Humanism and Dutch Revolt Disaster

[bestbrian]

Playing as Italy and had inherited the lowlands as part of the BI. I have all the cultures accepted, stability is 3, and I have all the Humanist ideas. Brugge just converted to Protestant due to a CoR, and the disaster began ticking up at 1% a month; I thought full Humanism prevented the uptick from non-state religion? Is this a change, or did I just misremember?

 

[TheMeInTeam]

It should, but I don't recall seeing anything saying that it prevents it.

But yeah, 100% full unity tolerance with promoted cultures KIND OF implies a different world environment than the one that led to the Dutch revolts. You can't have Dutch revolts happen under those conditions and accurately claim it's "historical" any more than Albania event-annexing Ottomans is "historical".

 

[Blizzrd33]

There are three potential triggers for the Dutch revolt (the 3rd bullet below was added in 1.33.2):

At least one of the following is true for the country:

• has any province in the Low Countries region without the state religion and has not completed humanist ideas.
• has any province with a not accepted Dutch, Flemish or Frisian culture.
• is the emperor of the HRE and has less than 2 stability and has not passed the imperial reform “Enact Gemeiner Pfennig”

Full humanist ideas should still prevent the non-state religion trigger. Were you also HRE emperor perhaps? Did you accept all the lowlands cultures?

If I get the Burgundian Inheritance, I just move my capital and set/forget about the Dutch revolt.

 

[bestbrian]

There are three potential triggers for the Dutch revolt (the 3rd bullet below was added in 1.33.2):



Full humanist ideas should still prevent the non-state religion trigger. Were you also HRE emperor perhaps? Did you accept all the lowlands cultures?

If I get the Burgundian Inheritance, I just move my capital and set/forget about the Dutch revolt.

Negative, I was not the HRE. As for moving my capital, I know about that and it’s something I often do, but I didn’t feel it was necessary this time since I had all the cultures accepted with Humanist ideas filled (besides, I wanted to stay Italian). Which is the question I have: has the game been changed to where Humanist no longer prevents the non-state religion trigger, or was I mistaken in believing it ever existed in the first place? Considering the popularity of the BI, I would’ve expected a bug report or earlier thread about this, which is one of the reasons why I’m questioning my memory.

 

[Blizzrd33]

I quoted the wiki in my earlier post. Not sure which patch implemented the Dutch revolt, but patch notes for whichever it was might be the place to check?

 

[grotaclas]

I tested the triggers and full humanist ideas do prevent the religious condition. Did you accept dutch culture and flemish culture and frisian culture? Or maybe humanist ideas were not finished

 

[bestbrian]

I tested the triggers and full humanist ideas do prevent the religious condition. Did you accept dutch culture and flemish culture and frisian culture? Or maybe humanist ideas were not finished

They’re all accepted, and Humanist ideas have been completed. There was no progress at all on the disaster until Brugge converted, and then it began ticking up at 1% a month due to non-state religion. I’ll check it again when I get home later this morning to see if I missed anything.

 

[necro84]

In disaster file conditions are

can_start = {
OR = {
AND = {
low_countries_region = {
owned_by = ROOT
NOT = { province_religion = ROOT }
}
NOT = { full_idea_group = humanist_ideas }
}
custom_trigger_tooltip = {
tooltip = dutch_revolt_disaster_tt
OR = {
AND = {
any_owned_province = {
culture = dutch
}
NOT = { accepted_culture = dutch }
}
AND = {
any_owned_province = {
culture = flemish
}
NOT = { accepted_culture = flemish }
}
AND = {
any_owned_province = {
culture = frisian
}
NOT = { accepted_culture = frisian }
}
}
}


progress = {
# progress happens as a result of tensions that actually exist in your country
modifier = {
factor = 1
any_owned_province = {
region = low_countries_region
NOT = { province_religion = ROOT }
}
NOT = {
num_of_owned_provinces_with = {
value = 3
region = low_countries_region
NOT = { province_religion = ROOT }
}
}
}


It seems the Dutch Revolt started earlier but it coudln't get any progress. Once the province converted progress began to tick. You didn't have all the cultures accepted when you inherited Burgundy so revolt could start even you didn't get any progress before provinces were catholic.

