Innovative and religious modifier (suggestion)

[Sabre Man]

I have a suggestion for the next pat..., erm enhancement pack:

Tie the Innovative slider to the religious modifier for province income. This way, if you're very innovative (tolerant) you get more income from your provinces (people are happy and prosperous because they're not being persecuted), whereas narrowminded rulers get less income (could be interpreted as people escaping to more tolerant countries). I was thinking maybe 0 loss for full Innovative and steps of 5% for each step towards Narrowminded.

 

[unmerged(23437)]

Similar things have been suggested before. My preferred system is eliminating the religious modifier altogether, increasing the penalty to tax from revolt risk and varying the amounts of tolerance with the Innovative slider.

 

[unmerged(10894)]

Innovativeness is already one of the most lop-sided sliders in the game, so I wouldn't make it more attractive if there wasn't some pretty severe penalties for being innovative.

 

[unmerged(23437)]

What, negative missionaries and increased stability costs aren't bad enough?

 

[unmerged(10894)]

You'd find that if you were playing against/with 8 other people, technology becomes very important. AI doesn't handle powerteching very well, but humans usually do, and thus if you fall behind that's the end of you! Whereas stability cost and missionaries are far easier to replace.

 

[Sabre Man]

You'd find that if you were playing against/with 8 other people, technology becomes very important. AI doesn't handle powerteching very well, but humans usually do, and thus if you fall behind that's the end of you! Whereas stability cost and missionaries are far easier to replace.

But how many people actually play MP vs. SP?

Let's have a poll and find out!

 

[unmerged(25696)]

What is the usefulness of Innovative ? Improving your tech. As such, you get the advantages until mid-1700s, no further. But you still get the decreased stab, missionaries and colonists. Seeing all the wealth you can get with colonies, and the money you lose with wrong religion and stability costs, I clearly play most of my games as narrowminded.

Besides, do you think normal that tolerant nations don't get more benefits from wrong religion provinces than narrowminded ones ?

Are all sliders balanced ? Not perfectly. Is Innovative balanced ? Absolutely not, and the only benefit has been reduced by 40% lately. For now, Centralization nearly offsets the narrowminded penalty, for a net penalty of 5%. Moreover, narrowminded nations tend to have less problems with religious matters, as they may convert their provinces, and they even get more random conversion events.

 

[Zander]

You'd find that if you were playing against/with 8 other people, technology becomes very important. AI doesn't handle powerteching very well, but humans usually do, and thus if you fall behind that's the end of you! Whereas stability cost and missionaries are far easier to replace.

I think Innovativeness is pretty good, but I don't see how missionaries are "easy to replace". Missionaries are, in fact, impossible to replace. If you're too Innovative to get them, you can't get them anywhere else.

 

[unmerged(23437)]

lawkeeper: Agreed exactly. Playing Protestant is a pain, 'cos you can't go too far down the Inno track without losing missionaries--not a good plan. Zander's quite right that you can't replace missionaries if you lose them by Inno. I don't know what you could do to eradicate that problem.

Thanks also for pointing out Centralised, which is of course, the most unbalanced slider in the game. I don't know of anyone who's advocated keeping Centralisation at 0 except for the purpose of avoiding events as countries such as Poland.

I think Sabre Man's got it right--lawkeeper and I always play SP, whereas Bocaj evidently plays MP. Thus, we're better placed to answer what's good for SP, and Bocaj for MP. What works in MP doesn't always work in SP, and vice versa.

 

[unmerged(26855)]

I like Sabremans suggestion.

 

[unmerged(9338)]

I agree with Sergeant Erkan: it`s a very interesting proposal.