Intended first game, early game strategy?

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Mar 18, 2016
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Direct democracies can control 5 more planets directly. We don't yet know anything about tier 2 governments. And I hope there will be technologies giving you the same perk.
1000 stars would mean a 25 stars per per empire average. I'm wondering whether all stars will have habitable planets but if yes by late game it translates to about 30-35 planets per empire as some systems have more than one habitable planet if you divide the galaxy evenly and every single habitable planet gets colonized.

My guess based on the Blorgstream is that somewhere between half and a third of systems have habitable planets. Rounding up slightly to account for systems with two or more inhabitable planets, this means that in 25 systems there will be 8 - 13 habitable planets.

If you're a Direct Democracy then 8 planets can all be personally micro'd. Otherwise, this means your five best planets are your core and there's a remainder of 3 - 8 which form one or two sectors.
 
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VI Imre

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My guess based on the Blorgstream is that somewhere between half and a third of systems have habitable planets. Rounding up slightly to account for systems with two or more inhabitable planets, this means that in 25 systems there will be 8 - 13 habitable planets.

If you're a Direct Democracy then 8 planets can all be personally micro'd. Otherwise, this means your five best planets are your core and there's a remainder of 3 - 8 which form one or two sectors.

I believe that each star system has at least one habitable planet, by late game, having access to terraformation or inter-galactic migration you will probably fill up most of those planets depending on whether you are or xenophobe or a xenophile and your playstyle. In the blorg stream you can see that about half of the systems already have some sort of habitable planets -- for better or worse -- and the player as of yet can colonize only 3 of the 7 habitable planet types.
 

Oscot

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My guess based on the Blorgstream is that somewhere between half and a third of systems have habitable planets. Rounding up slightly to account for systems with two or more inhabitable planets, this means that in 25 systems there will be 8 - 13 habitable planets.

If you're a Direct Democracy then 8 planets can all be personally micro'd. Otherwise, this means your five best planets are your core and there's a remainder of 3 - 8 which form one or two sectors.
I appreciate thoughtful math as much as the next autist, but I feel you're all predicating on faulty assumptions here; there is no way that all 40 empires in a 40 empire start are going to survive to the midgame, let alone to the late game where everyone's borders are squished together and everywhere viable is colonized.

Multiply the systems-per-empire by a factor of 2-3 and maybe you're getting towards a reasonable figure.
 
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I appreciate thoughtful math as much as the next autist, but I feel you're all predicating on faulty assumptions here; there is no way that all 40 empires in a 40 empire start are going to survive to the midgame, let alone to the late game where everyone's borders are squished together and everywhere viable is colonized.

Multiply the systems-per-empire by a factor of 2-3 and maybe you're getting towards a reasonable figure.
Eeh, it'll probably depend on the galaxy's ethos composition. If a lot of pacifists end up spawning there'll be a shitload of little stateles everywhere that got released in wars(pacifists apparently prefer to release new nations instead of conquering, if attacked), conglomerating in federations by the mid-game if xenophiles. A galaxy with mostly militarists will probably tend to have a lot of blobs with some periferic vassals serving as buffer states. Also, there are probably more than 40 potential Empires from the start, if you take into account primitives. Unless the Blorg are in a lucky neighbourhood, I'm guessing there'll be around ten or a dozen rising empires throughout a game, without outside interference.
 

flakmeister

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There has never been a 4X made in which the second X is optional, nor (IMHO) should there be. There may be limiting factors on expansion, but that's the not the same as saying that neglecting expansion entirely should be viable.

I wish people would stop confusing "build tall" with "don't expand at all." Given a 1000-star start and 40 empires, a "tall" starting strategy would be to expand out to grab five good suitable planets and then sit and turtle on them. A standard strategy would be to expand to 11-12 planets. "Wide" would be more than that. "Tall" requires early game expansion, same as anything else.

I certainly never meant to imply that OCC'ing should be a thing in Stellaris. My beef is that there doesn't seem to be any incentive or means to go anything BUT wide in the game. I just think it would be interesting if the game offered scenarios where certain techs or planets presented the player with the opportunity to go down a different expansion route.
 
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Jorgen_CAB

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In the way that population grow in the game it is extremely important to find good planets to settle as early as you can in the game. Population will be your main source of income in the game by a large margin.

