Invited Duchy Claimants Have Wrong Heir

[iron0037]

At first I thought it might be a fluke, but I've had this happen twice in my recent game.

Reproduction Steps
1) Invite a claimant of a foreign duchy to court. (Kings and non-independent counts might also apply.)
2) Make claimant a direct landed vassal of your realm.
3) Observe that claimant's heir is not his children.

Here is a copy of my save game:
http://www.mediafire.com/?gkhgmtcz5tp0v8j

Observe that the Duke of Corsica/Count of Hanyan's heir is his brother rather than any of his daughters. Also observe that the Barony of El Anakir is in control of France. Previously, I had granted this barony to Derrien de Rennes, brother to the current barony holder's grandfather. If you look back at this character, you'll see that he had two daughters that outlived him.

Am I missing something fundamental about gameplay here, or is this a bug? It's really frustrating to lose holdings for no apparent reason .

 

[BlckKnght]

There's no bug in your saved game. The Duchy of Sardinia has Agnatic Gavelkind succession. That means that female characters are not allowed to rule, only men. Since the current duke has no sons (only daughters) the title will be inherited by some other man in his dynasty (his brother in this case), or by his liege (you) if his dynasty has no surviving men at all.

 

[K-vald]

Confirming what BlckKnght is saying. But, I discovered another bug using the save game so I'll take a further look at that.

 

[iron0037]

Ah, thanks for taking a look. Out of curiosity, how do I tell what the succession laws are for a kingdom I don't control (short of opening the save game with a text editor)?

This still doesn't explain the Baron of El Anakir though. When I go to my laws tab, the kingdom of Mauretania is agnatic-cognatic succession. So what happened there?

 

[K-vald]

You hover with your mouse pointer over the title shield for a while and it will appear.

I have no idea, I can have a look. UPDATE: It makes sense to me, the next-in-line heir to the Barony of El Anakir is the current holder's son.

 

[iron0037]

Hey K-vald, thanks for taking a closer look. Yes, but I'm not referring to the current baron of El Anakir. His predecessor was Derrien de Rennes, brother to the current barony holder's grandfather. I know it's hard to find him since there's no barony history window, but explore the character window for the current baron, go up a few generations, and you'll find him. He has two living daughters, one of which should have been the baroness upon Derrien's death...at least to my knowledge.

 

[K-vald]

Ah alright, I'll have another look then haha.

UPDATE: Ok, please correct me here if I have gotten this wrong, but you're suggesting that the current holder of the Barony of El Anakir should be one of the former holder's daughters? If so, I must say that to me it seems WAD since it's Agnatic-Cognatic, which means that females are eligible to inherit ONLY if there are no other eligible males. If there was Absolute Cognatic then the holder should be one of the former holder's daughters since then females inherit on the same grounds as males do.

 

[iron0037]

Hey K-vald, while I appreciate you taking a look, I don't mean to be dragging you down a rat hole . If you have bigger fish to fry this afternoon, don't worry with my little problem.

That being said, I can't open my game at the moment. But so far as memory serves, Mauritania is Primogeniture Agnatic-Cognatic succession. It is my understanding that implies that a landholder with only daughters will have his eldest daughter inherit upon death. That's certainly how my player's heir has always behaved.

This baron was in precisely this situation. He had two daughters, but neither inherited the barony. Instead, his nephew's son got the barony. Doesn't that seem peculiar? He's a more eligible male?

 

[londoner247]

Hey K-vald, while I appreciate you taking a look, I don't mean to be dragging you down a rat hole . If you have bigger fish to fry this afternoon, don't worry with my little problem.

That being said, I can't open my game at the moment. But so far as memory serves, Mauritania is Primogeniture Agnatic-Cognatic succession. It is my understanding that implies that a landholder with only daughters will have his eldest daughter inherit upon death. That's certainly how my player's heir has always behaved.

This baron was in precisely this situation. He had two daughters, but neither inherited the barony. Instead, his nephew's son got the barony. Doesn't that seem peculiar? He's a more eligible male?

Whilst I agree with you that this is how I would expect Agnatic-Cognatic to work in real life, the version implemented in game only allows female heirs if there are no male heirs anywhere in the dynasty. That means that brothers, uncles and male cousins can inherit if the current title holder only has daughters.

 

[Wezqu]

Whilst I agree with you that this is how I would expect Agnatic-Cognatic to work in real life, the version implemented in game only allows female heirs if there are no male heirs anywhere in the dynasty. That means that brothers, uncles and male cousins can inherit if the current title holder only has daughters.

No, in the game daughters inherit when there is no son to inherit the tittle. Ruler having a brother alive should not effect the succession anyway and it doesn't in the game. I even checked it on my own game that has even two queens ruling at the moment. For example one duke died and he was inherited by his daughter than his brother that lived two years longer. Same goes to current Queen of Denmark who inhertied the throne from her father when there still is two of her uncles alive.

 

[Wezqu]

Checked the save game and I have quite good explanation for the "odd" inheritance of El Anarik.

There is no bug in how barony of El Anarik succession went. The current holders inheritance law is Agnatic-Cognatic Primogeniture but your last holders inheritance law was most likely Agnatic Gavelkind. Almost all barons and counts have that succession law in Mauretania. So as its agnatic it jumps over any female and ends up to the current holder.

Also just to note for K-vlad. Was the bug you found in the save that he has cities that have Gavelkind inheritance like Badajoz and Massat when they should not be anything else than Open Elective.