I know its not my place to request anything.

[BeauNiddle]

They could get the same effect if they invited everyone plus some players. They would get the same thing and made a service to the fans. They really needed to invite the italian press?

Don't forget that Johan said this event was planned when they thought the game would be out shortly. If you look at the invites as people who might be interested in the game but who wouldn't naturally get it on release and do PR for it then they make a lot more sense.

Of course then the release day slipped somewhat

These events aren't suddenly created - if Paradox paid to fly everybody over it must have been arranged months in advance.

Now if they were willing to arrange a second event or allowed others access to beta keys then that should indeed include more HOI specific people.

 

[potski]

This is all garbage conspiracy theory type nonsense. It was a press/media event, and in no other game release do the developers have the ability to rigidly control who can attend these sort of events to exclude people who are not "correct", as not having played enough hours of the previous version of the game.

This was the case with gaming websites and magazines. The organisation was invited and they chose who to send. And there was no guarantee not only that people who attended HOI3 events had played HOI2, but they were even interested in grand strategy games, or WW2 era games.

Nevertheless, there were over 20 people at the event, and it is plainly wrong that none of them ever played HOI before. I watched a video the other day from someone who had played both HOI3 and HOI2.

The other issue here is your ridiculous expectations of what should be in the videos at this stage. Of course it would be interesting to see someone with good knowledge of the game do an in depth analysis of the features. But we just reached Alpha, and there is no point in getting too into details that might change before release.

The purpose of the event is not for fanboys to understand the game, but simply to promote the fact that the game is coming in about six months, and should be playable, interesting and fun. And to relate the game to a wider audience it is inevitable that comparisons with other games are made. Someone might compare it to War in the East, or the campaign parts of TW, or a whole host of games they have played before and are known to their audience, but surprise, surprise the most comparable games understood by a very wide audience these days are EU4 and CK2. Because they have the same engine, and producer.

In the limited space in an online article, magazine or a ten minute segment in a YouTube stream then broad impressions only are going to be portrayed. For those of us who want to know very detailed game mechanics, then it is disappointing that not one of them mentioned logistics, and there is still no clue on how that works. We know that there was an attempt to carry out an amphibious invasion by Brazil in one game, and it seemed to fail (with huge attrition of the Brazil army) before the army even boarded any ships because of logistics problems. The player mentioned sending the army overland through jungle without any supplies. I would have loved to see that. And we know in one game Canada successfully invaded Brazil, but we didn't get to see how it was done. We know Johan played as the USA and built a huge strat bomber force, we didn't get to see it, nor really anything beyond what we have seen already in the DD on the air war. And we've seen or heard absolutely nothing about the naval war.

But I am an adult, not a child who feels entitled to have everything I demand now, as many of the people on this forum. And I know these details will come, in DDs and in more detailed reviews on YT. When they are ready.

There is no way that Paradox are going to hand out a beta key to some HOI fanboy, and say there you go, son, spend as much time as you want recording our game and publishing it all on YouTube. The keys that were issued to those who attended the event were removed shortly afterwards, one guy tried to go into Steam during the video to show how many hours he had played, but found it had gone. And understandably - they are not beta testers. They weren't there to test the game, they were there to promote the game to as wide an audience as possible through their channels, sites and magazines.

Some of the people mentioned above, or people with similar skills/experience of the HOI series, will undoubtedly get beta keys, as part of the closed beta testing. But they will be under an NDA and won't be able to publish stuff on YouTube until Paradox agree. That might be only in the last couple of weeks before release.

 

[GeneralPetrov]

This is all garbage conspiracy theory type nonsense. It was a press/media event, and in no other game release do the developers have the ability to rigidly control who can attend these sort of events to exclude people who are not "correct", as not having played enough hours of the previous version of the game.

This was the case with gaming websites and magazines. The organisation was invited and they chose who to send. And there was no guarantee not only that people who attended HOI3 events had played HOI2, but they were even interested in grand strategy games, or WW2 era games.

Nevertheless, there were over 20 people at the event, and it is plainly wrong that none of them ever played HOI before. I watched a video the other day from someone who had played both HOI3 and HOI2.

The other issue here is your ridiculous expectations of what should be in the videos at this stage. Of course it would be interesting to see someone with good knowledge of the game do an in depth analysis of the features. But we just reached Alpha, and there is no point in getting too into details that might change before release.

