I think population growth is going to need to be looked at.

[happyscrub]

Population has always had checks and balances in this game with various modifiers. The biggest is where all your pops of a species share the same growth across all planets.

2.2 has unchain pops and I just been abusing the heck out of it. I don't think it was intended for me to have like 100 pops before someone gets to like 30 lol.

 

[RyanDA]

Population has always had checks and balances in this game with various modifiers. The biggest is where all your pops of a species share the same growth across all planets.

2.2 has unchain pops and I just been abusing the heck out of it. I don't think it was intended for me to have like 100 pops before someone gets to like 30 lol.

Each pop is a lot less potent than they used to be. It seems fine so far.

 

[happyscrub]

Each pop is a lot less potent than they used to be. It seems fine so far.

How you figure that? Population is still the majority of your income. And 2 pops is still twice as strong as 1.

 

[RyanDA]

How you figure that? Population is still the majority of your income. And 2 pops is still twice as strong as 1.

You need a lot more pops now to fill out a planet than previous patches. The old pop growth system would make the game take 1000 years in current patch.

 

[happyscrub]

You need a lot more pops now to fill out a planet than previous patches. The old pop growth system would make the game take 1000 years in current patch.

But that's actually a bonus to abusing pop growth because that raises the ceiling by having larger planets.

 

[Jorgen_CAB]

Population has always had checks and balances in this game with various modifiers. The biggest is where all your pops of a species share the same growth across all planets.

2.2 has unchain pops and I just been abusing the heck out of it. I don't think it was intended for me to have like 100 pops before someone gets to like 30 lol.

Not sure I understood what you did... can you explain further. Is it a bug/exploit?

 

[hellatze]

You need pop for mineral. You need pop for police. You need pop for amenity. You need pop for alloy.

Yadayadayada

Pop are WEAK.

 

[RyanDA]

I don't know the math in the old game, but in this game there is NOTHING in place to slow down pop growth that I see can see. So two planets can be produce pops twice as fast as 1 planet despite having even numbers. Makes no sense.

I play devouring swarm:

Steps in a new game:

1. Send out science ship to find new planet. When you find it, survey your way to it from home.
2. Save up minerals to buy a colony ship (don't even spend it on building space resource stations)
3. Build a colony ship way before you even can colonize with it so you can land on new planet as soon as possible
4. Soon as you land you get have 1 extra pop + twice as fast growth.
5. Manage your income to produce another colony ship.
6. Search for another planet
7. Do the same thing and now you have 2 extra pops + 3 times growth.
Extra credit - While you doing all that, if you can spare extra pop to any new planets, send some to get it to 5 to make a spawning pool.

Pops now require other pops working other jobs to make a pop do his own work. You need a LOT of pops to get anything done now.

You need that much growth.

 

[happyscrub]

Not sure I understood what you did... can you explain further. Is it a bug/exploit?

1. Turn on food policy for growth, and production policy for more food and minerals
2. Send out science ship to find new planet. When you find it, survey your way to it from home.
3. save up minerals to buy food district first so you can buy ship. (don't even spend it on building space resource stations until you get your district).
4.. Build a colony ship way before you even can colonize with it so you can land on new planet as soon as possible
5. Soon as you land you get have 1 extra pop + twice as fast growth.
6. Manage your income to produce another colony ship.
7. Search for another planet
8. Do the same thing and now you have 2 extra pops + 3 times growth.
Extra credit - While you doing all that, if you can spare extra pop to any new planets, send some to get it to 5 to make a spawning pool.

 

[JOD]

1. Turn on food policy for growth, and production policy for more food and minerals
2. Send out science ship to find new planet. When you find it, survey your way to it from home.
3. save up minerals to buy food district first so you can buy ship. (don't even spend it on building space resource stations until you get your district).
4.. Build a colony ship way before you even can colonize with it so you can land on new planet as soon as possible
5. Soon as you land you get have 1 extra pop + twice as fast growth.
6. Manage your income to produce another colony ship.
7. Search for another planet
8. Do the same thing and now you have 2 extra pops + 3 times growth.
Extra credit - While you doing all that, if you can spare extra pop to any new planets, send some to get it to 5 to make a spawning pool.

That's....literally how the game is intended to be played. I'm not sure I understand your complaint. What exactly is your issue and how do you think it should work instead?