Going wide will usually mean that you need to go to war and take planets from other species and become a multi cultural empire with its own problem.

If you go tall you would expand as quickly as you can to increase your population and as many other star system to place stations in as possible before you meet someone else.
 

Panpiper

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because I'm not familiar with grand strategy by paradox I'm having a bit of trouble visualizing how important leaders are vs. more home sector planets vs. ethics drift.

I will probably make a very happy defensive build with wormholes.
It seems to me that Stellaris will be a VERY different game compared to most 4X games, given that in most such games, you can pretty much grow and grow without end. In Stellaris, the game is designed to result in such large empires essentially fracturing as small chunks break off in revolutionary independence movements. This is deliberate so as to prevent large empire sprawl.

As deliberate as this may be on the part of the designers, it is VERY much contrary to how I want to play Stellaris, I WANT to grow into a humongous empire that no other can contest. To that end, I have a plan to configure my starting empire precisely so as to permit that as much as an empire design can permit it. My first race build will be:

Traits: Intelligent, Conformists (Ethics Divergence -20%), Sedentary, Weak
Ethos: Xenophile, Militarist, Spiritualist
Government: Theocratic Oligarchy (Ethics Divergence -10%)

The heavy reduction of ethics divergence will I expect substantially reduce the pressure on outlying sectors to result in becoming so different as to want to break away. The sedentary malus, while technically a disadvantage, might actually help in this regard by reducing my population's tendency to migrate to sectors where their ethics divergence has a greater majority, which is what ultimately, along with unhappiness, causes sectors to want to revolt. The +5 happiness from spiritualist will help a bit. Militarist will allow me to occasionally use my military the way I might in a regular 4X game, without my people promptly rebelling. Xenophile will hopefully keep me able to negotiate with other empires I want to keep friendly and allow me to use other races to settle planets inside my empire that my starting race cannot.

Referring to the intent to build two or more construction ships so as to build resource stations:
I dunno... that sounds like a good way to accidentally kill your economy.
One constructor ship ensures an almost self-fulfilling 'better safe than sorry' playstyle; even if you go temporarily insane and start spamming outposts, there's a natural speed limit to the amount of damage you can do, and hopefully you will notice that your economy is going down the toilet before the slide becomes irreversible.
I completely fail to see the issue with having more than one construction ship. I do not see how that could possibly result in killing your economy. Constructors are there simply to use materials already available to build resource collecting stations onto available deposits. You cannot build if you don't have the materials, so you can't accidentally go into a deficit. If it turns out that such stations require energy for maintenance, that is extremely easy to handle, you simply build energy stations at the same time. You never build more mining stations than your energy stations can accommodate.
 

Oscot

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If it turns out that such stations require energy for maintenance, that is extremely easy to handle, you simply build energy stations at the same time.
There's no "simply" about it.
It's early game. You do not have the Pops to spare working energy stations. You need them working the science stations, the hammers tiles, and the food farms.
 
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It seems to me that Stellaris will be a VERY different game compared to most 4X games, -snip-
You have to remember that Conformist is a trait that applies only to your primary species. Your most dangerous population(conquered, unhappy aliens without a nation to belong to) will be the ones to not benefit from that. Spiritualist also seems to just apply to pops with that ethos, from what I understand(its a bit confusing), so that too is a structural weakness in your build. The vibe I get from it is that it'll be able to expand to a pretty impressive size being held at the seams, but when enough independence movements get enough momentum, it'll spetacularly implode in a glorious mess. Great for storytelling and RP potential(if that point ever comes, please give me the save!!! I'd love to play in it), but I imagine it is a bit counterproductive to your goals :rolleyes:

tl;dr Space Rome gets rekt by the Crisis of the Third Millenium.
 
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Pandoricus

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Build wormhole stations and explore. All the science, I gotta get em all.
 

TomBombadil

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My starting strategy will be simple: colonize everthing. too hell with happiness. If i see a useless spacerock i will claim that rock by throwing my people at it. Its certainly not the best strategy, but the chaos it will bring will be fun.

You need to unlock tech to be able to colonise other types of world, I believe.
 

CamJF

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I believe that each star system has at least one habitable planet, by late game, having access to terraformation or inter-galactic migration you will probably fill up most of those planets depending on whether you are or xenophobe or a xenophile and your playstyle. In the blorg stream you can see that about half of the systems already have some sort of habitable planets -- for better or worse -- and the player as of yet can colonize only 3 of the 7 habitable planet types.

