Impressions from an Early beta-Preview

[unmerged(44030)]

What's the point in even making "first impression reviews", since the first impressions of a game usually don't
tell about the actual game anything?

Anyway, as Faeelin said: this sounds a lot better than Victoria I. Even if the reviewer is actually bashing the game
and listing "bad things" he found after trying the game for a few minutes. The endless POP micromanagement is gone.

 

[telesien]

In my experience, the clickfest of promoting POPs has been eliminated, but there is plenty to do in its place. I find myself keeping a close eye on POPs' issues, their needs, foreign relations, influence, national focus etc. you don't need to check every stat every day by a long shot, but the tedious POP management being removed has not in any way left you with little or nothing to do.

Of course, this is just my opinion, however I'd be surprised if it isn't widely shared.

This.

I always felt that the main reason why I don't go to war or neglect diplomacy lies solely in the fact, that I have som much POP isues to do. Still spliting, checking for understaffed factories or checking proper 2:3 composition.... Now, we're better off with this and onward to bright future of diplomacy/warfare and colonization

 

[unmerged(203712)]

BUDGET: maxed out all my sliders and lowered taxes so all groups could afford luxury goods, earning 300 pounds per day. Nothing to change here afterwards.

This can be a problem. Hopefully we won't see this in the released game. Things like big countries with maximized budget can still easily earn +£300 per day are no fun at all. In Vic1 I see GPs like UK or Russia has hundreds of thousands of cash and doesn't know how to spend it at all, how come? Even the super US today always has a deficit... Economy should not be that easy..

 

[telesien]

This can be a problem. Hopefully we won't see this in the released game. Things like big countries with maximized budget can still easily earn +£300 per day are no fun at all. In Vic1 I see GPs like UK or Russia has hundreds of thousands of cash and doesn't know how to spend it at all, how come? Even the super US today always has a deficit... Economy should not be that easy..

There are still several important questions.

-Did he have this surplus also after unpausing the game? The first numbers can't be taken seriously.

-How big army/navy Austria had? That can cost a lot.

-When he maxed sliders for wages, he will experience more of soldiers/clergymen/bureaucrats. Especially the soldiers are unproductive, so not only the expenses will rise quickly due to their sheer numbers, but also the productivity will go down.

 

[Keynes]

I think beginning players will have a tough initial go of it with not much to do if they don't pick an "active" country (the USA with all the Civil War events, or one with lots of rebels like Spain) from the start. Giving players the freedom to choose any country in the world comes with the requirement that some (at least the top 16) must be interesting to play.

Historically, Austria from 1836-1847 was pretty quiet. That was pretty much was the idea of Metternich's policy - boring is good. I don't think the game actually prevents you from say mixing it up with the Ottomans or mucking about in Italy if you really want to. At least nothing in the disclosed information would suggest such a limitation.

The old game allowed Austria to reform early and avoid the '48 revolutions; this one seems to take a more realistic approach which does have the side effect of limiting certain player actions.

True. However, how much of a good idea is that, especially if your country is all conservative (as most are at the beginning of the game)? Basically, you'd have to wait for a revolution or change in political alignment to do so, yes?

Assuming the system works as according to the manual and the basic setup of 1836 Austria is similar as to Vic1, you should be able to dismiss the ruling party and have your monarch appoint a new one by fiat (except not the socialists, communists or anarcho-liberals). That might have negative side effects for population management - that's a trade-off for getting more economic control. If Austrians want peace and quiet in their internal and external politics, they can't be forced to endure interesting times without getting at least a little miffed about it.

 

[ComradeOm]

What's the point in even making "first impression reviews", since the first impressions of a game usually don't
tell about the actual game anything?

Its not a review. Its a few comments on a forum from someone who reviews games. JaguarUSF merely thought that a few people here might be interested in hearing from someone who was not bound by a NDA

 

[Beleg32]

Vicky II - Not A Good Sign

James Allen, a reviewer, has posted initial impression on Blues News, and they're not good:

Spoiler Alert: I have been playing Victoria II for an upcoming review, and it is disappointing. And EU3 is one of my favorite games, so...

Too much stuff is either completely automated (production, trade, population groups) or requires so little input that it's essentially automated (budget, research, politics)....

The thing is, it's not automated outright, but it really is. Allow me to explain: trade changes on a daily schedule and there are so many goods to keep track of that you have to let the AI handle it.

Research projects complete every couple of years, so you just have to mess with that once in a while.

New political policies are only allowed to be changed when there is a great demand for them, so you'll rarely have to do anything here.

