How the Heck Do You Conquer Japanese Daimyos?

[unmerged(96425)]

I'm playing Divine Wind, latest beta patch.

Its the early 17th century, and the Austrian Empire has decided that the newly-discovered islands of Japan will be the jewel in the Imperial Crown.

I've conquered most of the daimyos' provinces, and Kyoto itself.

However, I can't negotiate with the individual daimyos, and I don't get the "cede province" option when negotiating with Japan itself, so how the heck do I take any provinces?

Any advice please!

 

[Valiant_Hogers]

That is the problem with japan, They act like united but you can only demand cede provinces when they are united as JAPAN

 

[Noctus]

Iirc its broken atm.

 

[The_Pursuader]

That is the problem with japan, They act like united but you can only demand cede provinces when they are united as JAPAN

Wasn't this fixed in one of the latest beta patches? Not sure though..
If it's been fixed, you should be able to DOW Japan (=Kyoto) and then demand the provinces (or whatever) you want. It's as if Japan is the alliance leader and the daimyos are its subjects thus unable to make a seperate peace treaty..
As daimyos are unable to do diplomacy with any foreign nations the only way to make peace (and declare war) is through the emperor seated in Kyoto who speaks in its name.

Right?

 

[unmerged(96425)]

Well sadly this seems to be well and truly broken as you cannot conquer any Japanese provinces until as and when (if ever) Japan is unified.

I really hope this is not WAD and it will be fixed in the next official patch. Totally ludicrous and unrealistic.

 

[unmerged(277230)]

Well sadly this seems to be well and truly broken as you cannot conquer any Japanese provinces until as and when (if ever) Japan is unified.

I really hope this is not WAD and it will be fixed in the next official patch. Totally ludicrous and unrealistic.

Did you try the above post? I'm sure that works, for the AI atleast. Once you take Kyoto (and possibly other provinces the Emperor owns) you should be able to demand any daiymos provinces.

 

[corporateslave]

Did you try the above post? I'm sure that works, for the AI atleast. Once you take Kyoto (and possibly other provinces the Emperor owns) you should be able to demand any daiymos provinces.

There are still some issues conquering daimyos using the latest DW beta patch.

Was testing this out last night, and after declaring war on Japan I could demand non-capitol provinces from the daimyos when making peace with Japan, but I was not able to ask for the daimyo's capitol provinces, even after they were reduced to an OPM. There was one exception to this, though - if the daimyo was a vassal to another daimyo, I was able to annex their capitol province in a peace deal.

To work around the problem, I had to edit the save files to make the OPM daimyos vassals of the one daimyo I hadn't reduced down in size yet. Once I did this, I grabbed their capitols in the next war, leaving just the emperor and one remaining daimyo. Unification followed shortly after.

A few other oddities I noticed:

* Your displayed warscore only increases when you occupy the emperor's territory; that said...
* Displayed warscore doesn't guarantee you'll get what you want in a peace deal. I noticed that peace deals sometimes failed without any notification. This seemed to happen when I had a high warscore against the emperor but hadn't occupied all of the provinces of the daimyo I was trying to take territory from. This leads me to believe that the warscore against the daimyo is also considered during a peace deal, even though it is not displayed.

 

[Soranya]

Well
Has this ever been fixed? It ruins my game right now somehow (Conquer whole world) as the single one Daimo left has decided not to remov but rather to vassalize its other Daimo comrades.
So They're sitting ther eon this island since baout 100 years doing nothing.
And when trying to cede any provinces from the Warleader (Ming...) they'll cost me 4 instead of 2 Infamy as my war against ming is "with out a casu belli" as they came to defend there ally japan...

 

[Kurblius]

Well
Has this ever been fixed? It ruins my game right now somehow (Conquer whole world) as the single one Daimo left has decided not to remov but rather to vassalize its other Daimo comrades.
So They're sitting ther eon this island since baout 100 years doing nothing.
And when trying to cede any provinces from the Warleader (Ming...) they'll cost me 4 instead of 2 Infamy as my war against ming is "with out a casu belli" as they came to defend there ally japan...

Yeah, the only way to take provinces from Japan without full 4 bb is to ensure that no one joins your war with Japan as it's ally. This usually means you have to declare war on Ming first (or whoever is guaranteeing/allying with Japan), and then before you sign the peace deal with Ming, declare war on Japan.

Some people have reported success in owning all the provinces surrounding the capital (Kyoto) and then disabling the Daimyo system by occupying all the daimyo capitals and kyoto, but I tried this myself and it didn't work . I just got spammed with "Daimyo disbanded" messages without any effect. Others have tried the exploiting the system with rebels, but that way has been unreliable as well.

If you have all the other daimyos as vassals, you can take vassal capitals from them in peace deals. If you reduce the number of daimyos to two, the daimyo disband event will occur normally.

