Is HoI4 the neglected child of Paradox Interactive?

[Axe99]

Something else to keep in mind is that HoI4 is by far the most technically complicated timeperiod to cover with game and combat mechanics being expected to span over and connect land, sea and air warfare + areas integreating them all ( like Carriers ).

The average knowledge of WW2 also is much greater meaning even small deviations get picked up much easier then say if the wrong duke or whatever was scripted in CK2.

So much this - HoI4 is orders of magnitude more technically complicated in terms of warfare (the key element of gameplay in most PDS games), while at the same time having a far better informed playerbase (naval warfare is better in HoI4 relative to how it behaved historically than any other PDS game, ever (obviously not excluding Stellaris ) - but HoI4 gets far more naval complaints, because people know far more about naval warfare in WW2 than they do in medieval times, or during the Napoleonic era, for example.

The issue isn't a case of whether HoI4 hasn't got the resources (we've just heard from about the best possible source that it absolutely has) but that it's a far bigger problem to solve - so even with more resources, progress my feel slow, because the work required to, say, represent Chinese warlords is far more involved than the similar work required to represent a similar region in EU4 or CK2, say. From what I can see, though, the team are making huge amounts of progress, and from what we've been shown WTT/Cornflakes looks like it'll be another big step forward

 

[astec]

There are lots of myths in this thread.

The HoI4 team before release was at its core a really large team, and also augmented with members from other projects for a long time.

Saying, "it had just one AI programmer" is a bit weird in comparison to other projects, as its the only project with a 100% dedicated AI developer.

When Wiz was doing AI on HoI4, he was also at the same time the AI programmer for Eu4, CK2 & Stellaris, rotating between all projects.

HoI4 is not a neglected game at Paradox. It was so important for us, that in early 2015 I left the Management Team of Paradox, to spend 100% of my time to lead the project to an alpha-state a year later.

Can we get a confirmation that the goals outlined by @podcat will initiate a return to fuel usage (making soviet and pacific logistics a thing) and a more realistic supply system? Because currently the "shared edge provinces" supply thing creates horrendous issues in China (for the chinese side) when the front is stalled along the Yangzi River.

 

[safe-keeper]

HOI4 is also a pretty ambitious beast, the devs too have said so. The battle planner/AI system alone is going to be hard to get right.

 

[astec]

HOI4 is also a pretty ambitious beast, the devs too have said so. The battle planner/AI system alone is going to be hard to get right.

Not to mention the fact that you can't get planning bonus on naval invasions or fallback lines. Making defense in depth (ie backhand blow or counter-attack) very difficult because you need that offensive bonus. +Japan will almost never be able to duplicate its historical pacific conquests

 

[Carlyle1]

@Johan I think most of the grief comes because you bring up fixes to critical issues with DLCs for every 4 month.

What if you were to release bug, ai, balance ?, graphics, game speed DDs like you had in EU4 maybe weekly. Seperate from DLC content, you release DLCs once per every 6 months but we need those fixes maybe monthly.

 

[Micah Goodman 2]

I don't think this is quite far. Paradox has been open about this: statistics show that Germany is far and away the most-played country. (That's not necessarily true among forum users, but there's a "silent majority" effect here.) So what's the best way to sell DLC? Rationally, it means throwing in something that affects Germany. The development team has to balance efforts that improve the core game and keep the community happy in the long term, with things that will sell immediately and bring the new capital that makes continuing development possible. I'm sure they're not always happy with the sacrifices that entails.