The purpose of the event is not for fanboys to understand the game, but simply to promote the fact that the game is coming in about six months, and should be playable, interesting and fun. And to relate the game to a wider audience it is inevitable that comparisons with other games are made. Someone might compare it to War in the East, or the campaign parts of TW, or a whole host of games they have played before and are known to their audience, but surprise, surprise the most comparable games understood by a very wide audience these days are EU4 and CK2. Because they have the same engine, and producer.

In the limited space in an online article, magazine or a ten minute segment in a YouTube stream then broad impressions only are going to be portrayed. For those of us who want to know very detailed game mechanics, then it is disappointing that not one of them mentioned logistics, and there is still no clue on how that works. We know that there was an attempt to carry out an amphibious invasion by Brazil in one game, and it seemed to fail (with huge attrition of the Brazil army) before the army even boarded any ships because of logistics problems. The player mentioned sending the army overland through jungle without any supplies. I would have loved to see that. And we know in one game Canada successfully invaded Brazil, but we didn't get to see how it was done. We know Johan played as the USA and built a huge strat bomber force, we didn't get to see it, nor really anything beyond what we have seen already in the DD on the air war. And we've seen or heard absolutely nothing about the naval war.

But I am an adult, not a child who feels entitled to have everything I demand now, as many of the people on this forum. And I know these details will come, in DDs and in more detailed reviews on YT. When they are ready.

There is no way that Paradox are going to hand out a beta key to some HOI fanboy, and say there you go, son, spend as much time as you want recording our game and publishing it all on YouTube. The keys that were issued to those who attended the event were removed shortly afterwards, one guy tried to go into Steam during the video to show how many hours he had played, but found it had gone. And understandably - they are not beta testers. They weren't there to test the game, they were there to promote the game to as wide an audience as possible through their channels, sites and magazines.

Some of the people mentioned above, or people with similar skills/experience of the HOI series, will undoubtedly get beta keys, as part of the closed beta testing. But they will be under an NDA and won't be able to publish stuff on YouTube until Paradox agree. That might be only in the last couple of weeks before release.

This, you just put my thoughts into words. Something people need to learn about here is a lil bit of patience.

 

[FRodrigues]

Don't forget that Johan said this event was planned when they thought the game would be out shortly. If you look at the invites as people who might be interested in the game but who wouldn't naturally get it on release and do PR for it then they make a lot more sense.

Of course then the release day slipped somewhat

These events aren't suddenly created - if Paradox paid to fly everybody over it must have been arranged months in advance.

Now if they were willing to arrange a second event or allowed others access to beta keys then that should indeed include more HOI specific people.

This is all garbage conspiracy theory type nonsense. It was a press/media event, and in no other game release do the developers have the ability to rigidly control who can attend these sort of events to exclude people who are not "correct", as not having played enough hours of the previous version of the game.

This was the case with gaming websites and magazines. The organisation was invited and they chose who to send. And there was no guarantee not only that people who attended HOI3 events had played HOI2, but they were even interested in grand strategy games, or WW2 era games.

Nevertheless, there were over 20 people at the event, and it is plainly wrong that none of them ever played HOI before. I watched a video the other day from someone who had played both HOI3 and HOI2.

The other issue here is your ridiculous expectations of what should be in the videos at this stage. Of course it would be interesting to see someone with good knowledge of the game do an in depth analysis of the features. But we just reached Alpha, and there is no point in getting too into details that might change before release.

The purpose of the event is not for fanboys to understand the game, but simply to promote the fact that the game is coming in about six months, and should be playable, interesting and fun. And to relate the game to a wider audience it is inevitable that comparisons with other games are made. Someone might compare it to War in the East, or the campaign parts of TW, or a whole host of games they have played before and are known to their audience, but surprise, surprise the most comparable games understood by a very wide audience these days are EU4 and CK2. Because they have the same engine, and producer.

In the limited space in an online article, magazine or a ten minute segment in a YouTube stream then broad impressions only are going to be portrayed. For those of us who want to know very detailed game mechanics, then it is disappointing that not one of them mentioned logistics, and there is still no clue on how that works. We know that there was an attempt to carry out an amphibious invasion by Brazil in one game, and it seemed to fail (with huge attrition of the Brazil army) before the army even boarded any ships because of logistics problems. The player mentioned sending the army overland through jungle without any supplies. I would have loved to see that. And we know in one game Canada successfully invaded Brazil, but we didn't get to see how it was done. We know Johan played as the USA and built a huge strat bomber force, we didn't get to see it, nor really anything beyond what we have seen already in the DD on the air war. And we've seen or heard absolutely nothing about the naval war.