 

[Emperor Hans]

You could tagswitch and let one daimyo inherit all the others, I do this in the beginning sometimes because they'll never unite otherwise.
A good event for the AI to auto unite after a certain date with higher chances under circumstances ( ex: Shogun influence lowers mtth ) and higher chances the later it is would be good.

 

[unmerged(70580)]

I'm in the middle of trying the surround Kyoto trick, 5 years truce then one war to see if it works. One thing that seems to help, at least in making sure Japan stands alone, is first kicking its allies/gurantors & making them end alliances with Japan, then sticking it in your own SOI.

If you're doing a WC attenpt, by the time you reach Japan your army will probably be so big niether Ming, Manchu or Korea will dare guarantee it again.

 

[unmerged(431840)]

Paradox seems to be pretty decent about software development but they seem to have fallen into a complexity trap. This kind of problem cannot really be solved by trying to solve it. Fixing a few "bugs" here and there won't matter, when the system is inherently flawed. Each bug fix has a high chance of creating another bug. They need to step back and reassess Japan. The Daimyo system is not ever going to be fixed. They need to eliminate it entirely. They could simply make Japan unified, or turn them into totally independent Daimyos, or maybe make a second HRE. The current system is unfixable.

 

[Kurblius]

Paradox seems to be pretty decent about software development but they seem to have fallen into a complexity trap. This kind of problem cannot really be solved by trying to solve it. Fixing a few "bugs" here and there won't matter, when the system is inherently flawed. Each bug fix has a high chance of creating another bug. They need to step back and reassess Japan. The Daimyo system is not ever going to be fixed. They need to eliminate it entirely. They could simply make Japan unified, or turn them into totally independent Daimyos, or maybe make a second HRE. The current system is unfixable.

^This. Of the 4 new features I believe that are unique to Divine Wind - Hordes, Japan Daimyo, Chinese factions, and the "enhanced" HRE, I think the HRE is the most successful. Whether you're trying to form it, or trying to destroy it, it's a lot of fun. A similar system with Japan would be welcomed.

 

[Kurblius]

I'm in the middle of trying the surround Kyoto trick, 5 years truce then one war to see if it works. One thing that seems to help, at least in making sure Japan stands alone, is first kicking its allies/gurantors & making them end alliances with Japan, then sticking it in your own SOI.

If you're doing a WC attenpt, by the time you reach Japan your army will probably be so big niether Ming, Manchu or Korea will dare guarantee it again.

Whether you succeed or not, please post your results - I'd like to know. As would I think many people.

 

[Roguedemon]

As has already been mentioned the daimyo system is highly bugged. In one of my earliest games I was playing as Taira and after conquering fujiwara and minamoto, I couldn't kill off the last daimyo as shogun authority was too high - even though I was the shogun. I think part of the problem with the system is it is restrictive without opening up any new paths to success in the region. With the HRE you can still basically do whatever you want, if you are prepared to take the various penalties for messing with the empire, but with japan the restrictions are just solid walls whether you're inside or outside of it.

 

[Hawkiee]

The way I managed to get it to work was by occupying the whole anoying island then negotiating peace terms with Kyoto(Japan) where I try to take all provinces from the smallest daimyos in order to isolate their capitals, follow up war take their capitals, boom, united Japan.

You simply have to occupy provinces and then negotiate either with Kyoto or the Shogun, that's what I remember.

 

[DDRJake]

For what it's worth, gobbling up Japan as a horde is problem-free and very satisfying. If collapsing into a horde is still an option, it could be used as a last resort.

 

[unmerged(70580)]

Update - I have now finished my third war against Japan, & surrounding Kyoto with my own regions did not work.

In wars 1 & 2 I seized all regions immediately around Kyoto. In war 3 I occupied all 4 Daimyo capitals. Immediately on occupying the fourth, I got the Shogunate has been Disbaned daily spam. After making peace with Japan (& seizing 5 more regions) I find none of the Daimyos can be approached diplomatically, still - the Shogunate system is still very much alive.

Next plan is to wait 5 years, then seize more territtory, reduce the smaller Daimyos to DPMs & try to destroy them using spies.

 

[Kurblius]

Update - I have now finished my third war against Japan, & surrounding Kyoto with my own regions did not work.

In wars 1 & 2 I seized all regions immediately around Kyoto. In war 3 I occupied all 4 Daimyo capitals. Immediately on occupying the fourth, I got the Shogunate has been Disbaned daily spam. After making peace with Japan (& seizing 5 more regions) I find none of the Daimyos can be approached diplomatically, still - the Shogunate system is still very much alive.

Next plan is to wait 5 years, then seize more territtory, reduce the smaller Daimyos to DPMs & try to destroy them using spies.

F*ck.

 

[banahaw]

For some weird reason, a daimyo became holy roman emperor just like WTF!!!