I hope the game ships with better AI than we've seen so far
- Thread starter ColonelJarJar
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Nope . They said their goal wasn't to make an unbeatable murder machine.
But you know how hyperbole happens...
I, for one, would like for the AI in the base game to be adequate in itself.
Well, idk. Could be they just never got around to making it use all the tools they have given it, but players saying that it was better in the beta and some of the AI features being turned off by default(as in without changing 0 to 1 in some json file) makes this a logical conclusion.Nope . They said their goal wasn't to make an unbeatable murder machine.
But you know how hyperbole happens...
From what i've seen in streams i'd say its adequate, though better AI = better game, so i will most likely use these AI mods mentioned in this thread.
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I would like an ai based on its skill level green recruits being stupid veterans lethal
Perhaps it will be. For the base game.
The game is under polishing passes.
Bugs happen.
Pathing idiosycracies in individual maps can happen and need reporting.
AI value balancing tweaks can require further tweaks due to unintended consequences. This is the time for that.
The streaming build is old. That's a month of exactly these kinds of fixes.
Some small segment of community members will never be happy with any AI because it will always be too easy for their expectations.
There are a lot of items to consider.
And too many comments regarding it are seemingly less constructive than one could hope, and more about personal feelings.
Sigh.
Maybe, work is performed in a certain order we are not privy to, but Logical inference isnt necessarily accurate inference.
The game is under polishing passes.
Bugs happen.
Pathing idiosycracies in individual maps can happen and need reporting.
AI value balancing tweaks can require further tweaks due to unintended consequences. This is the time for that.
The streaming build is old. That's a month of exactly these kinds of fixes.
Some small segment of community members will never be happy with any AI because it will always be too easy for their expectations.
There are a lot of items to consider.
And too many comments regarding it are seemingly less constructive than one could hope, and more about personal feelings.
Sigh.
That's simply not possible - your definition of what an adequate AI is will be different from other people's definition. IMO, the developers are best served by aiming the difficulty level at their average and/or largest segment of customers/potential customers while leaving open options for harder difficulties due to modding or whatever. I MUCH prefer that over the (unfortunately common) technique of having the normal AI be somewhat easy and having the Hard AI cheat. Granted - some level of cheating is often necessary to balance things out, but too many developers use cheating as a crutch and basically made that the only thing about the AI that the player can modify is how much it cheats. (ex. Hard is often the same as normal except the AI gets more money, a to-hit bonus, more HP, etc, etc).
I have no idea if HBS has tuned the AI appropriately for their average customer; only time will tell. I do think the AI looks on the easy side for my taste based on streams - but I'm not too concerned as I reviewed some of the variables that can be modded and I'm pretty confident I'll be able to tune the game to challenge myself after I learn the ropes. It helps that not only can we modify the weights and status of many different tactical AI behaviors we can ALSO make the game more difficult by modding the economic difficulty of the merc management layer.
Note - I'm certainly not saying that I expect nothing from the devs... and I definitely want them to continue patching/tweaking the AI post release (some of that silly behavior we've seen can probably be cleaned up). It would also be nice to expose some/all of the moddable variables in the UI so they can be changed on the fly more easily. I can think of a lot of games that have a big page of advanced setup options that the player can tweak to personalize their difficulty level (Kerbal, Age of Wonders 3, etc, etc, etc)
We may get that in time. It is more work though.
But the first part is to nail down the base feature. Which I'm certain they are working on.
Base feature is done. This game is gold. There is no mythical super patch comin in two weeks. Maybr in a month or 2. I will be curious to see what moding community pull off
Balancing values is a thing.
It's the same thing modders do... Scroll up for the useful commentary by Amechwarrior. He adjusted existing integers.
If by super patch you mean to superman difficulty, no that is not expected nor required for the base game for all.
The rest is tweaking.
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One thing that I hope we will be able to figure out how to do (and I'm uncertain if this will ever be possible as it will require more than just json editing) is to have different AI for different enemy pilots. One thing that can add a lot of flavor to games is when enemies are (usually randomly) assigned one of several AI profiles. Think reckless vs cautious as a simple example. This can make the game more interesting without actually requiring more AI development (only profiles with different weights). If we could develop reckless, cautious, ranged, melee, skirmish, etc profiles and assign them either randomly or based on mech/vehicle at some point I think that would be awesome. Definitely doesn't look to be easily possible out of the box, but I've seen modders figure out how to do things quite a bit more complicated (it's always amusing when they figure out how to do something the devs told them wasn't possible.. lol)
It is worth noting that one of the features of the file I posted above is the ability to differentiate AI behavior by roles.
Assuming that still works, and further assuming that the roles are settable, it gives a lot of leverage for modders to adjust behavior of specific AI units.
Starsector does that - works pretty well (although leads to frustration since you can't control your whole fleet, only your flagship).
I'm dabbling in this now actually. Kind of waiting to see if the hooks for them are in launch before diving in to them.
I can’t see any reason they would show the roles above the units in game if there were no differences in the AI routines.
Those are skillpoint roles like the players pilots. It lets you judge what they are good at, no so much how they act from what I have seen. The AI personalities isn't shown on the info bars the same way you don't see what role or mood the AI is in unless you check the logs.
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Yeah; 'some small segment' of the community thinks it isn't very good for a Hunch to just walk up to you and brace instead of shooting, or present rear armor on your Cat instead of shooting. Unreasonable expectations, really.
...And is ignoring that it might be a bug as a pretext to push harder difficulty requests
See a bug, report a bug. Bake a pie, eat a pie.