But I am an adult, not a child who feels entitled to have everything I demand now, as many of the people on this forum. And I know these details will come, in DDs and in more detailed reviews on YT. When they are ready.

There is no way that Paradox are going to hand out a beta key to some HOI fanboy, and say there you go, son, spend as much time as you want recording our game and publishing it all on YouTube. The keys that were issued to those who attended the event were removed shortly afterwards, one guy tried to go into Steam during the video to show how many hours he had played, but found it had gone. And understandably - they are not beta testers. They weren't there to test the game, they were there to promote the game to as wide an audience as possible through their channels, sites and magazines.

Some of the people mentioned above, or people with similar skills/experience of the HOI series, will undoubtedly get beta keys, as part of the closed beta testing. But they will be under an NDA and won't be able to publish stuff on YouTube until Paradox agree. That might be only in the last couple of weeks before release.

Yeah you are right.

 

[Porkman]

There's also another possible reason not to open a 20 player mixed press player multiplayer to people who have played a lot of HOI3... skills between HOI's are presumably transferable.

If the same three people won every game or tried to control the alliance, that wouldn't be fun. Yes, Johan was playing too, but he wasn't playing for blood.

It was like inviting a bunch of people to play street fighter and mash buttons, it's no fun to do that if one person is good and already knows how to do all of the specials...

I think potski's explanation is the real explanation, but I've heard that at press events for multiplayer games that have testers playing the press, the testers purposely play way, way, below their skill level in order to make it fun for the inexperienced reporters...

See this story, (a different genre of game, but I can't imagine that the same thing wouldn't be a concern with a strategy game where the time investment and thus frustration upon losing, is even greater)

QA testers have an unusual relationship with gaming press. I’d like to elaborate a little. You see, every time a member of the press plays any game that requires a second player, you’re playing alongside a member of QA. We have the most experience, and handing the game off to some unpracticed marketing guy with no idea what bugs dodge would be a catastrophe.

So here’s where it gets awkward on the QA end. We have collectively spent the last 6 to 9 months playing nothing but this game for 8-16 hours a day. Once you hit 1000 hours spent playing a single game you ascend beyond mortal skill. Multiplayer games against each other are measured in single bullets and millisecond reaction times.

Now imagine asking these people to lose.

We are asked to collectively throw the game while playing you. To appear like we are trying but never kill you. To make you feel like a champ. I really hope that didn’t shatter egos.

Now to rein this back in and turn it into a proper story.

It was roughly 4 years ago, and I was on the 30-ish person large Multiplayer team for a AAA Shooter. The brutal grind known as the prep for E3 was winding down and it was game time. The name of the game was 3 days of non-stop multiplayer against the press. Breaks and lunch taken at our desks. The entire time only maintaining the facade of a game taking place. Bullets flying everywhere but to no real effect. Like storm troopers.

We periodically get feedback from the attendants on the floor with the press. Things like “he’s lost over by the docks, someone get over there and keep the action going,” or “people are noticing the bad lighting on those trees. Keep the action elsewhere.”

While we were getting feedback from our liaison, some obnoxious dude was hanging out near the booth loudly proclaiming “Wow, is that the best AI you could come up with? Those bots are terrible!”

Our lead asks what Marketing wants us to do about it. Our Marketing liaison utters the magic words through the speakerphone.

“It’s an hour until we pack it up, Let ‘em off the leash.”

The ground shook. The heavens split. The world exploded.

 

[LostAlone]

This is all garbage conspiracy theory type nonsense. It was a press/media event, and in no other game release do the developers have the ability to rigidly control who can attend these sort of events to exclude people who are not "correct", as not having played enough hours of the previous version of the game.

This was the case with gaming websites and magazines. The organisation was invited and they chose who to send. And there was no guarantee not only that people who attended HOI3 events had played HOI2, but they were even interested in grand strategy games, or WW2 era games.