I am pretty sure we have seen systems with no habitable planets at all.

EDIT: Unless you mean we can terraform barren/molten etc planets. But I'm not sure that will be possible.
 

Arentak

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I certainly never meant to imply that OCC'ing should be a thing in Stellaris. My beef is that there doesn't seem to be any incentive or means to go anything BUT wide in the game. I just think it would be interesting if the game offered scenarios where certain techs or planets presented the player with the opportunity to go down a different expansion route.
With tech costs inflating as pop goes up, and sectors being less efficient then your own managed space, I could see only taking the best worlds for your people, and letting their pop max out, using space installations for as much as possible and making the most out of a lower pop, higher-infrastructure empire, perhaps mixed with direct democracty for +4 planets.
 

macd21

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Step 1. Research the home system, building mining stations and whatever, build a second science ship, send warships to stick their noses into nearby systems to get a rough idea as to what they're like.
Step 2. Send science ships into the most interesting nearby systems, looking for a colony world. Focus on civilian research - anything that builds up economy and research.
Step 3. Establish colonies and frontier stations.
Step 4. Encounter aliens. Panic, because my military barely exists. Hope they are friendly, or at least don't attack until my fleet is in decent shape.
Step 5. ???
 
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Exemplar Voss

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Initial scouts to nearby systems, followed up with science surveys to safe ones, prioritizing worlds outside my existing borders for settlement. Though surveying outside the system will wait until my home system is done- rushing mining stations is key while I research colony ships. Outside the system, the focus will be on surveying any habitable worlds before systems as a whole. A second survey ship is also a priority.

After that, I plan to run right up to the planet cap as quickly as colony energy costs allow, again, prioritizing outside my space and filling worlds within my borders later. This will also allow for stronger border sectors, as the outer rim of the empire will be more developed than inner worlds beyond the Homeworld.

While that happens, building up a fleet to deal with space critters is a priority- I want the sweet, sweet research from them there space whales and crystals and things. And I hate leaving hostiles nearby.

Alien contact isn't much of priority for me, I'd rather wait and be contacted rather than rush research points out the door just to chat. Unless they have hostile first contact protocols, but early game that doesn't seem too much of a threat, as their fleets will take a while to equal stations, and they won't have armies to land.

An early sector may be necessary- it depends how many worlds I find quickly, and how many future colonies I end up with inside my borders.

Starting empire- probably adaptive; fanatic spiritualist, xenophile. Not sure of government, but leaning toward theocratic oligarchy. However, divine mandate might be better, as the mausoleums would also affect alien Pops. But was also thinking just plain spiritualist, adding militarist, and picking military dictatorship.
May add communal and sedentary.
 
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Panpiper

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If it turns out that such stations require energy for maintenance, that is extremely easy to handle, you simply build energy stations at the same time. You never build more mining stations than your energy stations can accommodate.

There's no "simply" about it.
It's early game. You do not have the Pops to spare working energy stations. You need them working the science stations, the hammers tiles, and the food farms.

We are talking about construction ships building mining stations in space. This has absolutely nothing to do with planets, tiles or population. Mining stations in space do NOT require population to operate. If the stations require energy to function, then that energy would be provided by the same construction ships building energy stations in space, again, requiring no population. I assert your fears are baseless and that having several construction ships can be well worth the while, as long as you have the materials income to keep them busy. If they are sitting idle due to too little materials, only then have you built too many construction ships.
 

Teije

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My strategy - as with any new Paradox title - going to play sub-optimally the first few games and just screw around with different styles (tall/wide, peaceful/warlike, etc.) and figure things out. Then I'll start taking on some challenges.

The only thing I don't like about Stellaris is that the Ottomans and Byzantines aren't in it. They've always been my go to guys. I see custom named empires in the future...
 

thirawin

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My strategy - as with any new Paradox title - going to play sub-optimally the first few games and just screw around with different styles (tall/wide, peaceful/warlike, etc.) and figure things out. Then I'll start taking on some challenges.

The only thing I don't like about Stellaris is that the Ottomans and Byzantines aren't in it. They've always been my go to guys. I see custom named empires in the future...
On the plus side you will never meet france ever again ;)
 
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