using the special CB to call in the entire empire. We had about 1.6 million men, he had 800k.

After 9 years every single imperial prince expect Brandenburg had peaced out. 1.5 million dead Ottomans and he still hasent called in mercs yet.

Yes, in pure value i win, but quanity reanimates his armies with easy. You send his 200k stacks fleeing over and over again. While this war was abit of a joke (already got my Mullhouse achi and waiting on truces to give Lippe all of GB for that achi), this really shows how utterly bananas late game Ottos with quantity can be.

I think the biggest joke here is that half his territory occupied +1.5 million dead over 9 years= 4.8 war exhaustion and no rebels at all. What a joke. -7 unrest in one of his greek provinces. Lolololol.

 

[Sharples88]

Here is my current game. Utterly insane beyond even whats normal. Yes I am gimping myself due to doing the Mullhouse run and thus getting the completly garbage "Richkrieg" instead of revoke the priviligia. But still. Protestant miliatry bonuses, max tier defender of faith, Quantity, Offensive, Quality, golden era, military advisor, max army professionalism. I started the war by using the special CB to call in the entire empire. We had about 1.6 million men, he had 800k.

After 9 years every single imperial prince expect Brandenburg had peaced out. 1.5 million dead Ottomans and he still hasent called in mercs yet.

Yes, in pure value i win, but quanity reanimates his armies with easy. You send his 200k stacks fleeing over and over again. While this war was abit of a joke (already got my Mullhouse achi and waiting on truces to give Lippe all of GB for that achi), this really shows how utterly bananas late game Ottos with quantity can be.

I think the biggest joke here is that half his territory occupied +1.5 million dead over 9 years= 4.8 war exhaustion and no rebels at all. What a joke. -7 unrest in one of his greek provinces. Lolololol.

View attachment 830034

The warscore would've been vastly different if you used a different CB. A lot of wars in EU4 take preference to the CB you pick. Obviously you always want to occupy a war goal as soon as possible. Choosing superiority against the Ottomans is perhaps the worst combination you can go for. You picked a bad CB that you couldn't handle; And the AI certainly will get destroyed from them.

Hovering over the warscore would most likely should a clearer picture. Perhaps -40 from battles and -25 from the war goal. Sieging is not going to do you much here.

 

[Sukramo]

The warscore would've been vastly different if you used a different CB. A lot of wars in EU4 take preference to the CB you pick. Obviously you always want to occupy a war goal as soon as possible. Choosing superiority against the Ottomans is perhaps the worst combination you can go for. You picked a bad CB that you couldn't handle; And the AI certainly will get destroyed from them.

Hovering over the warscore would most likely should a clearer picture. Perhaps -40 from battles and -25 from the war goal. Sieging is not going to do you much here.

Oh belive me, I'm fully aware of how awful "win battle" cb is. My allies tanked the war score of the war with battles. I would probably have gotten 40+ % if I went for Imperial ban of a certain province instead but if was a Mullhouse experiment and a joy to call in the entire empire. But the point was to test the strengh Ottomans, and the truth is that 1.5 million causalties is barly an inconvinience for them.

Would have liked to see how long I could have held Constantinople by luring them in. Sadly some of their 50 stacks went to my undefended core homelands and I had to peace out and end this experiment.

 

[Sharples88]

Oh belive me, I'm fully aware of how awful "win battle" cb is. My allies tanked the war score of the war with battles. I would probably have gotten 40+ % if I went for Imperial ban of a certain province instead but if was a Mullhouse experiment and a joy to call in the entire empire. But the point was to test the strengh Ottomans, and the truth is that 1.5 million causalties is barly an inconvinience for them.

Would have liked to see how long I could have held Constantinople by luring them in. Sadly some of their 50 stacks went to my undefended core homelands and I had to peace out and end this experiment.

I see. My guess is that with the quantity ideas they probably have, they're using slacken recruiting standards. Ottomans tend to have the highest professionalism in the game and it ramps up really fast.

 

[EllisDee]

Apparently people freel like the game needs a fictional endboss tag to prolong the game by 20 more years when they get bored of blobbing by the 1550s.

Also, the Ottomans get great rulers meaning they are ahead of west europe in technology, "because they sieged Wien, so its historical". No mentions of them loosing to Albania and what nerfs they should get to represent that.

Also, by that standard, France, Manchu and Britain who conquered way more should get 20 star generals and + 8000% siege ability.

So in short, the Ottomans are kept intentionaly OP for meme blobbing challenge fun.

That's a lot of whine, mixed with whinging about perceived inauthentic/ahistorical presentation of a country in a game where you can conquer the world as tiny islands like Mann and Ryukyu.

