How to use personal unions as a tactic

[Dragula]

How do I actually use personal unions as a tactic? How do I maximise my chanes? Who do I target? How do I keep them? I always end up using force to expand, and I cannot play any other way. And I would love to learn.
So please give your best tips.

 

[Incompetent]

http://www.eu4wiki.com/Personal_union

There's also a more detailed guide by atwix:

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...al-marriages-personal-unions-and-claim-throne

 

[elglanto]

I used the second link in a game in the previous version (1.7) and it worked very well. However, I don't know if everything still applies in 1.8. I don't think things have been changed regarding how to get a PU but I am not 100% sure.

 

[OldmansHQ]

THIS IS THE QUESTION! THE question I've been asking the stars.

http://www.eu4wiki.com/Personal_union

There's also a more detailed guide by atwix:

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...al-marriages-personal-unions-and-claim-throne

I have read both of those, the second one seems especially useful, as it has an abundance of information. Shame I still don't get it . I'd very much appreciate if someone revealed their tricks.

 

[Gaamel]

-Have as many royal marriages as possible (it increases the % to have a PU or a shared dynasty). Don't marry nations you're going to attack though, it costs -1 stab
-Maintain 90+ prestige all the time, this means you'll most likely be on top of the list of foreign "suitors" in case of succession crisis abroad. Attack small nations and destroy the 1k armies when they spawn for free prestige
-Rival big nations (France, Spain, Austria...) means you might be called in your rivals' succession wars, sometimes with the chance to force a PU for yourself (even though you share no dynasty and no RM with the junior partner...)
-Choose the best moment to RM your target countries : an old king with no heir is an ideal situation.
-In the diplomacy screen, hover your mouse on your ruler's name, you can see the other rulers of your dynasty. If one of them has no heir or an heir with a weak claim, you can RM the country and take the action "claim throne" which gives you a casus belli on them to form a PU.

 

[FrosT37]

THIS IS THE QUESTION! THE question I've been asking the stars.


I have read both of those, the second one seems especially useful, as it has an abundance of information. Shame I still don't get it . I'd very much appreciate if someone revealed their tricks.

Look at the disputed succession notifier each year and see if there is any interesting nation with no heir and a 40+ years old ruler. If there is, insure that you have very high prestige (100 should be your target) and ask for a RM.

By doing this, there are basically four possible outcomes:
1) The target nation gets an heir. If that's the case, nothing happens.
2) A noble from your house gets on the throne of the target nation.
3) A succession war for the target nation occurs between you and you strongest rival. If you win, you keep the PU.
4) You get the PU without succession war.

If the outcome 2 happened, you can claim the throne of target nation and use the claim throne CB if any of these condition is true:
A) Target nation is under a regency council.
B) Target nation has no heir.
C) Target nation has a heir with a weak claim.

Another riskier strategy is trying to get another house on your own throne. When you set your heir as a general he has an increased chance of dying. Thus, it's possible to RM only your target nation to insure that their dynasty gets on your throne when your heir dies. This strategy is riskier because it may lead to very long regencies or you may end up under a PU if you're a not powerful enough, but if a house is particularly strong in Europe, it may be easier to get this house on your throne too.

 

[Gaamel]

Another riskier strategy is trying to get another house on your own throne. When you set your heir as a general he has an increased chance of dying. Thus, it's possible to RM only your target nation to insure that their dynasty gets on your throne when your heir dies. This strategy is riskier because it may lead to very long regencies or you may end up under a PU if you're a not powerful enough, but if a house is particularly strong in Europe, it may be easier to get this house on your throne too.

This strategy is especially powerful in the case of dynasties spanning several countries (habsburgs...) If you manage to enter the "club", your military might will grant you PUs or "claim throne" casus belli.

Don't forget that some countries have scripted events or missions to get more PUs (Castille with the Iberic Union, Austria with the PU over Bohemia/Hungary).

 

[OldmansHQ]

Most if it I knew, thanks though. The author of the long article about PUs, got PUs with five (if I remember correctly) of the greatest European nations - I want to know how to do that kind of thing!

 

[MadDjinn]

Another thought line is to target your rivals allies with royal marriages. Flipping them to your dynasty allows your dynasty to have a chance at your rivals throne. Spreading the dynasty around, and using the Diplo ideas to break RMs after they switch and have an heir of your dynasty, can provide for a lot more points of pressure to get your dynasty onto multiple thrones faster.

 

[atwix]

http://www.eu4wiki.com/Personal_union

There's also a more detailed guide by atwix:

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum...al-marriages-personal-unions-and-claim-throne

for the record, i wrote both of those

And apart from some minor changes, the guide is still good for 1.8.