 

[Foefaller]

Also, with spawning pool it sounds like you are playing a hive mind, which are currently set up to have crazy pop growth compared to normal empires. That's what they get in return for, among other things, no trade.

 

[Maal]

Also, with spawning pool it sounds like you are playing a hive mind, which are currently set up to have crazy pop growth compared to normal empires. That's what they get in return for, among other things, no trade.

Also to add to your point since OP talk about new colonies, hiveminds do not have the new colonies penalties that the other empires have. -50% growth penalty on new colonies with less than 10 pops and they create a big growth penalty/emigration on non-colony world.

 

[King of Zoot]

Too many early colonies will crash growth on your home planet due to emigration. It csn be a problem if you need to get a new factory or lab running.

 

[happyscrub]

Too many early colonies will crash growth on your home planet due to emigration. It csn be a problem if you need to get a new factory or lab running.

Not with hive minds. I have no experience with other races but i'm CONSTANTLY resettling people off my home world to other planets. I never have emigration on any planet unless I run out of housing which almost never happens.

 

[bobucles]

Swarms don't care since they don't obey regular emigration rules. They only seem to bother emigrating when a current world has no more room for drones.

Planets are absolutely more powerful than space territory in this version. A single pop generates about 5 minerals when before they made 2, and you can now pack a planet with several times more pops. Between the choice of spending 100 alloys to pick up another 2 mineral space mine vs. putting effort into more pops, pops are king. Each planet means another line of pop growth so gobble up those planets.

 

[Jorgen_CAB]

The problem is that growth is based on number of places you grow pop and not on how many POP you have in one place as it should grow.

In my opinion I don't understand why Paradox did not go with a more realistic POP growth model.

I have no real problem with hives but I think that hives should get penalties to research in general for being hive. The lack of individuality will certainly have an impact on innovation and would make them more interesting. The could get normal social/biology research but severe penalties in Physics and Engineering.

Since POP are the single most important economic factor in the game then someone that grow POP as fast as they do must come with some major drawbacks.

 

[bobucles]

I have no real problem with hives but I think that hives should get penalties to research in general for being hive.

This kind of already happens as a natural consequence of playing hive. Most of my early game resources go into grabbing and growing worlds since they have to grow pops and can't really steal them. All the effort into development naturally takes away from time spent on high tech resources and science.

 

[JOD]

The problem is that growth is based on number of places you grow pop and not on how many POP you have in one place as it should grow.

In my opinion I don't understand why Paradox did not go with a more realistic POP growth model.

I have no real problem with hives but I think that hives should get penalties to research in general for being hive. The lack of individuality will certainly have an impact on innovation and would make them more interesting. The could get normal social/biology research but severe penalties in Physics and Engineering.

Since POP are the single most important economic factor in the game then someone that grow POP as fast as they do must come with some major drawbacks.

Hives are fine balance wise. Their overall economic strength is still about the same or slightly less than a normal empire. Thier civics are still weaker, they can't benefit from the free energy from trade, most empires have negative relationship modifiers with them, they can't form commercial pacts, they can't benefit from mega corps and they only have one ascenscion option. And they don't have ruler traits.

They're already loosing out on a lot. I'm glad they finally have something to make up for all the stuff they miss out on. This is the only patch so far I actually enjoy playing as one.

And they aren't even the theoretical fastest growing empire type. The fastest possible growth uses immigration. Hives need to strong early game because they will fall behind normal empires without it.

 

[Jorgen_CAB]

Hives are fine balance wise. Their overall economic strength is still about the same or slightly less than a normal empire. Thier civics are still weaker, they can't benefit from the free energy from trade, most empires have negative relationship modifiers with them, they can't form commercial pacts, they can't benefit from mega corps and they only have one ascenscion option. And they don't have ruler traits.

They're already loosing out on a lot. I'm glad they finally have something to make up for all the stuff they miss out on. This is the only patch so far I actually enjoy playing as one.

And they aren't even the theoretical fastest growing empire type. The fastest possible growth uses immigration. Hives need to strong early game because they will fall behind normal empires without it.

I never play hives so I will take your word for it.

 

[BlackUmbrellas]

...Hiveminds are SUPPOSED to be growth-focused.

That's definitely how the game is supposed to function.