Now you need to meet the conditions for ending, the easiest is releasing the vassal to reduce number of owned provinces. You can itegrate that vassal later and disaster wouldn't start again

can_end = {
OR = {
exists = NED
AND = {
custom_trigger_tooltip = {
tooltip = had_disaster_for_x_years_dutch
had_global_flag = {
flag = dutch_revolt
days = 7300 # 20 years
}
}
NOT = { num_of_rebel_armies = 1 }
NOT = { num_of_rebel_controlled_provinces = 1 }
stability = 1
}
NOT = {
num_of_owned_provinces_with = {
value = 5
region = low_countries_region
OR = {
culture = dutch
culture = flemish
culture = frisian
}
}
}
}
}

 

[bestbrian]

In disaster file conditions are

can_start = {
OR = {
AND = {
low_countries_region = {
owned_by = ROOT
NOT = { province_religion = ROOT }
}
NOT = { full_idea_group = humanist_ideas }
}
custom_trigger_tooltip = {
tooltip = dutch_revolt_disaster_tt
OR = {
AND = {
any_owned_province = {
culture = dutch
}
NOT = { accepted_culture = dutch }
}
AND = {
any_owned_province = {
culture = flemish
}
NOT = { accepted_culture = flemish }
}
AND = {
any_owned_province = {
culture = frisian
}
NOT = { accepted_culture = frisian }
}
}
}


progress = {
# progress happens as a result of tensions that actually exist in your country
modifier = {
factor = 1
any_owned_province = {
region = low_countries_region
NOT = { province_religion = ROOT }
}
NOT = {
num_of_owned_provinces_with = {
value = 3
region = low_countries_region
NOT = { province_religion = ROOT }
}
}
}


It seems the Dutch Revolt started earlier but it coudln't get any progress. Once the province converted progress began to tick. You didn't have all the cultures accepted when you inherited Burgundy so revolt could start even you didn't get any progress before provinces were catholic.

Now you need to meet the conditions for ending, the easiest is releasing the vassal to reduce number of owned provinces. You can itegrate that vassal later and disaster wouldn't start again

can_end = {
OR = {
exists = NED
AND = {
custom_trigger_tooltip = {
tooltip = had_disaster_for_x_years_dutch
had_global_flag = {
flag = dutch_revolt
days = 7300 # 20 years
}
}
NOT = { num_of_rebel_armies = 1 }
NOT = { num_of_rebel_controlled_provinces = 1 }
stability = 1
}
NOT = {
num_of_owned_provinces_with = {
value = 5
region = low_countries_region
OR = {
culture = dutch
culture = flemish
culture = frisian
}
}
}
}
}

That makes sense, as I was sitting at 6% revolt progress that I’d incurred prior to accepting cultures. So the trick is to accept ASAP before there’s a monthly tick. TYVM. Looks like another groovy mystery solved. How bad are the Dutch revolts? I’ve always jus moved my capital. Maybe I just smite revolts for twenty years, instead?

 

[subzero12479]

That makes sense, as I was sitting at 6% revolt progress that I’d incurred prior to accepting cultures. So the trick is to accept ASAP before there’s a monthly tick. TYVM. Looks like another groovy mystery solved. How bad are the Dutch revolts? I’ve always jus moved my capital. Maybe I just smite revolts for twenty years, instead?

its not too bad iirc. you get a lot of rebels (every province in the netherlands will revolt once) and suffer +50% stab cost for a couple of years. just make sure that you have never 5 or more provinces with dutch, frisian or flemish culture at 90%+ autonomy and/or controlled by rebels or the netherlands will spawn as an independent nation, immediately taking all of the low lands from you.

 

[necro84]

When I don't want to move the capital I prefer to start the disaster with 5 provinces and wait for 20 years. From 5 provinces there aren't many rebels. After that time you can forget about this.
Of course it is possible to move the capital so starting the disaster is for the time when capital needs to be in another place.
With Burgundian inheritance it's easy to promote all 3 cultures, otherwise it's hard because conquering a province with other culture will start the disaster and it's impossible to promote culture before making a state so the province needs to be cored.