Nevertheless, there were over 20 people at the event, and it is plainly wrong that none of them ever played HOI before. I watched a video the other day from someone who had played both HOI3 and HOI2.

The other issue here is your ridiculous expectations of what should be in the videos at this stage. Of course it would be interesting to see someone with good knowledge of the game do an in depth analysis of the features. But we just reached Alpha, and there is no point in getting too into details that might change before release.

The purpose of the event is not for fanboys to understand the game, but simply to promote the fact that the game is coming in about six months, and should be playable, interesting and fun. And to relate the game to a wider audience it is inevitable that comparisons with other games are made. Someone might compare it to War in the East, or the campaign parts of TW, or a whole host of games they have played before and are known to their audience, but surprise, surprise the most comparable games understood by a very wide audience these days are EU4 and CK2. Because they have the same engine, and producer.

In the limited space in an online article, magazine or a ten minute segment in a YouTube stream then broad impressions only are going to be portrayed. For those of us who want to know very detailed game mechanics, then it is disappointing that not one of them mentioned logistics, and there is still no clue on how that works. We know that there was an attempt to carry out an amphibious invasion by Brazil in one game, and it seemed to fail (with huge attrition of the Brazil army) before the army even boarded any ships because of logistics problems. The player mentioned sending the army overland through jungle without any supplies. I would have loved to see that. And we know in one game Canada successfully invaded Brazil, but we didn't get to see how it was done. We know Johan played as the USA and built a huge strat bomber force, we didn't get to see it, nor really anything beyond what we have seen already in the DD on the air war. And we've seen or heard absolutely nothing about the naval war.

But I am an adult, not a child who feels entitled to have everything I demand now, as many of the people on this forum. And I know these details will come, in DDs and in more detailed reviews on YT. When they are ready.

There is no way that Paradox are going to hand out a beta key to some HOI fanboy, and say there you go, son, spend as much time as you want recording our game and publishing it all on YouTube. The keys that were issued to those who attended the event were removed shortly afterwards, one guy tried to go into Steam during the video to show how many hours he had played, but found it had gone. And understandably - they are not beta testers. They weren't there to test the game, they were there to promote the game to as wide an audience as possible through their channels, sites and magazines.

Some of the people mentioned above, or people with similar skills/experience of the HOI series, will undoubtedly get beta keys, as part of the closed beta testing. But they will be under an NDA and won't be able to publish stuff on YouTube until Paradox agree. That might be only in the last couple of weeks before release.

This is pretty much exactly true.

At this point in development it'd be directly harmful to see content made by hardcore fanboys. This is an un-finished, un-balanced, un-polished game that potentially lacks major mechanics and those that are in place are subject to change. And with all of that in mind - what could someone who wants to look at the game in gritty mechanical terms really tell you?

Maybe they might understand the present point in development and just tell their fans 'whelp I can't really say anything because this doesn't really work yet'. Or they might not. And they might spend hours yelling about everything that's different and everything that isn't perfect. Neither of those are things that are helpful and certainly they aren't something that PDS wants to see.

For the record - They invited the people they did basically to try and prove that HoI4 is a game that non-fans can pick up and play and that the game is fun. These are the biggest stone that PDS needs to push up the hill if they expect to see HoI4 get the same kind of sales as EU4 and CK2. HoI really does have a reputation (earned or not) for being complex, hard to get into and not really fun. Even PDS fans who only arrived with EU4 and CK2 tend to stay away. So PDS are doing what they need to to ensure that people see this is different. They absolutely do not need the old guard starting to push back screaming about how things are different and therefor terrible. We already get enough of that here without videos highlighting exactly what y'all seem to hate about it.

The way that the world is, criticism especially strong criticism gets a much bigger audience than positive coverage. That's just the way it works. If you're a youtuber who wanted attention, the best thing you can do is rip on a really popular, really highly reviewed or highly anticipated game. And that is not what PDS wants and it shouldn't be what you want either. All it'd do is give disproportionate prominence to certain voices in the community, adding even more weight to that part who just wants to see a remade HoI3 with no changes.

 

[uberjedi]

Who is Marco Antonio?

 

[potski]

@Porkman I liked the stuff about the testers playing the press.

But to be fair, this isn't FIFA or CoD where an experienced player opponent just leaves you feeling stupid, and the game looks impossible to master. I'm not sure that marco antonio playing as Sweden could embarrass a German/Soviet faction played by newbs.

