How the bloody hell do you survive as Byzantines

[Kinkness]

Byzantines have always been a rough start due to the religious turmoil, and very pitchfork happy vassals, and epidemics sweeping the nation every other year. With the new expansion it seems 10x worse.

Trying to get a hellenic thing going. I'm only on my first heir, and already everything is in COMPLETE shambles.

I didn't try to expand, I built up internally, gave out kingdoms and created them trying to centralize and control the main titles and my council through the viceroyalties.

My King dies, and... my heir is utterly HATED.. -50 to -90.. Now this probably happened because I immediately moved back into the non heretic religion so I could switch to secretly hellenic, but even then, the same religion vassals in my country HATE my guts.. for literally no reason...

The negative modifiers are a bunch of -10's I can't control, like imperial crap, and craven (Because I'm on my 3rd back to back epidemic), and a bunch of other complete and utter Bull#$##
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Speaking of epidemics.. can we seriously get a fking break with Byzantines and epidemics? NO OTHER NATION ANYWHERE on the map has an epidemic problem like the Byzantines.. Not even the Islamics which control half the freakin south end of the map have as many epidemics combined as the Byzantines do alone.. Hell you could combine the entire Islamic nations + France + Germany + Italy and still you wouldn't equal the same amount of Epidemics Byzantines get alone.. The whole idea of the spread of sicknesses coming from Constantinople area was because it was a major trading hub... WHich is a fking joke because the trade doesn't even FREAKIN REACH IT! THERE IS NO TRADE.. Byzantines get fking nothing as a trade off for their double epidemic rates.

I'm sitting here for literally 20 years tuck in my castle. TWENTY YEARS.. My original Emperor died in the castle, stuck there for 10 years, now my Heir is stuck there for another 10-15 and counting...

I literally watched teh first small pox epidemic fade away only to be replaced by a second small pox epidemic TWO MONTHS after the first, and spread over constantiple and surrounding lands, that one lasted ages (It could of been 3 back to back again and I just missed 1). I then noticed that 2nd (or maybe 3rd due to how insanely long it lasted) start to fade away, only to have yet ANOTHER small pox epidemic following it by 1 territory away.... It was like a bad fking joke..

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So not only do I get a crap ton of negative modifiers due to being stuck hiding in my castle (Because god forbid apparently its unheard of for someone to want to survive an epidemic), my Vassals always get monsterous negatives with me no matter what I do, making my chances of securing the throne past 2 generations practically impossible......

My sinking economy is putting the Titanic to shame every game due to the constant rape by the epidemics, negative modifiers, BS RNG rolls with kids and every other way this game can shank you in the ass repeatedly.. Normally of which I am fine with.. but this is just a joke..

 

[Serenity84]

Epidemics are more common in coastal areas. So Italy and Greece are pretty bad. There is a game rule to turn them down, which makes it manageable. You still get them now and then, but it's not a constant thing

 

[Zoomun]

Are you really going into seclusion for every epidemic? You only need to for the plague and sometimes camp fever. Also Constantinople is the best county in the entire game. It has maxed walls and high levels for other buildings. Along with the best technology in the world.

 

[Kinkness]

Epidemics are more common in coastal areas. So Italy and Greece are pretty bad. There is a game rule to turn them down, which makes it manageable. You still get them now and then, but it's not a constant thing

Yes I know that, but Constantinople has it 2x worse.

 

[Kinkness]

Are you really going into seclusion for every epidemic? You only need to for the plague and sometimes camp fever. Also Constantinople is the best county in the entire game. It has maxed walls and high levels for other buildings. Along with the best technology in the world.

Yes, because if I don't my bad luck always see's them die 9/10 times, especially when you're getting hit by an epidemic every other year. Literally. Eventaully one of those epidemics is going to kill my leader, which I can't afford the risk when a non heir is going to succeed the throne but who is already close to 60 years old and is going to die well before my own heir who will then become top pick.

I never once said Constantinople wasn't the best county in the game, but when the best candy in the world is laced with poison, is it really the best candy?

 

[Rhone]

Build hospitals in and around constantinople...upgrade them if you can. They will help.

 

[jwalche]

I tried Byzantine and couldn't make it. It was a tough test of patience. Only if I could make unjustified imprisoning attempts for -40 opinion and -10 piety like everyone else...

As for Epidemics, if you don't have good hospitals on and around your coastal capital, it may stay forever. My people were eating rats which I didn't mind. But my pregnant lovers were dying out starvation and I was tired to use my armies without commanders. Then I finally decided that enough was enough, and abandoned my well developed capital.

 

[Naughtius Maximus]

The only epidemic you ever need to go into seclusion for is the plague. That really is it.

Stop hiding for the rest. Your physician will keep most of your close members in court alive through any non plague epidemic.

You're basically hiding for way too long and way too often. That -5 diplo is pretty big, not to mention the -10 opinion after you leave.

 

[Woifee]

Get a good phycician and make him like you. This way you don’t have to go into seclusion.

 

[Karlington]

If a character gets sick with an epidemic and recover they then become immune to it*. Live through an episode or two and you don't even have to worry any more, because they can't affect you any more. It is annoying when you've been breeding a bloodline farm or a great heir and illness takes them, though.

