How on earth do you deal with the dominant powers?

[Pewt]

% modifiers are all added together before multiplying by the base cost so Iwanow is correct there.

However, regardless of modifiers unit recruitment costs never drop below 1 ducat.

My testing does not yield these results.

Case 1: Venice with no galleys, Serf-FS 0 (0% galley cost modifier), Land-Naval 4 (-10% galley cost modifier), Expanded Venetian Arsenal (-40% galley cost modifier), Press Gangs (-50% ship cost modifier), Shipyard (-10% ship cost modifier), for a total of -110% cost modifier, builds galleys at 2.2 ducats, down from a base price of 10.0. If this was truly reduced below 0, they should cost 1 ducat.

Case 2: Same as Case 1 but without Press gangs, for a total of -60% cost modifier, builds galleys at 4.5 ducats, down from a base price of 10.0. If this was truly reduced by 60%, they would cost 4 ducats.

Case 3: France with a Barracks (-20% infantry costs), -5 Aristocracy (-5% infantry costs), -5 Serfdom (-30% infantry costs), Land (-25% infantry costs), Quantity (-12.5% infantry costs), for a total of -87.5% infantry costs, builds infantry at 2.2 ducats, down from a base price of 9.0. If this was truly reduced by 87.5%, they would cost 1.125 ducats.

Case 4: Poland with a Barracks (-20% costs), -5 Aristocracy (-30% costs), -5 Land (-25% costs), Use Polish Hussars (-25% costs), for a total of -100% costs, buys Cavalry at 4.0 ducats apiece, down from a base price of 21.0. If this was truly reduced by 100%, they would cost 1 ducat.

--

All testing done in Divine Wind 5.1 (BJLT).

 

[jdrou]

Okay, so all modifiers of a specific type are added together before multiplying (galley_cost, local_ship_cost, global_ship_cost, cavalry_cost, global_regiment_cost, local_regiment_cost).
So the cheapest you can normally get cav should be 3.99 ducats 21*(1-0.25-0.25-0.25)*(1-0.05)*(1-0.20)
and infantry 2.56 ducats 9*(1-0.30-0.25-0.075)*(1-0.05)*(1-0.20)
(There are some temporary modifiers that can make them cheaper though, potentially getting both costs below 2 ducats.)

EDIT: Actually you could get a bit cheaper on the cav if you took the Polish Hussars decision then formed Scandinavia so you could also take Finnish Cavalry. Not really practical but some people like to see how many nation-forming benefits they can get in a single game.

 

[chgrogers]

One good way I used to defeat France at the 1399 start and can be used to deplete their armies. Let them siege Normandie and Caux when they begin to assault load a ship up with an equal or better sized for force and land then on top of the army. I found I was able to defeat them easily before they are reinforced by a larger force. Until Their manpower has been exhausted and WE has risen I would not chase after the armies but just load them back up and rest waiting for the next assault.

 

[magitsu]

This might be usefull for any country

If you have a habit of getting your stacks slaughtered instead of retreating and reinforcing (=cost 0).
Does it include maintenance cost? That might be good.
But usually MP is an issue for quite some time - you have more than enough money to fill to those puny force/MP limits.

I could consider trying them since those sliders aren't that bad with other bonuses.

 

[brifbates]

I could consider trying them since those sliders aren't that bad with other bonuses.

Except the part where serfdom+aristocracy means you either:

a) go decentralized
b) stay at peace forever
or
c) get time of troubles events, peasant wars, and other less than joyful things

 

[unmerged(80402)]

If you have a habit of getting your stacks slaughtered instead of retreating and reinforcing (=cost 0).
Does it include maintenance cost? That might be good.
But usually MP is an issue for quite some time - you have more than enough money to fill to those puny force/MP limits.

I could consider trying them since those sliders aren't that bad with other bonuses.

Well if your stacks got slaughtered when they are cheap, you can just build new ones easily. If your stacks get slaughtered when they are expensive, you got a little problem...

Except the part where serfdom+aristocracy means you either:

a) go decentralized
b) stay at peace forever
or
c) get time of troubles events, peasant wars, and other less than joyful things

I got peasant wars, and enjoyed XD. Time of troubles are worse, because they start at war. Also, peasant war only start if you are feudal monarchy (so you just become empire).

 

[Gimpstar]

Well if your stacks got slaughtered when they are cheap, you can just build new ones easily. If your stacks get slaughtered when they are expensive, you got a little problem...