But there were experienced people playing at the event, and were helping to guide the newbs. Probably they did guide them away from the bugs and unfinished bits. Maybe they told them all, hey, naval is not complete yet, just play with your ground forces, as well as explaining features which were not obvious without a tutorial.

A more experienced player than Quill18 might have assigned some air wings to the North Balkans when his offensive into Rumania started in early November, and done better. But it hardly matters - Quill wasn't playing to show off his skills, or even win. But to showcase the game. So personally I think it hardly matters that he didn't assign any air wings until early January.

Except, we can learn something from this. Is there anything in the game which warned him? Or did he start to get bogged down in Jan and a friendly dev suggested he might use some air wings?

Personally, I'll admit I don't mind the "advisors" in some games. And in this case - where was the freaking Soviet Air Minister?

"Sir, we have a number of air wings within range of the North Balkans which are sitting in their bases doing nothing. The pilots are getting bored playing cards. Can we give the order to send them to attack Romania?"

Or was he too scared of a visit from the NKVD if he suggested that Stalin might have made a mistake

It's this sort of thing which makes all the difference between creating games that are undecipherable, and those newbs can learn.

There is also another element that Paradox might learn from Quill, either watching him at the event or following the video. You can learn an awful lot from watching people who are (with respect) fairly clueless using your UI. And three times Quill tried to assign fighter air wings to the North Balkans region, but couldn't because they were out of range.

In the UI out of range units are listed, but with a fairly dull red hatching in the background of the plane picture. Either out of range wings shouldn't be listed at all, or it should be very much more obvious they are out of range.

And when he dropped them into the Northern Balkans region, I'm not sure it was clear to him that nothing had happened. Very briefly the tooltip for the wing showed in red "Not enough coverage". What does that mean to a new player? If they don't already know that wings have the concept of coverage of an area, and so their coverage of North Balkans was zero? Just say, "This wing is too far away to be used in missions in the North Balkans region. If you wish to use it, then move it to an air base which is closer to the region."

Though, frankly, with a heavy emphasis on using the AI to reduce micro, I would have expected the AI to understand that if I had a bomber wing in Minsk that I dragged and dropped on North Balkans that it should move the wing to a closer airbase, give it some time to recover org then start the bombing missions. Why should I have to give two orders? There are plenty of empty airbases within range of North Balkans. Even one he captured in Moldavia!

"Sir, our ground forces have captured a province with an air base. It would be a good idea to move some air wings there to be close to the front."

We've all been in this situation before I guess. Ordering an air wing to rebase, then a few weeks later notice that it is not doing anything because we forgot to give it a mission after it arrived. There should be a single order.

This stuff should stop. Quill tried to do something that looked perfectly reasonable, and the game didn't do it, didn't tell him clearly that it wasn't going to do it, or tell him what he should do instead. A good tutorial is only part of the story, and so far there is not even that. This needs to be developed to ensure newbs can understand and use all of the features. Heck, even many experienced HOI3 players never used air, because it was too much micro with no clear benefit.

 

[Porkman]

@Porkman I liked the stuff about the testers playing the press.

But to be fair, this isn't FIFA or CoD where an experienced player opponent just leaves you feeling stupid, and the game looks impossible to master. I'm not sure that marco antonio playing as Sweden could embarrass a German/Soviet faction played by newbs.

But there were experienced people playing at the event, and were helping to guide the newbs. Probably they did guide them away from the bugs and unfinished bits. Maybe they told them all, hey, naval is not complete yet, just play with your ground forces, as well as explaining features which were not obvious without a tutorial.

A more experienced player than Quill18 might have assigned some air wings to the North Balkans when his offensive into Rumania started in early November, and done better. But it hardly matters - Quill wasn't playing to show off his skills, or even win. But to showcase the game. So personally I think it hardly matters that he didn't assign any air wings until early January.

Except, we can learn something from this. Is there anything in the game which warned him? Or did he start to get bogged down in Jan and a friendly dev suggested he might use some air wings?

Personally, I'll admit I don't mind the "advisors" in some games. And in this case - where was the freaking Soviet Air Minister?

"Sir, we have a number of air wings within range of the North Balkans which are sitting in their bases doing nothing. The pilots are getting bored playing cards. Can we give the order to send them to attack Romania?"