And maybe if other countries were improved people would play them. Maybe if naval combat wasn't broken people would play Japan, or the UK or the US more. It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. Make Germany fun to play, add new content for Germany and people will play Germany. Make the US largely boring to play and people won't play it. Ignore improvements for the US and people once again won't play as the US. Any country largely dependent on naval combat won't be fun to play because naval combat is broken. The first play through from Paradox on the new, theoretically Chinese themed dlc? Germany. That shows exactly their mindset. Complaints about the AI endlessly shifting units making Germany unplayable, that gets fixed. The fact that the US can't base air units in the UK because the UK spams units in the UK, making the US unplayable? That's not a problem. Subs don't work? You can still play Germany. Again, it seriously hampers the US and Japan. That gets ignored. You know who really needs a NF tree upgrade? It sure as heck wasn't Germany. Yet that makes it into a dlc, that again, supposedly focuses on China, Germany. In what world does that make any sense? People play Germany primarily for two reasons first, can the player change history and win the war where Germany historically lost. Of the three dlc's released or about to be released 2 have improved German game play. And that is the second reason people play Germany so much. They want to test out the new game mechanics.

Why play as the Soviet Union when the AI is so abysmal stupid that all you have to do is spam infantry divisions and zerg swamp the Germans? Why play Japan, when you can steam roll China game after game after game. Why play the US when naval combat is broken, the Japanese AI is too inept to offer any challenge in the Pacific and half your game is a waste of time? A year and a half after release and this game is still unplayable with any sense of enjoyment in its vanilla form. No other major Paradox title has ever focused on one country and improving it as HoI 4 has on Germany. CK 2 and EU 4 bring new content into those titles to improve a variety of playable countries with every new patch.

HoI 4 dlc's started with Tofv and content wise it was a joke. Aside from Commonwealth tech sharing and new NF trees for those countries it did very little. It didn't fundamentally make Canada any more enjoyable to play. DoD? Same thing but for some Axis minor countries. Hell, DoD didn't even include Finland. How was that decision reached? Instead, we got NF trees that allowed for the recreation of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. smh. The only real game changing element with DoD was licence production, which does help Germany push along it's minor Axis partners. A nice feature but hardly worth the cost of a dlc. The problem for me is three fold, the HoI 4 team focuses too much on improving extras for Germany, has allowed basic game play elements that don't work to continue in a broken state for far too long, and improving or adding features in the dlc's that should be in the base game. Things like air resupply. Features that existed in prior HoI games. It's like this dev team is going back and reinventing the wheel and then saying, 'taa daa' look at how we have improved the game! Umm... no. You left out features from a prior title added it into this one and if that's not enough are going to charge people MORE money for it. I'm sorry I like Paradox products on the whole. I have just about every dlc for CK 2 and EU 4, aside from a few music ones and the only dlc I haven't enjoyed was Conclave. Granted, this new dlc for HoI 4 does seem to be an improvement over the other 2 but the base game is still in bad shape.

To give Paradox credit where credit is due, even they realized that the first two dlc's were so lack luster that they are compensating people like me who paid for the first 2 dlc's when the game was first released. But that nicely illustrates that even they realize that thus far, this title and the way it has been handled is like trying to eat a soup sandwich.

 

[Carlyle1]

And maybe if other countries were improved people would play them. Maybe if naval combat wasn't broken people would play Japan, or the UK or the US more. It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy. Make Germany fun to play, add new content for Germany and people will play Germany. Make the US largely boring to play and people won't play it. Ignore improvements for the US and people once again won't play as the US. Any country largely dependent on naval combat won't be fun to play because naval combat is broken. The first play through from Paradox on the new, theoretically Chinese themed dlc? Germany. That shows exactly their mindset. Complaints about the AI endlessly shifting units making Germany unplayable, that gets fixed. The fact that the US can't base air units in the UK because the UK spams units in the UK, making the US unplayable? That's not a problem. Subs don't work? You can still play Germany. Again, it seriously hampers the US and Japan. That gets ignored. You know who really needs a NF tree upgrade? It sure as heck wasn't Germany. Yet that makes it into a dlc, that again, supposedly focuses on China, Germany. In what world does that make any sense? People play Germany primarily for two reasons first, can the player change history and win the war where Germany historically lost. Of the three dlc's released or about to be released 2 have improved German game play. And that is the second reason people play Germany so much. They want to test out the new game mechanics.