All of your factory slots are filled up automatically by the capitalist POP class, which does a terrible job picking out appropriate factories for the resources your nation produces, usually only pulling a small profit and usually a deficit.

You have no direct effects on POP groups, they will migrate automatically based on your budget settings.

The budget is trivially easy to get a large daily positive balance except for unruly nations like Russia. Just set and forget.

So all you're left to do is diplomacy, which is only interesting for Great Nations (the top 8 countries) who have access to spheres of influence, and move units around in war, and do colonies. Not so great.

Also, there are no missions or advisors to give you things to do as well.

Now, it's not all bad: the population sim is very detailed and the events are nice (though predictable...no way to avoid the American Civil War) and the tutorials are good and the interface is nice most of the time.

But I am quite disappointed that there isn't nearly enough to do.

What do you think ?

 

[ayrnieu]

I think you should look over here.

 

[vertinox]

James Allen, a reviewer, has posted initial impression on Blues News, and they're not good:



What do you think ?

Sounds like he just needs to learn the game or pause it when needs to handle the stuff he feels that he has to hand over to the AI.

I mean the game isn't a race.

But he sounds like he is missing the micromanaging that was in Vic1 which most people said made the game unfun. As never played Vic1, I can only say sometimes micro isn't all that great except maybe Rome:VV senate.

 

[Beleg32]

Damn, sorry everyone, please delete thread or close it.

 

[Projekt 919]

Excuse me but it has been Stated Specifically that if you choose the right decisions the American Civil war can be avoided, and if you like the micro go play vic 1

 

[Verenti]

Excuse me but it has been Stated Specifically that if you choose the right decisions the American Civil war can be avoided, and if you like the micro go play vic 1

Bah, That's hardly an attitude to have. In my mind his opinion has entirely more weight, considering he's played the game.

Besides, he's one of us.

 

[Baneslave]

Let's compare EU3 and V2, then:

PRODUCTION: nope, all of the factories are started automatically by capitalists.

BUDGET: maxed out all my sliders and lowered taxes so all groups could afford luxury goods, earning 300 pounds per day. Nothing to change here afterwards.

TECHNOLOGY: pick a tech, come back 4 years later.

POLITICS: nope, no reforms to do. Political party seems OK to me.

POPULATION: nope, all automated. Can place 2 National Foci for colonies or to nudge people towards a POP group.

TRADE: goodness, let's let the AI handle this mess.

DIPLOMACY: here's something. Spend the plentiful diplo points to change relations from negative to friendly in 12 months. Add countries to your sphere of influence, if you are a Great Power.

MILITARY: here's something else. Queue up some troops, wait for war.

Production. Click province, select building, click province, select building

Budget: Set sliders so that you don't go to negative during year. Don't touch anything unless situation changes.

Technology: Select one path, research until ahead of time penalties come and then change.

Politics: Once per ten years you are allowed change slider, which takes one click.

Population: One number per province. Not important.

Trade: Goodness, let's let the AI handle this mess.

Diplomacy: Click nation, select influence, click nation, select influence, click nation, select offer alliance...

Military: Here's something else. Queue up some troops, wait for war.



Edit. Not trying to insult you, but I think these games are as boring as you make them.

 

[GrafKeks]

that review is hilarious from my POV it says all the things are bad that I think are good...

Automatisation is a really good thing for Grand Strategy games that tries to simulate something as Victoria does.

I.e When you´re the Tsar in Russia you do not say the whole hey population group from now on you´re... one moment... hey the factories aren´t working well all of you are craftsmen now. Well the Tsar gave the permission to his officers to draft people as they like sometimes but even that he did not on his own he simply gave them the mission/order to do it.

That´s why I love automatisation (and I hope paradox will go further in this direction[although for some things there should be the option to turn it off/on)

 

[Psychedelic Sou]

Sounds to me like he never played the original Victoria.

Example:

Allow me to explain: trade changes on a daily schedule and there are so many goods to keep track of that you have to let the AI handle it.

Which was exactly the same in Victoria 1, which I didn't mind at all. True, the trade AI was horrible in Vicky 1 which forced you to do everything yourself, but it sounds to me like its the same in Vicky 2: you can do everything yourself, but you also have the option to use an AI. Seems like he took the easy option and went with the AI.

It just sounds to me like he was hoping this to be an EUIII set in the 19th century.

 

[unmerged(89129)]

True. However, how much of a good idea is that, especially if your country is all conservative (as most are at the beginning of the game)? Basically, you'd have to wait for a revolution or change in political alignment to do so, yes? I could be wrong, as you know better than I.