Or was he too scared of a visit from the NKVD if he suggested that Stalin might have made a mistake

It's this sort of thing which makes all the difference between creating games that are undecipherable, and those newbs can learn.

There is also another element that Paradox might learn from Quill, either watching him at the event or following the video. You can learn an awful lot from watching people who are (with respect) fairly clueless using your UI. And three times Quill tried to assign fighter air wings to the North Balkans region, but couldn't because they were out of range.

In the UI out of range units are listed, but with a fairly dull red hatching in the background of the plane picture. Either out of range wings shouldn't be listed at all, or it should be very much more obvious they are out of range.

And when he dropped them into the Northern Balkans region, I'm not sure it was clear to him that nothing had happened. Very briefly the tooltip for the wing showed in red "Not enough coverage". What does that mean to a new player? If they don't already know that wings have the concept of coverage of an area, and so their coverage of North Balkans was zero? Just say, "This wing is too far away to be used in missions in the North Balkans region. If you wish to use it, then move it to an air base which is closer to the region."

Though, frankly, with a heavy emphasis on using the AI to reduce micro, I would have expected the AI to understand that if I had a bomber wing in Minsk that I dragged and dropped on North Balkans that it should move the wing to a closer airbase, give it some time to recover org then start the bombing missions. Why should I have to give two orders? There are plenty of empty airbases within range of North Balkans. Even one he captured in Moldavia!

"Sir, our ground forces have captured a province with an air base. It would be a good idea to move some air wings there to be close to the front."

We've all been in this situation before I guess. Ordering an air wing to rebase, then a few weeks later notice that it is not doing anything because we forgot to give it a mission after it arrived. There should be a single order.

This stuff should stop. Quill tried to do something that looked perfectly reasonable, and the game didn't do it, didn't tell him clearly that it wasn't going to do it, or tell him what he should do instead. A good tutorial is only part of the story, and so far there is not even that. This needs to be developed to ensure newbs can understand and use all of the features. Heck, even many experienced HOI3 players never used air, because it was too much micro with no clear benefit.

I said in a thread a while back that the demo for HOI4 should be the very detailed set of tutorial scenarios that they SHOULD be making for the base game anyway...

Never had any of one my posts downvoted by so many people I respect. Let's talk about a Demo.

 

[Hans_Schnitzel]

We certainly are going to need a good tutorial this time.

 

[Porkman]

We certainly are going to need a good tutorial this time.

It shouldn't be one tutorial... it should be several, each primarily focused on a certain aspect of the game with limited playability beyond that aspect. The attack on Pearl Harbor would make a great tutorial scenario for how to group task forces, sail them across the Pacific and then order a carrier strike. (Or the attack on Taranto since marketing might want Pearl Harbor to be something that's paid for.) The player would have their hands held as the game told them how to select ships, how to group them, how to put planes on them, how to order them to their objectives, how to launch an attack... etc.

 

[Art1985]

It shouldn't be one tutorial... it should be several, each primarily focused on a certain aspect of the game with limited playability beyond that aspect. The attack on Pearl Harbor would make a great tutorial scenario for how to group task forces, sail them across the Pacific and then order a carrier strike. (Or the attack on Taranto since marketing might want Pearl Harbor to be something that's paid for.) The player would have their hands held as the game told them how to select ships, how to group them, how to put planes on them, how to order them to their objectives, how to launch an attack... etc.

More in game hints, maybe library with most important stuff with pictures or even some videos with guidance (especially about battle plans and what can be achieved in them).

 

[bruebottom]

I too would like to hear what people who really know HoI would say about HOI IV, even more I would like to try HOI IV.

I would agree with you on this, but I do not know what I would be agreeing too - you doing a pre-release testing of HOI IV or me doing the pre-release testing!

 

[WSnova]

Just have to love that saying : "Hey paradox, would be cool to invite people who played, know and create HOI content too(key word) so that we can hear the impressions"

Is somehow so offensive and conspirational that people actually are against it. We all know this was a marketing event, what I want is for them to market to fans of HOI3 (and HOI2 and HOI1) fans too. If it was about just inviting the youtubers with the highest fanbase they should have just invited pewdiepie and hey he is from Sweden no?