Why play as the Soviet Union when the AI is so abysmal stupid that all you have to do is spam infantry divisions and zerg swamp the Germans? Why play Japan, when you can steam roll China game after game after game. Why play the US when naval combat is broken, the Japanese AI is too inept to offer any challenge in the Pacific and half your game is a waste of time? A year and a half after release and this game is still unplayable with any sense of enjoyment in its vanilla form. No other major Paradox title has ever focused on one country and improving it as HoI 4 has on Germany. CK 2 and EU 4 bring new content into those titles to improve a variety of playable countries with every new patch.

HoI 4 dlc's started with Tofv and content wise it was a joke. Aside from Commonwealth tech sharing and new NF trees for those countries it did very little. It didn't fundamentally make Canada any more enjoyable to play. DoD? Same thing but for some Axis minor countries. Hell, DoD didn't even include Finland. How was that decision reached? Instead, we got NF trees that allowed for the recreation of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. smh. The only real game changing element with DoD was licence production, which does help Germany push along it's minor Axis partners. A nice feature but hardly worth the cost of a dlc. The problem for me is three fold, the HoI 4 team focuses too much on improving extras for Germany, has allowed basic game play elements that don't work to continue in a broken state for far too long, and improving or adding features in the dlc's that should be in the base game. Things like air resupply. Features that existed in prior HoI games. It's like this dev team is going back and reinventing the wheel and then saying, 'taa daa' look at how we have improved the game! Umm... no. You left out features from a prior title added it into this one and if that's not enough are going to charge people MORE money for it. I'm sorry I like Paradox products on the whole. I have just about every dlc for CK 2 and EU 4, aside from a few music ones and the only dlc I haven't enjoyed was Conclave. Granted, this new dlc for HoI 4 does seem to be an improvement over the other 2 but the base game is still in bad shape.

To give Paradox credit where credit is due, even they realized that the first two dlc's were so lack luster that they are compensating people like me who paid for the first 2 dlc's when the game was first released. But that nicely illustrates that even they realize that thus far, this title and the way it has been handled is like trying to eat a soup sandwich.

Paradox was trying fraud jobs. Waste the FM owners with trash DLCs and come up with good DLCs later on.

And people actually lost their hopes on SP, you see people actually don't ask for AI improvements anymore at least compared to past. They're just asking for bug fixes, Major focus tree reworks ( Ussr focus tree is a complete joke ). And content maybe for SP players for an eye candy

 

[adam_grif]

And maybe if other countries were improved people would play them. Maybe if naval combat wasn't broken people would play Japan, or the UK or the US more. It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Those countries are all popular in the game too. But Germany is always the most popular faction in WWII games, whether previous HoIs or Company of Heroes. I understand you feel very strongly about xyz things but overhauling the German NF tree isn't stealing people away from serious gameplay overhauls, because content designers are there to do content, not to redesign systems and do coding. The new mechanics and refined mechanics are looking pretty awesome in WtT, it's shaping up to be by far the biggest and best update they've pushed out. Content designers aren't there to work on the AI. There's no point having them idle while you wait for 2 years for the other parts of the team to work on the other things you want them to fix.

 

[kaguravitro]

No no no, that fuel consumption can't be simulated by attrition. Because a proper Germany player will max out his reliablity with upgrades and maintenance maybe and lose 0 tanks to attrition. I see you're a typical All welcome player or SP armchair general. Cards are open now.