With the manpower changes in the beta patch money isn't the limiting factor for recruiting during wartime anymore (as long as you aren't a blob )

 

[Pewt]

With the manpower changes in the beta patch money isn't the limiting factor for recruiting during wartime anymore (as long as you aren't a blob )

If you don't lose stacks willy nilly, money never was the limiting factor during wartime.

 

[unmerged(80402)]

Well money ussualy is only limiting factor, if you got problem with supporting your army. Not when you buy new stacks. And you allways should build big manpower and cash base. Plus good land tech base.

 

[hitchens]

Why are people even talking about modifiers? Just abandon the provinces in France, annex Scotland and Ireland and literately the world is yours.

 

[unmerged(80402)]

Why are people even talking about modifiers? Just abandon the provinces in France, annex Scotland and Ireland and literately the world is yours.

YOU ARE SO WRONG...

You can keep provinces in france without(much of) a fight. Just:

Befriend them(hard)
Befriend burgundy, aragon and savoy(average)
Excomunicate France(easy) - just dow papal state on day 1, and send force to vassalize them, then you got +200 relations, and then, just you ally pope, and they fight with france, you got papacy, you excomunicate them, france go down - and only thing you do is blockade them.

 

[brifbates]

Excomunicate France(easy) - just dow papal state on day 1, and send force to vassalize them, then you got +200 relations, and then, just you ally pope, and they fight with france, you got papacy, you excomunicate them, france go down - and only thing you do is blockade them.

Because starting the game by torpedoing your stab by 2 more, throwing away your allies, and tossing 20 legitimacy is a good idea...
Why not recommend getting MA from Burgundy and force vassalizing all the electors while Bohemia is busy as well? Cheese is cheese.

You can keep the continental holdings easily enough if you are willing to deal with the constant warring that comes with it. If you don't want to get embroiled on the continent the best approach is to sell off the 3 provinces and use the money to buy enough army to take out Scotland.

 

[unmerged(80402)]

Because starting the game by torpedoing your stab by 2 more, throwing away your allies, and tossing 20 legitimacy is a good idea...
Why not recommend getting MA from Burgundy and force vassalizing all the electors while Bohemia is busy as well? Cheese is cheese.

You can keep the continental holdings easily enough if you are willing to deal with the constant warring that comes with it. If you don't want to get embroiled on the continent the best approach is to sell off the 3 provinces and use the money to buy enough army to take out Scotland.

Well actualy the 2 stability loss early on is not a great deal. And vassalizing electors is not so easy, as the may have a tangle of alliances, and are allways protected by HRE.

But i don't agree on selling provinces, they bring you few more ships, and some land forcelimit, so it might not be best plan to do this. And making an army enough big to take out scotland is easy as england start with quite big forcelimit, and don't need to build navy, so they just can mint a little and build up like 40 regiments? Enough to beat up france, not even mention scotland(despite their heavy modifires, that make them hordelike when they fight english... i think best you can do as scotland is instantly dow england, and just build troops at low price and wait for highlanders to arrive...).

 

[Hatkah]

My tried and tested strategy for dealing with france (as england) is to spend 3-4 years conquering ireland while i recruit up to and a little beyond my forcelimits.
I rush Govt 4 for military drill then invade.
I attack from the north and ignore gasgone and labourd. Use your decent starting general and slowly destroy their stacks. Fight on the coast and keep your fleet nearby to retreat if you need to.
Get military access from burgundy and use calais as a bolt hole.
It always plays out differently so i can't be more specific but using this strategy i often take down france alone.
If damn scots invade then deal with them first (or if confinent at the same time generally 1 20k stack will do it).

Obviously it helps to get aragon or burgundy involved and portugal is easy to get to help but it is perfectly doable without help.

 

[hitchens]

YOU ARE SO WRONG...

You can keep provinces in france without(much of) a fight. Just:

Befriend them(hard)
Befriend burgundy, aragon and savoy(average)
Excomunicate France(easy) - just dow papal state on day 1, and send force to vassalize them, then you got +200 relations, and then, just you ally pope, and they fight with france, you got papacy, you excomunicate them, france go down - and only thing you do is blockade them.

Hello!

I'm sorry, sometimes I dont always type all the words in my head. I was more focused on our friend maybe doing it the easy way, not having to deal with France at all. Of course you are right also !