**WARNING** BASED ON LATE BETA, SO MAY NOT BE STILL THE CASE
However, my bigger concern about production is the quality of the automated factories the capitalists build. Example time: in my game playing powerhouse Sardinia-Piedmont, I was allowed to construct one factory while the capitalists built four (Interventionism economic policy by the ruling conservative party). Here are the current daily incomes of the factories: +3.34, -9.07, -0.33, +0.70, 0.00. Guess which one I built. The factories from the capitalists don't take advantage of the goods produced in you country, so you have to import all of the goods for them. Now, this may be fixed in the release version, so I shall wait for the gold version of the game for further review. I think beginning players will have a tough initial go of it with notmuch to do if they don't pick an "active" country (the USA with all the Civil War events, or one with lots of rebels like Spain) from the start. Giving players the freedom to choose any country in the world comes with the requirement that some (at least the top 16) must be interesting to play.

This will be the last post by me until I can play the RTM/gold version of the game, so not to fuel the fire of speculation further.

wait a minute, why should it matter whether the inputs of your factories are made in your country? their price is set by the world market, unless you have import tariffs there shouldn't be any difference, and if you have set import tariffs then its your fault your factories aren't making any money.

 

[Gaute65]

!. He has not played with the gold version. He probably got a version that's at a month old.

2. Paradox will balancing the game up too release and give out an 1.1 patch. a patch that will include all changes the last month.

3. Paradox will listen to those who buy V2, and if the majority say's the game to easy Paradox will give out patch 1.2 that will make the game harder.

4. The main priority from Paradox is that V2 is a stable game that works on release. My guess is that V2 will work a lot better than HOI3. But it will not be perfect.

 

[ashandresash]

Originally Posted by RedRalphWiggum View Post
In my experience, the clickfest of promoting POPs has been eliminated, but there is plenty to do in its place. I find myself keeping a close eye on POPs' issues, their needs, foreign relations, influence, national focus etc. you don't need to check every stat every day by a long shot, but the tedious POP management being removed has not in any way left you with little or nothing to do.

Of course, this is just my opinion, however I'd be surprised if it isn't widely shared.

This.

I always felt that the main reason why I don't go to war or neglect diplomacy lies solely in the fact, that I have som much POP isues to do. Still spliting, checking for understaffed factories or checking proper 2:3 composition.... Now, we're better off with this and onward to bright future of diplomacy/warfare and colonization

I agree. Changes included in Vicky2 seems to make us play in another mood from Vicky1. We should be more directed to slow but continuous political change, as well as the geopolitical area (which, in fact, is a good point in a victorian game).

Though I love "Out of 8", and I tend to agree lot of his reviews (EUIII In Nomine and Heir to the Throne, i.e.), I have some differences (like overrating IMO Galaxy Civ II, or underrating HoI2).

Hopefully, I expect Gold version of Vicky2 having a better review than those impressions, or at least to make of this one more of the few disagreements I have with this game-review site.

 

[SIJoe]

Yeah man, as reviewer you should really choose your words more carefully

This is a preview, not a review. It's probably based off the same code I've just playing through, actually, but yeah, it would be morally and ethically unsound to do a product review off code that hasn't been cleared for final release.

In fact, you can read my own preview of the game here. (shameless plug, but all's fair in love and war, right?)

Paradox, to my knowledge, has yet to release the 'gold' code to the press, and even if OutofEight had gotten it before the rest of us (which if you have mate, fair play), then it's awefully early to be giving even impressions. You don't give impressions at the review stage unless you're doing something long term like an MMO.

But hey, that's just my view, I wouldn't want to impose my own editorial standards on your good self.

 

[Niptium]

Yeah man, as reviewer you should really choose your words more carefully

This is a preview, not a review. It's probably based off the same code I've just playing through, actually, but yeah, it would be morally and ethically unsound to do a product review off code that hasn't been cleared for final release.

In fact, you can read my own preview of the game here. (shameless plug, but all's fair in love and war, right?)

Paradox, to my knowledge, has yet to release the 'gold' code to the press, and even if OutofEight had gotten it before the rest of us (which if you have mate, fair play), then it's awefully early to be giving even impressions. You don't give impressions at the review stage unless you're doing something long term like an MMO.

But hey, that's just my view, I wouldn't want to impose my own editorial standards on your good self.

I think SIJoe's point of view is more articulate than the thread-starter's. There is ways to say things that don't verge in negativism.