Really? you have made a mod any time? You must model atrition values for terrain a weather, then get acording reliablity in equipment (i have made in excel making a analisys to reach a monthly consume or loss, later you fix reliablity moddiffer, vanilla values are ridiculous. Also have to limit the production of oil in the world wich is irrational in the vanilla and mods, Bealiveme then, fuel is a problem when your convoy can reach crossing atlantic for example. Oh also, get a more realistic cost for carbon oil plants with is an aberration in HOI IV! Now tellme how the fuck you make a tank overrun when after cross a mountain or a march you can get 20 or 30% of strength (an armor unit composed correctly where tanks are 25% heavyammo is 35% and rations 40%, or better with a bice equiment types are right, untis with no ammo and no rations are weak!!!!)

Please think a little until say some silly crittic, test some of the mods aviable, they are no so complex as i have made for me, but works realy good, and you see how imposible is make invasion if you have logicitcal problems.

Yes theres a big big deal, should be a fix value of atrition (4 or 5) every turn, that solve all the consumition problem, but actually a simple mod fix the hole problem for land. tray it

 

[Micah Goodman 2]

Those countries are all popular in the game too. But Germany is always the most popular faction in WWII games, whether previous HoIs or Company of Heroes. I understand you feel very strongly about xyz things but overhauling the German NF tree isn't stealing people away from serious gameplay overhauls, because content designers are there to do content, not to redesign systems and do coding. The new mechanics and refined mechanics are looking pretty awesome in WtT, it's shaping up to be by far the biggest and best update they've pushed out. Content designers aren't there to work on the AI. There's no point having them idle while you wait for 2 years for the other parts of the team to work on the other things you want them to fix.

I hear this type of excuse given to excuse when software developers for gaming companies neglect an aspect of their product and I reject it. True, the content team has no control over what game mechanics team does and visa versa. However, the team leader does have a say as to how those resources are allocated. When a game is as broken as HoI4 is, more resources need to be allocated to fixing the game versus adding in new content. The team leader decides how many people work on certain aspects of product development. Un paid modders have developed more 'extra' content for this game than the people who are actually getting paid to improve the content! Look at Kaiserreich or BICE and you will get an idea of what I'm talking about. And your defense completely glosses over the fact that this game has removed features from prior tittles in the series that you will now have to pay EXTRA money for!

I've been playing wargames either on the computer or on the table top for over thirty years. I have never seen a title from a major software developer with so many basic bugs for so long. Hell, they had to finally break down and implement a community developed solution to the Sahara desert AI debacle and it took them around a YEAR to do it! We aren't talking about something obscure here that can only be replicated in an usual circumstances, these are basic game mechanic failures. STEAM is a blessing and a curse for computer games. Now developers can push half finished products to market with the vague promise that future patches can be automatically downloaded via STEAM.

Your argument defending the content team would have value to a small degree if this game had any significant new content to speak of. Sure WtT, looks to be a significant content increase. And after more than 18 months it SHOULD be! As far as having content team sitting idle what have they been doing???? Where is all this mythical new content? A handful of new NF trees? Significant new content for any country other than Germany? I'm sorry. I wouldn't be defending either the content side OR the game mechanic side of this team. I know that the team is passionate about this project and that they want it to be a fun game. But thus far, it's been a lackluster title at best. And because of how bad it was on it's initial release it needs far more improvements than most of Paradox's other products.

What this team should have done is set aside all the fantasy what if stuff into it's one dlc. Add in the NF trees that allow for Hitler to be removed in 1936 or for Hungary to recreate the Austro Hungarian Empire, ect. The content team should have been adding events to spice up the game by working on things that actually happened first or were even remotely possible. The game mechanics team either needs more people assigned, or better people assigned, or a larger percentage of the overall resource pie allocated to them. Johan said that this was the only title that had a single AI guy assigned to it and the others had one guy for multiple projects. Great. But that doesn't mean that the product thus far is acceptable. Maybe 2 guys need to be assigned. I don't know what the answer is. I know this, the AI is bad. Too many game mechanics work poorly or not at all. Releasing shiny new dlc's aren't going to change that. Fixing the core mechanics of the game will make the shiny new content dlc's that much more awesome.

