Imperator: Rome Developer Diary - 4th of November

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hcek

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This possibility remains but is now about taking in characters from the great families of the fallen country. These characters will be fewer than before and they will be considered minor characters in your country (of course they could still end up integrated by your own families later if sufficiently powerful).
Does this mean that Heraclia Pontica will be the only country capable of forming the Achaemenid Empire?
 

StJimmyRocks92

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Not a fan of this change, honestly. Going to add support to the “republics should get a higher max families” crowd.
 

We Who Are About 2 Die

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Only thing I like about this is adoption and the family leader/prestige connection.

One, families seem to be capped very low. If I understand correctly; 4 at regional, 5 at major, and 6 at great. Thus, there is no minor families only majors. So the politics of major and minor, family alliances are out the window. Instead of making families important by increasing their abilities, they went the route of cutting out "excess" families to increase families importance.

Disappointed.
 
Last edited:

Reman

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This change looks good. Previously, families were almost entirely ignored since large empires could have over three dozen of them, with 40-80% being scorned at any given time. These changes look like they'll inject some strategy into the situation, forcing us to actually pay attention to families but simultaneously making it feasible to do so.
 

Akbar The Great

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Maybe Empire should have a couple more fmailies, but all in all this change is for the better, there were too many carachters to keep track of before, most of them doing nex to nothing, the whole thing was a mess, and of course IR isn't first and foremost an RPG like CK is.
 

Mindel

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A country will never have less than 3 potential families, and will gain an additional family when it becomes a Regional Power and a fifth Family once it becomes a Great Power.

Could we perhaps make this number grow even higher for larger great powers? Parthia, for example, famously had 7 great houses (aside from the ruling one). It would feel quite weird for two of them to be left out for lack of space. Maybe 7 or 8 is a better limit.
 

Pugmak

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I'm expecting to get burned at the stake for this but...

What might make it real interesting is if the numbers part of a character's stats were hidden. We could see if the character was "lively" or "dull", "Arrogant" or "humble", etc, but the numbers, nope. Kind of a crap shoot when hiring a guy, just like irl.

Visible things would also be powerbase and loyalty because those are things that can be seen in the day to day. But maybe a hidden variable "can be treacherous" added to some who appear loyal. Because we all know that never happens.
 

Will Steel

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This looks really nice, although I don't necessarily agree about having only few large families. It is as confusing to have hundred characters with same surnames as it is to have too many 1-character families. Having lots of characters is actually interesting.

Julian family started off as a mostly unknown house in early Rome, yet became its great rulers later. Shunga dynasty starts off as a minor family under Mauryan Empire, only to rise through ranks to the top and eventually take over it in a coup. These scenarios aren't possible if minor characters have no family and aren't allowed to marry or have kids.

I hope we can mod this to allow more families or at least let minor families go on and breed. :)
 
Last edited:

starchitect

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Looking great!

Have you considered making relative Family Prestige also modify the expected number of jobs each Family wants?

Code:
Example:
16 total jobs, so the 4 families expect to control 12 of them
House 1 (600 prestige), expects 6 jobs
House 2 (300 prestige), expects 3 jobs
House 3 (200 prestige), expects 2 jobs
House 4 (100 prestige), expects 1 job

i.e, Expected jobs = .8(Total Jobs)*(Family Prestige/Total Prestige of all Families)

This would make allowing a Family to become too Prestigous very dangerous, as it is self reinforcing. High prestige means they demand more jobs means they earn more prestige. If you let it get out of control you set yourself on a course for civil war when one day you inevitably cannot meet the demands of a family that is wanting more and more. Power accumulates more power
 

We Who Are About 2 Die

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Looking great!

Have you considered making relative Family Prestige also modify the expected number of jobs each Family wants?

Code:
Example:
16 total jobs, so the 4 families expect to control 12 of them
House 1 (600 prestige), expects 6 jobs
House 2 (300 prestige), expects 3 jobs
House 3 (200 prestige), expects 2 jobs
House 4 (100 prestige), expects 1 job

i.e, Expected jobs = .8(Total Jobs)*(Family Prestige/Total Prestige of all Families)

This would make allowing a Family to become too Prestigous very dangerous, as it is self reinforcing. High prestige means they demand more jobs means they earn more prestige. If you let it get out of control you set yourself on a course for civil war when one day you inevitably cannot meet the demands of a family that is wanting more and more. Power accumulates more power
This is genius. With some work, it can be a very engaging mechanic
 

Numahr

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This is something that can happen at times. The mechanic is soft in that if somehow a family rises and places you over your current cap then another will fall. This means that for instance if a Minor character rises to be king of a monarchy then another family will likely be pushed out, with all members turned into minor characters.
About this event: in history, the point in integrating nobles of conquered countries in the political game was to smooth the political integration of the newly conquered space. See Alexander the Great's example.

So, in the game, you should more strongly link this decision to the mechanic you have to represent this: agressive expansion.
 

starchitect

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The changes look nice, however I think that having from 3 to 5 families might be too little, wouldn't it be better to have from 4 to 6 families or from 5 to 7?

As for the we need more families argument, The answer I assume is largely that each one needs enough powerbase to theoretically be a threat in a civil war. With 5, you are always threatened by at least 20% of your nations powerbase, or more depending on prestige. Every family you add decreases that number.

The only way I can mechanically see around this would be that any modifier that increases number of families, also increases the total possible powerbase in the country, which would mean that if before you has 5 families and 300 total powerbase, 1 disloyal one is threating you with roughly around 60 powerbase. If you had 8 families you would need 480 total powerbase for any one of them to threaten you with a base of 60. Doing this might have some wonky effects I am not thinking of, as essentially you are mucking with the relative balance of everything. Also, right now Civil wars are triggered by a percentage of your powerbase being disloyal, so adding more familes should decrease that percentage. Essentially, a country with more Families would be less stable because there would be more powerbase out there to potentially threaten it. Maybe that makes sense for a Republic?
 
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