[idea] Plunder casus beli

[uleslaw]

I think the game still needs new casus beli. I love playing as small county in big kingdom like France and extend my 'empire' step by step. But sometimes I have literally nothing to do besides from waiting for my Chancellor to fabricate a claim to my neighbour's county or waiting for money to hire mercenaries to conquer new holding if I already had a claim. So all I want is to add some new casus beli. Like "plunder casus beli".

- The casus beli requires many prestige (for instance 200 for count, 300 for duke, 500 for king, 1000 for emperor) and/or piety (same numbers for example) and/or requires few traits - like tyrant, dishonorable, cruel.
- if you win, you get some money and your opponent's holdings lost few buildings (pillage) and your opponent and his family (or part of his family) became your prisoners. But of course your domain will not extend.
- white peace - you loss prestige, gold, piety
- defeat - you pay reparaition and you or part of your family became your opponet's prisoners.

That could be a risky way to get some money (and to spend time during game). It also could make negative traits like tyrant or dishonorable more useful, since for example the casus beli could be use only for dishonorable tyrant characters.

Since I am not any kind of moder, this is just pure idea. What do you think?

Edit: sorry, I was sure I created that thread at User Modification forum

 

[Battle bunny]

Um... a "casus belli" means "reason for war", i.e. something that is more or less accepted by (at least certain) other monarchs to be a just cause for war. A territorial claim is a just cause for a war because you have a legal claim to something your enemy holds. Just randomly deciding to wreck an enemy country doesn't constitute one.

 

[uleslaw]

Um... a "casus belli" means "reason for war",

I think getting some money actually is quite good "reason for war", especially for dishonorable characters

Maybe we could use different notion than Casus Beli. But its not about notion, its about idea

 

[Arko]

Um... a "casus belli" means "reason for war", i.e. something that is more or less accepted by (at least certain) other monarchs to be a just cause for war. A territorial claim is a just cause for a war because you have a legal claim to something your enemy holds. Just randomly deciding to wreck an enemy country doesn't constitute one.

ask mongols' and aztecs' victims if they find invasions being a just cause

 

[No idea]

That kind of CB should only work against kingdoms of different religions, IMHO. No christian ruler, no matter how dishonourable, would justify war "because I want to get richer plundering my brother christians". And, even with that limit, it should cost prestige.

 

[anonymouswolfm]

It reminds me of the pillage decision in CK1 - miss that a lot. Why not bring that back?

 

[uleslaw]

No christian ruler, no matter how dishonourable, would justify war "because I want to get richer plundering my brother christians".

We could assume that that christian ruler could somehow convince other christian rulers that he is not Devil Incarnate but just Very Bad and Traitorous Man. For example, that casus beli could require some amount of gold to represent cost for fabricate small evidence to justify plunder without taking over a county. Maybe also your victim and maybe even his relatives will gain weak claim to your capital, if you use Plunder Casus Beli? Or your neighbours? In my opionion that issue could be workaround somehow.

 

[Sian]

Giving a Plunder CB to Pagans (Norse, Romuva and Tengri) would make sense, since that was what they did by and large ... otherwise ... not that much

 

[yourworstnightm]

Giving a Plunder CB to Pagans (Norse, Romuva and Tengri) would make sense, since that was what they did by and large ... otherwise ... not that much

Actually I would have plunder, pillage as an event chain, not a war, which gives the target a "retribution" casus belli if they figure out it was you. But yeah, would make most sense for pagans, or Christian and Muslims at the religious frontier (since it's not a sin to be an ass towards heathens).

 

[Thure]

Obly pagans or Christians vs. Muslims? Really...? And what did William do?

 

[Francis II]

Obly pagans or Christians vs. Muslims? Really...? And what did William do?

Also, Scots used to raid across the English border all the time. I like this idea, but I would restrict it to dishonorable sorts (as the OP says) and to counts and dukes (kings are too prestigious to do mere raids). Maybe pagan kings could do it, but not Christian kings.

 

[Sian]

William warred for revoktion after a failed civil war

 

[tuareg109]

Only Christians vs. Muslims vs. Pagans?
What about the Fourth Crusade?

 

[Hibernian]

Yeah I think it's been proposed before to have a "Raid" or "Plunder" type war, as it makes sense for things like the Steppe Nomads, who were constantly raiding each other and their settled neighbours.

It would definitely add to the game to have the ability to attack and weaken your enemies in a minor way, without actually trying to conquer them.

 

[Divi]

William warred for revoktion after a failed civil war

Pretty much this; the harrying of the north happens almost every game, usually when William starts trying to get rid of the old saxon aristocracy. The few times I haven't seen it happen were when William kicks the bucket early or the Mercian and Northumbrian earls just surrender to royal demands without a fight.

 

[Thure]

Pretty much this; the harrying of the north happens almost every game, usually when William starts trying to get rid of the old saxon aristocracy. The few times I haven't seen it happen were when William kicks the bucket early or the Mercian and Northumbrian earls just surrender to royal demands without a fight.

I mean it more about the events one post over me.Plunder via event, shouldn't be only for different religions. William plunder in this civil war too.

 

[Malvius]

It sounds interesting because of the historical backround that the vikings took Danegeld from foraign countries....
Or they plundered this country which didn't pay to get that Money.

If you have to pay Prestige to it it would be no problem, my Emperor gains a lot of this.

 

[No idea]

Obly pagans or Christians vs. Muslims? Really...? And what did William do?

His Cb was a claim on a kingdom. Everybody pillaged, but one thing is pillaging becuase you are at war and a different thing is a pillage cb among christians

 

[Frax]

Norse can plunder coast without going to war but it gives a CB, that last for a very short time. so when a nation is having civil war/major war you would get some pesky vikings on you're door step and either you let them steal your women and gold or you have to go to war to stop em.

 

[tuareg109]

His Cb was a claim on a kingdom. Everybody pillaged, but one thing is pillaging becuase you are at war and a different thing is a pillage cb among christians

What is the Fourth Crusade?