For whatever reason this is the only major Paradox title that has had this issue for this long. I reject the, 'well, this is a complex' game argument. So is CK 2 or EU 4. And yet they haven't had near the problems this title has had. When you factor in that large portions of the AI seem to have been ported from HoI 2 and 3 it makes it even more confusing. How can you have the same consistent AI problems over the course of 15 years?! Many of the AI problems HoI 1, 2, and 3 have still exist in HoI 4. How is that even possible??? I mean if the content was earth shattering that would be something. But the content is meh and the AI is just insanely bad.

 

[Zwirbaum]

Paradox was trying fraud jobs. Waste the FM owners with trash DLCs and come up with good DLCs later on.

And people actually lost their hopes on SP, you see people actually don't ask for AI improvements anymore at least compared to past. They're just asking for bug fixes, Major focus tree reworks ( Ussr focus tree is a complete joke ). And content maybe for SP players for an eye candy

Paradox are totally hacks and frauds - and that's why FM edition or season pass owner will get 4 DLC in total. 2 smaller ones - TfV and DoD and 2 bigger ones - Waking the Tiger and another one similiar in size - from 2 planned originally. Total hacks and frauds those Paradox employe are I tell you...

 

[Carlyle1]

Paradox are totally hacks and frauds - and that's why FM edition or season pass owner will get 4 DLC in total. 2 smaller ones - TfV and DoD and 2 bigger ones - Waking the Tiger and another one similiar in size - from 2 planned originally. Total hacks and frauds those Paradox employe are I tell you...

How can a person get fooled this hard ?

After people noticed what was going on and revolted, paradox didn't risk the PR and pay reparations which was nice of them. But you should always remember that they can try this again someday and have the will for it deep in their heart. So we as consumers have to be react

 

[Carlyle1]

Really? you have made a mod any time? You must model atrition values for terrain a weather, then get acording reliablity in equipment (i have made in excel making a analisys to reach a monthly consume or loss, later you fix reliablity moddiffer, vanilla values are ridiculous. Also have to limit the production of oil in the world wich is irrational in the vanilla and mods, Bealiveme then, fuel is a problem when your convoy can reach crossing atlantic for example. Oh also, get a more realistic cost for carbon oil plants with is an aberration in HOI IV! Now tellme how the fuck you make a tank overrun when after cross a mountain or a march you can get 20 or 30% of strength (an armor unit composed correctly where tanks are 25% heavyammo is 35% and rations 40%, or better with a bice equiment types are right, untis with no ammo and no rations are weak!!!!)

Please think a little until say some silly crittic, test some of the mods aviable, they are no so complex as i have made for me, but works realy good, and you see how imposible is make invasion if you have logicitcal problems.

Yes theres a big big deal, should be a fix value of atrition (4 or 5) every turn, that solve all the consumition problem, but actually a simple mod fix the hole problem for land. tray it

Then don't go over Marshes and mountains. You can avoid them. ( Talking about Germany )

 

[Gefallener_Held]

I hear this type of excuse given to excuse when software developers for gaming companies neglect an aspect of their product and I reject it. True, the content team has no control over what game mechanics team does and visa versa. However, the team leader does have a say as to how those resources are allocated. When a game is as broken as HoI4 is, more resources need to be allocated to fixing the game versus adding in new content. The team leader decides how many people work on certain aspects of product development. Un paid modders have developed more 'extra' content for this game than the people who are actually getting paid to improve the content! Look at Kaiserreich or BICE and you will get an idea of what I'm talking about. And your defense completely glosses over the fact that this game has removed features from prior tittles in the series that you will now have to pay EXTRA money for!

I've been playing wargames either on the computer or on the table top for over thirty years. I have never seen a title from a major software developer with so many basic bugs for so long. Hell, they had to finally break down and implement a community developed solution to the Sahara desert AI debacle and it took them around a YEAR to do it! We aren't talking about something obscure here that can only be replicated in an usual circumstances, these are basic game mechanic failures. STEAM is a blessing and a curse for computer games. Now developers can push half finished products to market with the vague promise that future patches can be automatically downloaded via STEAM.