Also, inviting fans harmful? How is it harmful, I am sure HOI fans at least can muster enough brainpower to actually understand that the game is in alpha. Its a win win if they invite experienced HOI players, and popular EU4 streamers, hell invite the queen of England if you guys want, don´t know why some people feel so strongly about it.

And everybody knows this was a marketing event, don´t know why need to state the obvious. But oh well whatever.

 

[Demonsul]

Just have to love that saying : "Hey paradox, would be cool to invite people who played, know and create HOI content too(key word) so that we can hear the impressions"

Is somehow so offensive and conspirational that people actually are against it. We all know this was a marketing event, what I want is for them to market to fans of HOI3 (and HOI2 and HOI1) fans too. If it was about just inviting the youtubers with the highest fanbase they should have just invited pewdiepie and hey he is from Sweden no?

Also, inviting fans harmful? How is it harmful, I am sure HOI fans at least can muster enough brainpower to actually understand that the game is in alpha. Its a win win if they invite experienced HOI players, and popular EU4 streamers, hell invite the queen of England if you guys want, don´t know why some people feel so strongly about it.

And everybody knows this was a marketing event, don´t know why need to state the obvious. But oh well whatever.

Inviting players to the meeting is not being opposed for being conspiratorial, in fact I would bet that if that were the sole question you wouldn't have any argument. The dispute is that people disagree with the suggestion (not found in the OP, but in later posts) that Paradox is deliberately keeping the game out of the hands of experienced players in order to actively mislead the fanbase.

 

[Gamer_1745]

that Paradox is deliberately keeping the game out of the hands of experienced players in order to actively mislead the fanbase.

I don't think it was deliberate to keep HoI players away from the Youtube event. I do think that the limited number of people they could fit in to the event they had a higher priority for people who play other games like EU IV & CK2. We are already HoI players and are going to give HOI IV a close look, players of other Strategy games might not. There are Youtubers who play HoI games and they could easily give them Steam access (no need to fly them to some special event) to do a review and they are not. To me this means they do feel ready for this yet for what ever reason (maybe just timing for release).

 

[Zoob]

Just have to love that saying : "Hey paradox, would be cool to invite people who played, know and create HOI content too(key word) so that we can hear the impressions"

Is somehow so offensive and conspirational that people actually are against it. We all know this was a marketing event, what I want is for them to market to fans of HOI3 (and HOI2 and HOI1) fans too. If it was about just inviting the youtubers with the highest fanbase they should have just invited pewdiepie and hey he is from Sweden no?

Also, inviting fans harmful? How is it harmful, I am sure HOI fans at least can muster enough brainpower to actually understand that the game is in alpha. Its a win win if they invite experienced HOI players, and popular EU4 streamers, hell invite the queen of England if you guys want, don´t know why some people feel so strongly about it.

And everybody knows this was a marketing event, don´t know why need to state the obvious. But oh well whatever.

They don't need to market to HOI3 fans, they're already pretty much guaranteed to buy the thing.

 

[mdw1985]

They don't need to market to HOI3 fans, they're already pretty much guaranteed to buy the thing.

And this isn't cool. This "hey you buy it anyway" thing is not fair concerning the fact, that these people helped pdx to grow as a sucessful company. Sure, new players should be aquired. But a little bit more involvement should do the thing though...

Edit: and inviting new people still keeps the danger of "dumbing down" a game

 

[Hans_Schnitzel]

And this isn't cool. This "hey you buy it anyway" thing is not fair concerning the fact, that these people helped pdx to grow as a sucessful company. Sure, new players should be aquired. But a little bit more involvement should do the thing though...

Edit: and inviting new people still keeps the danger of "dumbing down" a game

Has nothing to do with fairness, but marketing strategy. Why market a game to people who already know about it? People who were interested in HoI in general are very likely to already know about HoI4 and do research on their own.

I bet there's many people who play other Pdx titles who never even heard that HoI4 is a thing. And there's even more people who don't care about grandstrategy.. yet. Those are the people whose attention Pdx has to get to get new customers.

We here on the forum already know about this game. We read the DDs, we look at every video, article, podcast. Heck, if there's new information out about HoI4 the people here are the first to know about it. Any cent spent on marketing the game to us would be a complete waste as we already look for everything ourselves.

Our involvement is done via this forum.

 

[Zoob]

Absolutely, every day that we ask for another DD or scrounge looking for Videos of the recent event, we are basically marketing to ourselves.