Inquiry about holy wars

[Douglas Uppity]

How the hell does the 'same-religion nations can join in' thing for Holy Wars work, exactly?

I'm trying to get a successful Asturias game going, but every time i get holy warred by the sultan, the only nations that seem to even remotely care about it are the 2 province nations that make up Brittany in EU4, who don't even help out. They just send stacks of 500 men into my closest province, and then immediately run back to their home turf without contributing anything.

I'm touching butts with Francia, who is not in any war right now, and we have good relations (100 opinion both ways) with the king, yet he never even considers the option of joining the holy war against the Umayyad. Not once. I got him to help out ONCE, and that's only because i managed to snag a marriage, and call him in as an ally. I've dropped multiple thousands on mercenaries just to stay alive, and it seems the sultan learned from this, as the last war was thoroughly won by the filthy green men, who employed 3 of the 4500 units strong mercenary bands (no clue how he didn't go bankrupt with that, however. He was bleeding -69 sheckels per month for well over 3 years, with a treasury of 300 sheckels.)

Does Francia just not care? Or is there a problem with the code? Or *dons tinfoil hat* is the game balanced against the player?

 

[LeSingeAffame]

The Karlings have other stuff to do, and probably don't think that an Holy War in Asturias is important enough (I mean both brothers hate each other, and Charles always has lots of claims to press). The only option you have is to have an alliance with them, otherwise they won't move

 

[abauer2]

I think Francia will see what kind of a threat the Umayyads are to themselves, not to you or Christendom in general, hence why you get help from small guys but not Francia.

I'm guessing you've thought of it, but trying to form an alliance with Francia (or perhaps even better, get a non-aggression pact with the Umayyads) can help. In almost every one of my games the Umayyads eventually end up bordering France and then they seem to go at it against each other, which should eventually weaken them enough that you can pick some opportunities.

 

[Alcadizzar19]

The game is also balanced against the player. That's just kinda how games work.

 

[Douglas Uppity]

• I think Francia will see what kind of a threat the Umayyads are to themselves, not to you or Christendom in general, hence why you get help from small guys but not Francia.
  
  I'm guessing you've thought of it, but trying to form an alliance with Francia (or perhaps even better, get a non-aggression pact with the Umayyads) can help. In almost every one of my games the Umayyads eventually end up bordering France and then they seem to go at it against each other, which should eventually weaken them enough that you can pick some opportunities.

The Umayyad start out touching butts with both Middle and West Francia, and neither of them seem to care much about it. Middle tried to take Barcelona, but Karloman died during the war, so that led nowhere. Once unified, West Francia made quick work of Saxony, and then did.. well, pretty much nothing.
I've had Charles as an ally, and that alliance was gained during one of the many holy wars against the Mussel Menace, so I managed to call him in through that. But other than that, Francia (and many large nations for that matter) really don't seem to care about holy wars against their religion.

I'm quite headstrong, so i'll just try again and again until it works, but i'm trying to get some insight as to how Holy Wars work when it comes to major nations.

 

[Aries666]

I know that when you declare a holy war only nations that border the defender and are not at war themselves will join in against you. I'm not as sure about the behaviour when you are the defender but I would imagine that there are additional size criteria which could explain why a large Francia wont help you.

 

[AchedTeacher]

The game is also balanced against the player. That's just kinda how games work.

In my opinion all games should strive to not have to do it. I understand technology is not there yet, but it shouldn't be considered normal that the AI always gets a helping hand.

 

[deadhand13]

You'll get more requests to help as a defender than as an attacker. Not that that helps you any

 

[Heiliges Thüringens Reich]

Yeah, as an attacker it's pretty hard to get one-sided help from people of your religion. On the other hand, when attacked, many flock to your banner.

Alliance is the best way to do it. I too tried an Asturias 769 game, and it was very hard. Without France, I coldn't even dream about getting the entire Portugal coast.

 

[Rags17]

a) Marry a Karling daughter ASAP.
b) Ask the Pope for money
c) Build forts everywhere to slow down the stupid AI who have zero idea on how to assault a 112 man stockade with their 5,000 man doom stack
d) Sow dissent in Ummie territory
e) Try to assassinate capable Ummie vassals and commanders
f) Hope for religious and cultural revolts
g) Pray. A lot !