Your argument defending the content team would have value to a small degree if this game had any significant new content to speak of. Sure WtT, looks to be a significant content increase. And after more than 18 months it SHOULD be! As far as having content team sitting idle what have they been doing???? Where is all this mythical new content? A handful of new NF trees? Significant new content for any country other than Germany? I'm sorry. I wouldn't be defending either the content side OR the game mechanic side of this team. I know that the team is passionate about this project and that they want it to be a fun game. But thus far, it's been a lackluster title at best. And because of how bad it was on it's initial release it needs far more improvements than most of Paradox's other products.

What this team should have done is set aside all the fantasy what if stuff into it's one dlc. Add in the NF trees that allow for Hitler to be removed in 1936 or for Hungary to recreate the Austro Hungarian Empire, ect. The content team should have been adding events to spice up the game by working on things that actually happened first or were even remotely possible. The game mechanics team either needs more people assigned, or better people assigned, or a larger percentage of the overall resource pie allocated to them. Johan said that this was the only title that had a single AI guy assigned to it and the others had one guy for multiple projects. Great. But that doesn't mean that the product thus far is acceptable. Maybe 2 guys need to be assigned. I don't know what the answer is. I know this, the AI is bad. Too many game mechanics work poorly or not at all. Releasing shiny new dlc's aren't going to change that. Fixing the core mechanics of the game will make the shiny new content dlc's that much more awesome.

For whatever reason this is the only major Paradox title that has had this issue for this long. I reject the, 'well, this is a complex' game argument. So is CK 2 or EU 4. And yet they haven't had near the problems this title has had. When you factor in that large portions of the AI seem to have been ported from HoI 2 and 3 it makes it even more confusing. How can you have the same consistent AI problems over the course of 15 years?! Many of the AI problems HoI 1, 2, and 3 have still exist in HoI 4. How is that even possible??? I mean if the content was earth shattering that would be something. But the content is meh and the AI is just insanely bad.

RIGHT ON! I SALUTE YOU!

As I stated before, this game was released 18 months ago, and is really only suitable for multiplayer. Maybe I will take the plunge but it will be hard. One, I only want to play as Germany. Beyond that, I pause a lot--extravagantly even. The game is really complex and I do not think it would be much fun to have to get each and every little step right, with no few pauses, etc.

Somebody uploaded a video doing a lot of tests. The conclusion was you should just build battleships, maybe carriers if you are not in range of landbased planes. Destroyers to use fodder but not so much. The naval aspect is so far gone, nobody can fix it. And the mod they are releasing-- probably TWO MONTHS from now--won't even touch it. It may or may not touch various problems with the AI in land based warfare.

And the best part is that these complaints received some "respectful disagrees." What is it that apologists can possibly disagree with? The game is going on two years and it is in a state that is maybe suitable for beta release. Forget about how it was even seven months ago with the colossal battles in the Sahara, really front shifting.

I really thought that if I waited nine months to buy it, I'd be ok. A little voice told me, no, minimum two years for Paradox product. And even that might be too optimistic.

I guess I and so many others like me are just held captive because we want a good world war ii strategy game that is a strategy game. Guess I should try and find a good successor to the old close combat games to fix me through the winter.

 

[kaguravitro]

Then don't go over Marshes and mountains. You can avoid them. ( Talking about Germany )

then dont invade rusia ever, then no take south east asia for the jungles, then dont tale grece, too much montain?
Really? Exept france, theres no a single country full of planes, mybe a part of usa.
If you dont go trought the marchs, the red boys will do for you right to Berlin.
Think as a winner, think as stalin, nothing is imposible or gulag.