 

[jwalche]

Does your physician's opinion has any actual impact? I never thought if any minor title holder's opinion opinion matters.

 

[jwalche]

It is annoying when you've been breeding a bloodline farm or a great heir and illness takes them, though.

Even more upsetting than killing your heir is making him incapable, which epidemics seems to be quite good at it.

 

[Woifee]

Does your physician's opinion has any actual impact? I never thought if any minor title holder's opinion opinion matters.

Yes. If he hates you he will treat you badly. He’ll use his position to get you killed.

 

[jwalche]

Yes. If he hates you he will treat you badly. He’ll use his position to get you killed.

Oh. I thought I was supposed to at least loose a leg from an extreme treatment, and therefore I should only choose a milder one. I read that advise somewhere. Thanks for the information. Next time I get a disease I will get a new physician.

 

[Woifee]

Oh. I thought I was supposed to at least loose a leg from an extreme treatment, and therefore I should only choose a milder one. I read that advise somewhere. Thanks for the information. Next time I get a disease I will get a new physician.

It’s even in the wiki.

https://ck2.paradoxwikis.com/Court_Physician

 

[jwalche]

It’s even in the wiki.

https://ck2.paradoxwikis.com/Court_Physician

Thanks. I should start reading outside of combat and CB sections.

 

[Kurblius]

Trying to get a hellenic thing going. I'm only on my first heir, and already everything is in COMPLETE shambles.

I didn't try to expand, I built up internally, gave out kingdoms and created them trying to centralize and control the main titles and my council through the viceroyalties.

My King dies, and... my heir is utterly HATED.. -50 to -90.. Now this probably happened because I immediately moved back into the non heretic religion so I could switch to secretly hellenic, but even then, the same religion vassals in my country HATE my guts.. for literally no reason...

Some curious decisions you're making there.

Why are you giving out King viceroys? The negative modifiers are horrendous and you don't get the ability to excommunicate them if relations go sour due to autocephaly. Plus they become way to powerful. You should be giving out duchy viceroys only, 2 at a time if need be but never a kingdom title.

I'd suggest waiting it out until you form the roman empire before you convert to hellenic - simply because it gives you a bunch of decisions that allow you to convert all your empire's vassals en-mass without the need of secret religion.

Really, you're first couple generations should be focused just on reproduction and getting a nice big family so that you still have lots of potential dynastic heirs (brothers, cousins, many children, etc) even if they don't inherit the throne. In fact you should be making contingency plans in the event you lose the throne, since in all probability you will due to the succession mechanics. And that's not necessarily a bad thing. It's way easier to play as a duke and building a strong foundation before contesting the throne (which is also way easier now since all you need is good military stats, causing the emperor to appoint you as commander, and you're now a contender, no claim needed). Starting right off the bat as emperor is, by contrast way harder.

 

[Karlington]

Does your physician's opinion has any actual impact? I never thought if any minor title holder's opinion opinion matters.

I saw you received a response (yes, it does) above, but I figured I'd give some more detail. The chance of successful treatment decreases from the base if his opinion of you is below 0, -25, -50, and -75 (stacking). It increases if opinion is above 0, 25, 50, 75 (also stacking).

The modifier is huge, x0.8 for the negatives and x1.2 for the positives. Being a Renowned Physician is a x1.2 modifier as well, so increasing your physician's opinion of you from 49 to 50 improves treatment success as much as him becoming a Renowned Physician.

In short, always make sure your physician likes you, ideally 75+ in opinion.

 

[Byzantium2000]

Some curious decisions you're making there.

Why are you giving out King viceroys? The negative modifiers are horrendous and you don't get the ability to excommunicate them if relations go sour due to autocephaly. Plus they become way to powerful. You should be giving out duchy viceroys only, 2 at a time if need be but never a kingdom title.

I'd suggest waiting it out until you form the roman empire before you convert to hellenic - simply because it gives you a bunch of decisions that allow you to convert all your empire's vassals en-mass without the need of secret religion.

Really, you're first couple generations should be focused just on reproduction and getting a nice big family so that you still have lots of potential dynastic heirs (brothers, cousins, many children, etc) even if they don't inherit the throne. In fact you should be making contingency plans in the event you lose the throne, since in all probability you will due to the succession mechanics. And that's not necessarily a bad thing. It's way easier to play as a duke and building a strong foundation before contesting the throne (which is also way easier now since all you need is good military stats, causing the emperor to appoint you as commander, and you're now a contender, no claim needed). Starting right off the bat as emperor is, by contrast way harder.

Wait why are King Viceroys bad? If anything they make Every Byzantine start too easy. 867 Viceroy of Anatolia bam early game management done. 12 vassals that hate me gone 1 that loves you remains.

 

[Spaninq]

A good way to have your physician like you is to go hermetic society and make him your apprentice, then invite him to stargazing (making sure you know which stargazing option is most likely to please him given his/her traits). The bonus is that when he stops being your apprentice, he gets +2 learning, which can help out with treatments depending on his/her traits. Finally, unlike titles like chancellor, marshal, steward, spymaster, or court chaplain, he will almost never be too busy to treat you or your children (unless you're gathering ingredients together, I suppose).