It seems Pu are bit harder to get now, since heirs *Always* get an heir of their own when they become king. Still, popups to watch "heir dead" events in interesting countries is still the way to scope for PU chances.

Popups are everything for PU game, my best tip. Its in the guide at the start somewhere.

 

[atwix]

-Rival big nations (France, Spain, Austria...) means you might be called in your rivals' succession wars, sometimes with the chance to force a PU for yourself (even though you share no dynasty and no RM with the junior partner...)

please prove that with some screenshots, I bet this can't be done.

 

[atwix]

Most if it I knew, thanks though. The author of the long article about PUs, got PUs with five (if I remember correctly) of the greatest European nations - I want to know how to do that kind of thing!

You mean this screenshot?




Basically, set a powerful country as rival, and a succession war can erupt (you get heirless country as minor PU partner at start of war then) with having JUST a royal marriage. France is good, or Muscovy (if they don't get trashed at start and take expansion ideas)The succession war basically happened due to "heir dead" events when king was 60+. Thats why popups for events for interesting countries are so important.

Getting Habsburg dynasty is indeed also a good but risky strategy.

 

[Dragula]

Thanks for all the input, I will give this a try!

 

[tgungamer]

Another riskier strategy is trying to get another house on your own throne. When you set your heir as a general he has an increased chance of dying. Thus, it's possible to RM only your target nation to insure that their dynasty gets on your throne when your heir dies. This strategy is riskier because it may lead to very long regencies or you may end up under a PU if you're a not powerful enough, but if a house is particularly strong in Europe, it may be easier to get this house on your throne too.

When you are doing this, it is a good idea to stay at war. When you are at war you cannot fall into a PU under someone so when your king dies you will get their dynasty instead.

 

[OldmansHQ]

You mean this screenshot?




Basically, set a powerful country as rival, and a succession war can erupt (you get heirless country as minor PU partner at start of war then) with having JUST a royal marriage. France is good, or Muscovy (if they don't get trashed at start and take expansion ideas)The succession war basically happened due to "heir dead" events when king was 60+. Thats why popups for events for interesting countries are so important.

Getting Habsburg dynasty is indeed also a good but risky strategy.

Which popups specifically would you recommend turning on?

 

[Frungy78]

Step 1- be Poland with elective monarchy
Step 2- lose your own election on purpose, get foreigner on throne
Step 3- wait for foreigner to have weak/no heir, and claim their throne
Step 4- get PU, then lose the next election and get another foreigner on throne
Step 5- repeat steps 2 and 3.

 

[OldmansHQ]

Step 1- be Poland with elective monarchy
Step 2- lose your own election on purpose, get foreigner on throne
Step 3- wait for foreigner to have weak/no heir, and claim their throne
Step 4- get PU, then lose the next election and get another foreigner on throne
Step 5- repeat steps 2 and 3.

I don't think it's possible to choose a particular candidate, I think Poland can only support Polish nobles, the rest is in the hands of the AI. Unless I'm wrong? Besides, what if I don't want to play Poland?

 

[atwix]

Which popups specifically would you recommend turning on?

for PU game? Turn on popup and pause when an event happens in the country you set as interesting. Its in the guide somewhere at the beginning, check link in my signature. This will make you see if any "heir dead" events happen to any country.

Also, turn on popup and pause for "new ruler rises to throne" for any country. You can check if a king came to power with no heir then immediately.

 

[Sunspawn]

I don't think it's possible to choose a particular candidate, I think Poland can only support Polish nobles, the rest is in the hands of the AI. Unless I'm wrong? Besides, what if I don't want to play Poland?

Influence the chances of specific dynasties to get elected via alliances and common wars - your opinion of them is what matters for their chance to gain election points.

 

[Gaamel]

please prove that with some screenshots, I bet this can't be done.

I thought you said something similar in your PU guide though :sad:

I was playing as Scandinavia in the 1600s, with a RM with France (Valois), Austria (Habsburg) and Lithuania (Jagiellon). I was alone in my dynasty, Paus (Norwegian). My rivals were England, Portugal and Sweden.
http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/545261868589260466/ADA221D9C640603331721F7E8F41DAA7F9657E4C/

Suddenly in the 1630s, Castile got PU'd by Portugal, I received a popup and chose to contest the succession. With 60% warscore I managed to steal the PU from Portugal.
http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/545261868589188334/AAB3989000A2CFC9CB5BE77DF1DF9E156038A727/
http://cloud-4.steampowered.com/ugc/545261868589230018/988AF8D5ADCC459DA9BCBE38A2C9D242DE05EC7C/

edit : in case you wonder, I had no RM with Castile, which had rivaled me