 

[kaguravitro]

I hear this type of excuse given to excuse when software developers for gaming companies neglect an aspect of their product and I reject it. True, the content team has no control over what game mechanics team does and visa versa. However, the team leader does have a say as to how those resources are allocated. When a game is as broken as HoI4 is, more resources need to be allocated to fixing the game versus adding in new content. The team leader decides how many people work on certain aspects of product development. Un paid modders have developed more 'extra' content for this game than the people who are actually getting paid to improve the content! Look at Kaiserreich or BICE and you will get an idea of what I'm talking about. And your defense completely glosses over the fact that this game has removed features from prior tittles in the series that you will now have to pay EXTRA money for!

I've been playing wargames either on the computer or on the table top for over thirty years. I have never seen a title from a major software developer with so many basic bugs for so long. Hell, they had to finally break down and implement a community developed solution to the Sahara desert AI debacle and it took them around a YEAR to do it! We aren't talking about something obscure here that can only be replicated in an usual circumstances, these are basic game mechanic failures. STEAM is a blessing and a curse for computer games. Now developers can push half finished products to market with the vague promise that future patches can be automatically downloaded via STEAM.

Your argument defending the content team would have value to a small degree if this game had any significant new content to speak of. Sure WtT, looks to be a significant content increase. And after more than 18 months it SHOULD be! As far as having content team sitting idle what have they been doing???? Where is all this mythical new content? A handful of new NF trees? Significant new content for any country other than Germany? I'm sorry. I wouldn't be defending either the content side OR the game mechanic side of this team. I know that the team is passionate about this project and that they want it to be a fun game. But thus far, it's been a lackluster title at best. And because of how bad it was on it's initial release it needs far more improvements than most of Paradox's other products.

What this team should have done is set aside all the fantasy what if stuff into it's one dlc. Add in the NF trees that allow for Hitler to be removed in 1936 or for Hungary to recreate the Austro Hungarian Empire, ect. The content team should have been adding events to spice up the game by working on things that actually happened first or were even remotely possible. The game mechanics team either needs more people assigned, or better people assigned, or a larger percentage of the overall resource pie allocated to them. Johan said that this was the only title that had a single AI guy assigned to it and the others had one guy for multiple projects. Great. But that doesn't mean that the product thus far is acceptable. Maybe 2 guys need to be assigned. I don't know what the answer is. I know this, the AI is bad. Too many game mechanics work poorly or not at all. Releasing shiny new dlc's aren't going to change that. Fixing the core mechanics of the game will make the shiny new content dlc's that much more awesome.

For whatever reason this is the only major Paradox title that has had this issue for this long. I reject the, 'well, this is a complex' game argument. So is CK 2 or EU 4. And yet they haven't had near the problems this title has had. When you factor in that large portions of the AI seem to have been ported from HoI 2 and 3 it makes it even more confusing. How can you have the same consistent AI problems over the course of 15 years?! Many of the AI problems HoI 1, 2, and 3 have still exist in HoI 4. How is that even possible??? I mean if the content was earth shattering that would be something. But the content is meh and the AI is just insanely bad.

i agree somethings. DLC adding things are good by almost for this moment broken, incomplete or not enought good ai for exmpale should be corrected first.
I dessagree with idea of the same problem from prior. They have new systems pretty interesting, the problem are diferents but i feel more close to a solve. But im a bit depress after see and analyse the naval problem, for example the fleet composition, DH for example force you to have a mixed fleet composition becose lone bb lost org, this is know solution not employed. Mybe they try i dont know, it mess me why dont implement some know solution. Lack of people?

I dont thinks is broken, now it works bad... i hope 2 dlc should fix major problems, then yes its a problem. Is too much time even as an optimistic view. But i dont find no similar game, is like SH3, no real choice.

I think this game is ambisius, i feel they dont spent the needed time to solve base problem and i see they can, but time is a pain as a no so low price. I spend mony in this in particular, as playing rules the way a 1991 graphic game i can pay 35 us$, i can spend much in this, but the priorities are verybad allocated.