 

[Kerham]

The most annoying thing about Ottomans is not how they look when they're successful, but that they're successful 100% of times if player is around there (meaning if you do play say in Indonesia there might be once in a blue moon a successful Byzantium, but that will never happen if you play as, say, Bosnia, without direct player intervention).

Austria has a chance to not get the PU over Hungary (way too low, if you ask me). Hungary has an extremely low chance of doing anything. PLC has a medium chance of never uniting. Muscovites can be locked by some lucky Novgorodian alliance or by hordes. Mamluks can fall to rebels or be held in place by Persia/Timurids etc

Not the Ottomans. Nothing happens there, no civil war, no existential choice, no rebels, nothing. According to PDX, Ottomans have invented the perfect state on the face of Earth, circa 1440 AD.

 

[AvengedK1ng]

The most annoying thing about Ottomans is not how they look when they're successful, but that they're successful 100% of times if player is around there (meaning if you do play say in Indonesia there might be once in a blue moon a successful Byzantium, but that will never happen if you play as, say, Bosnia, without direct player intervention).

Austria has a chance to not get the PU over Hungary (way too low, if you ask me).

Why? Matthias Corvinus got the throne irl and was able to conquer in both Austria and Bohemia

Hungary has an extremely low chance of doing anything

They go for Bosnia i find, and can full annex wallachia in 1 war now

. PLC has a medium chance of never uniting. Muscovites can be locked by some lucky Novgorodian alliance or by hordes. Mamluks can fall to rebels or be held in place by Persia/Timurids etc

Fall to rebels? Huh. If no strong mamlukes i tend to see them push into iraq

Not the Ottomans. Nothing happens there, no civil war, no existential choice, no rebels, nothing. According to PDX, Ottomans have invented the perfect state on the face of Earth, circa 1440 AD.

The last few patches you could get even genoa declaring war after the 2nd or 3rd player war vs them

 

[Kerham]

Why? Matthias Corvinus got the throne irl and was able to conquer in both Austria and Bohemia

I should rephrase. Austria's chance of getting the PU is too high. You're basically restating my point. Hungary AI has a very low chance of being the historical Hungary, while Ottomans are guranteed to be succesful. Another example is Castille and Aragon's marital union. It was one of the most significant moments of their time, with so many implications. Ingame though, it is a choice, not something which happens automatically. Conversely, Ottomans adopting the specific government should be a choice. Mehmet II Fatih had a political direction, he wanted to curb both ulema and the traditional Turkish artistocracy when he adopted his reforms. Those didn't came without struggle, he had some opposition and that is not represented. In time, the pasha system and the government of eunuchs and harems became a great source of corruption and instability, which also are not represented. Ingame Ottomans only have the blessings, so to say, of historical Ottomans, but not their hardships. As a consequence, for example Ramazan, independent IRL until 1517 could very well end up being Ottoman as fast as 1460-1470, depending how events align.

 

[Rawme]

Apparently people freel like the game needs a fictional endboss tag to prolong the game by 20 more years when they get bored of blobbing by the 1550s.

Also, the Ottomans get great rulers meaning they are ahead of west europe in technology, "because they sieged Wien, so its historical". No mentions of them loosing to Albania and what nerfs they should get to represent that.

Also, by that standard, France, Manchu and Britain who conquered way more should get 20 star generals and + 8000% siege ability.

So in short, the Ottomans are kept intentionaly OP for meme blobbing challenge fun.

Ottomans get pretty weak the later the game goes, so the idea of them being an end game boss is dumb. Like, its annoying having to take their land then keep waiting until the truce is over.

 

[Ferdinand_Bardamu]

But but but people on Paradox forums told me that the Ottomans never vital Southern Italy and take Naples.

Cue Ottoman fanboys....

 

[Ferdinand_Bardamu]

Just for reference these posts got upvoted and my retorts got downvoted:

Not only does that pretty much never happen but I've never seen them mark anything in Italy as provinces of interest so they don't ever take it anyway. And even so, they won't be coming after further Italian states anyway since they're pretty much scripted to go after their mission claims.

Played about a dozen games so far and I've never seen them take any land in southern Italy. A lot of times they don't even take Epirus despite continually declaring war on it.

Regardless, Papal States isn't exactly a hard start and you're not at any real risk of the Ottomans war dec'ing you before 1550 anyway. You have 100 years to take over Italy and whatever else you want with relative ease and even then can just ally France or Spain and the Ottos will never bother you.

 

[durbal]

Yeah because it pretty much never happens.