Intelligence Also Broken

[jju_57]

In 1939 I noticed that there was a dramatic negative impact on my research from spying. I shifted focus into building 1 spy a day which is a lot. I made sure I also had the crime fighter whcih gave me as Germany +20% in counterintelligence.

I did catch tons of spies but the negative research impact didn't go away. So after 6 months I saved the game and decided to see where the spies were comming from and why there were now 8 negative research impacts ranging from -1% up to -7% for a total of -16%. Remember I had 10 spies in Germany on counterintelligence and all spies in other countries were also on counterintelligence.

I first checked the UK and they had no spies in Germany. Russia had one but was sleeping. I checked the reset of the allies except for France which I couldn't find out how to select. Any spies I did find were either looking at military intelligence or sleeping.

So next came the other big countries. USA, Japan, National China all had no impact.

I then checked Italy, Hungary, Slovakia which were in my alliance. WTF! Italy had 4 spies interrupting my production, while Hungary and Slovakia had a total of 4 spies interrupting my research. Should allies do this?

But this still didn't resolve why I had a total of -16% research from spies but only found 4 spies doing it. I gave up after looking at about 10 more countries.

Not sure where this is comming from but is some little country like Costa Rica having that kind of impact? And one country is doing -7% according to the tool tip. Yet no country so far can field that amount of spies. Is it bugged and France has the spies?

Anyway this is another area that needs to be fixed.

 

[Prydefalcn]

I seem to be having the same issue with France. I can't for the life of me figure out where a fat -7% (along with a few -1%s) is coming from on my research when I've had 10 spies on counterintel for most of the game.

 

[Baron_von_Beer]

On a similar note, counter intelligence in other nations. There should at least be another option to limit the operations to the agents of the nation you are in. If I am Germany, have my spies in the UK set to counter intelligence, why should they risk their neck to terminate Soviet spies there who may be doing things beneficial to me? Why am I doing the UK's dirty work eliminating them? (never mind my own allies spies there...) My only concern is getting rid of the agents that are, in turn, hunting me down.

At the least, it should be limited to members of the faction of the host, IMO. If I am in the UK, it will only hunt Allied spies, etc.

 

[jju_57]

I can confirm that this is a bug. I searched the save game files and found that the Baltic States are doing the spying against my research, but since they no longer exist I cant do anything to stop them. Also a country ICL (Iceland?) is impacting research.

PI needs to set these country stats to zero during an event.

 

[jju_57]

Further checking shows that Austria and CZE never had their spies reduced to zero after the events removed the countries.

 

[Wolf52]

Where do you find if someone is attacking your research?

 

[Baron_von_Beer]

If you go to your tech screen, hover over something you're researching, top right of the item in the lower left portion of the screen. The tool tip will show a red -x% due to espionage.

It will hit everything your researching equally, so no need to check them all.

 

[Wooglin]

JJU-57, perhaps a government in exile retains its spies even after it is annexed.
AUS spies probably should be eliminated after Anschluss though.

- woogie

 

[unmerged(53301)]

Same here. Have a -7& and a -5% and a -1% effect on all my research

 

[unmerged(149843)]

The very moment I divert spies to some other action, other than counterspying my research is devastated. I practically never use other missions than counter.

 

[Morbid]

I would seem more like it is annexing that is broken, since the countries assets don't get deleted properly.

Anyway, jju_57... could you report this per the guidelines in the Bugreport forum, and perhaps also provide a savegame?

Or maybe a mod could move this thread?

 

[zeekater]

I've had the same experience as Germany, -6 and -7% for research. Creating almost 2 new spies a day, with already 10 in most large countries and at home, all on counterespionage... not a bit of difference.

Anybody found a way to get rid of this, perhaps by editing the save files?

 

[datachild]

You have to consider, that there is no realy "sleep" function for spies. If a country selected this option the spies just choose a random mission for a certain period. Thus, when you have 100 spies in your country, without a mission selected, there are still some spies sabotaging your research.