Plase think a bit in developers, see videos, the aprouches are right, puppet system was a revolution in many ways even with broken too much many things. as you said complexity is not a excuse, but the error i feel was an early realise becose on primal stages, the content was realy realy secondary and even then the ratio of problems solved was very lower.

I played a lot DH, and this is superior, superior to HOI III.
I preffer pay 20 us$ for a lone complete fix with no content to have this working pretty good as should be, no adding a sole new system (exept reemplazament of one wasnt working).

 

[Carlyle1]

then dont invade rusia ever, then no take south east asia for the jungles, then dont tale grece, too much montain?
Really? Exept france, theres no a single country full of planes, mybe a part of usa.
If you dont go trought the marchs, the red boys will do for you right to Berlin.
Think as a winner, think as stalin, nothing is imposible or gulag.

You don't take attrition from forests and winter attrition is not existent until very north. I rarely see i take winter attrition. Just encircle marshes and threaten Ussr with encirclement. He'll retreat on his own.

You usually don't take greece and SEA with tanks if you're not crazy

 

[Carlyle1]

i agree somethings. DLC adding things are good by almost for this moment broken, incomplete or not enought good ai for exmpale should be corrected first.
I dessagree with idea of the same problem from prior. They have new systems pretty interesting, the problem are diferents but i feel more close to a solve. But im a bit depress after see and analyse the naval problem, for example the fleet composition, DH for example force you to have a mixed fleet composition becose lone bb lost org, this is know solution not employed. Mybe they try i dont know, it mess me why dont implement some know solution. Lack of people?

I dont thinks is broken, now it works bad... i hope 2 dlc should fix major problems, then yes its a problem. Is too much time even as an optimistic view. But i dont find no similar game, is like SH3, no real choice.

I think this game is ambisius, i feel they dont spent the needed time to solve base problem and i see they can, but time is a pain as a no so low price. I spend mony in this in particular, as playing rules the way a 1991 graphic game i can pay 35 us$, i can spend much in this, but the priorities are verybad allocated.

Plase think a bit in developers, see videos, the aprouches are right, puppet system was a revolution in many ways even with broken too much many things. as you said complexity is not a excuse, but the error i feel was an early realise becose on primal stages, the content was realy realy secondary and even then the ratio of problems solved was very lower.

I played a lot DH, and this is superior, superior to HOI III.
I preffer pay 20 us$ for a lone complete fix with no content to have this working pretty good as should be, no adding a sole new system (exept reemplazament of one wasnt working).

No the developers are still oblivious to the core problems in the game. They're happy to showcase the ripoff KairserReich Germany to maybe 5-6 hours in game, ww2 fan or some kid with alternate history addiction. They build their navy until 1942 play the awakened German empire and without fighting the Uk at all, just finish the series with your regular conquest of Ussr with almost 1m losses against AI lol This alone shows how bad they're at the game they created and we expect to fix problems that they don't understand. We're doomed

 

[jdavis86]

I keep trying to play the game, but it is just not "playable" enough in single player to enjoy it. The AI wrecks immersion, and the player is forced between using the flawed battle planner or playing the game like an RTS. The new expansion looks good but I'm not sold that it will improve single player enough.

I was really hard on EU4 during its first years, and now love the game.

One hopes HOI4 gets there too, but there are many issues that make me wish they'd stop developing the game and move on to something else.

 

[GermanDave]

I also felt like you in the beginning Fulmen. The sheer number of exploits, cheeses and annoying bugs made me afraid that PDX would just shelve The dev diaries have kind of restored my faith in in the commitment of Paradox. Podcat and his team have shown us that they are willing to creatively expand the game. I really hope that after the implementation of the event system they quickly move on to reworking the naval game (which needs a major departure).

Also, here's hoping that EUIV is simply a measure of how much PDX is committing to a single title.