EDIT: If you are a major power and many states infiltrate your country, you have almost no chance to counter them. Even if you are producing 1 spy a day, only 10 nation with .1 spy/day can counter you in theory. ( also i did not realy check the spy system in detail, thus this maybe completely wrong )

 

[Meadhros]

Seriously. Did PI do any testing or balancing after finishing their engine? It does look like they made their engine and put their features in, then quickly wrote the rest of the game (and the map) and never double-checked it again, as "it's easily moddible anyway".

Honestly, it is getting a bit rediculous with the bugs and issues this game has, even for a game that is quite complicated.

 

[unmerged(53301)]

my only work around is producing like 3x more research to combat each research project being slowed down. i have 50 leadership, 32 in research, 16 in officers, 2 in spies.

 

[GLENN]

I have noticed this in my games.

I found small minors with 1 spy (or more) causing the problem.

I routinely go through every county where I have a spy. Set them to counter to kill spys.

This helped alot.

After that I found out that my research was still being attacked.

So I checked my buddies in my alliance. I killed all of there spies.

Research picked picked up.

Also, in the manual it states that disruption picks up. Theory: I am assume one spy disrupting research will get larger and larger disruptions % as time goes by.

 

[Morbid]

As Germany, I have several times experienced -x% in research from foreign spies. Having 10 spies at home doing counterespionage always weeds them out in about 1-3 months. Patience is the name of the game.

 

[unmerged(151277)]

Yes, Allies messing up research.

Own puppets killing your spies ? (Tried playing Japan bit, and my lone Spy in Manchuko, there to help protect the ruling gowerment got caught by Manchuko...).??.


Intelligence seems not to be working right yet.

Regards
Bresh

 

[dellivingston]

Intelligence system using modified HOI 2 / EU 3 engine

The intelligence system seems to be wrong.

I think the following are the likely causes, most of which have been posted in this thread:

1) The game has been made from a modified EU 3 Clausewitz engine. In Eu 3 it was basically every country for itself with no real faction system. PI because of time, money and PI team manpower constraints have not developed the Intelligence system enough in real terms to make it significantly different from a combined HOI 2 and EU 3 spying system.

2) Therefore, you get your own puppets / allies doing bad / destrucitve spying missions on your own selected country. This is because the Faction system from Diplomacy is corrupted and broken. These parts are linked together. PI's implementation of the nation drifting system seems to be woefully inadequate with floods of nations going to the allies at the drop of a hat (i.e. Germany / Italy / Japan saying boo to a minor neutral nation).

3) This and a number of bugs that have been mentioned most definitely should have been picked up in alpha and beta testing.

4) Here is the key bit: it probably was picked up and known about in testing and even known from the design stage but neglected by PI for any significant change due to time, money and PI team manpower constraints . I think that we have been hoodwinked in a way to reduce costs. PI thinking: lets release the game on the 7 / 8 / 09 and let the fanboys do the beta testing... Possibly because Paradox Interactive being short of cash. Did they really have to sell their Stockholm offices as intimated in the recent spoof PI / Hitler video footage on you-tube?

5) I really want to buy this game but not in it's current state, even though I love Paradox games. Last year EU: Rome certainly wasn't what it should have been. Also, you couldn't load troops into transport ships in Supreme Ruler 2020 on it's release. I hope Paradox Interactive doesn't continue this very bad downward slide in the quality of their games on release date. They need to get their fingers out to survive in the cutthroat gaming industry. I hope they do take heed of the players concerns and wishes for both ourselves and PI, because they do make fantastic grand strategy games in general and I would love to see this game becoming the excellent game it should be.

cheers

dellivingston

 

[Lordban]

Further checking shows that Austria and CZE never had their spies reduced to zero after the events removed the countries.

To complete the information given by dellivingston, the Clausewitz engine does not remove annexed countries from the game. They retain their parameters and should now be inactive, but anything they've done stays done, and all the data saved will be re-used if that country is re-created or if it successfully revolts.