Oh, have you been talking to any of his coworkers or the folks at Paradox he has contact with in a professional capacity? Would LOVE the scoop in that case!
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We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Oh, have you been talking to any of his coworkers or the folks at Paradox he has contact with in a professional capacity? Would LOVE the scoop in that case!
He chews out trolls, and jerks big whoop
http://www.kerberos-productions.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=222&start=0
Or the numerous threads on their site really. Just follow a few randomly. youll see it pretty fast. He doesnt hide it lol
He chews out trolls, and jerks big whoop
3. Criticize constructively
Although criticism is welcome and encouraged please understand that these games have been development by industry veterans of many years. Chances are your perception of a flaw in the game has been discussed either internally or on this forum and the current direction has been chosen for a reason. Criticism that is disrespectful or malicious in nature (a.k.a. trolling) will result in a quick and direct dismissal of your post by the developers and the other community members.
http://www.kerberos-productions.com/...&t=222&start=0
He doesnt follow that rule HIMSELF much less anyone else lol
or setting up threads where they delete the thread unles you agree with them, like the "occupy" one
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Buddahcjcc - it could well be that what was posted in that thread was offensive to members of the forum, it could also be because there was an official venting thread and to keep all posts in one thread avoiding flooding the forum leaving those looking for other topics having to wade through 100's of threads on the "were unhappy" topic.
The Venting thread is still up there as a sticky on the Kerberos forums, so they are NOt trying to hide anything, but rather keeping the forum uncrowded to allow those looking to ask questions about gameplay to recieve answers.
The Venting thread is still up there as a sticky on the Kerberos forums, so they are NOt trying to hide anything, but rather keeping the forum uncrowded to allow those looking to ask questions about gameplay to recieve answers.
Again, see the Steam thread for plenty of examples of offensive behavior. Oh, nevermind those are acceptable because it was Mecron and friends. I can actually understand wanted to keep the forums tidy, but to try to claim this nonsense about deleting anything against the "party line" or mindless hostility against any dissent does not go on there on a regular basis is denying reality.
Fixed that for you. Also, the fact that Mecron does not intend to release a broken features list because people will use it as an example of how unfinished a state the game was in (which might hurt Mecron's apparently fragile feelings) contradicts anything about wanting to give their customers useful information.
Um I saw it. It was cause someone posted that pic that shows the circle where the tea party's views overlap the Occupy ppl's views.
It was called "a screamuing match"
Prior to that, a page was removed merely for stating a differnt view on the Occupy subject. It was a "this thread is to discuss this." type thing IE if you dont agree, go elsewhere
More specifically:
http://www.kerberos-productions.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=21280
All the "occupy" propaganda you can eat, but if anyone presents a dissenting opinion its met with being snipped (that was the first time) and the reason cited as "THIS IS NOT A DEBATE"
Ive BEEN following it. "It could have been" suggests you havent.
I CAN however, not like the people yet like the product. I do it all the time with music. Hence why I still Got SOTS2 even knowing all their views there and how the US is essentially the root cause for everything bad lol
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People are whinging about the freeloaders now?
They have a thread to confine it to, why do they need more?
They have a thread to confine it to, why do they need more?
I know the thread well Buddahcjcc, in the Misc section. Kerberos as a company have to be careful what is posted on their forums, as although the views do not, especially if posted by members who are not employee's of Kerberos, represent the views of the company, libelous or otherwise illegal posting could well result in court action against Kerberos.
The issue is a contensious issue which does divide opinion, and I guess if it was straying from the discussion started by Arrin, then she has every right to remove posts or pages which go off topic. Although there is freedom of speech issues, they are not limiting anyones freedom of speech, rather they are choosing what they allow people to publish on their property. I guess it's like a politican turning up on your front garden to make a campaign speech - you can choose to let them stay, or if you dissagree you chuck them off your property.
The issue is a contensious issue which does divide opinion, and I guess if it was straying from the discussion started by Arrin, then she has every right to remove posts or pages which go off topic. Although there is freedom of speech issues, they are not limiting anyones freedom of speech, rather they are choosing what they allow people to publish on their property. I guess it's like a politican turning up on your front garden to make a campaign speech - you can choose to let them stay, or if you dissagree you chuck them off your property.
actually its just funny theyre all good throwing up all the occpuppy propaganda, and when someone posts a "tea party" pic (Btw, I have YET to see ANYTHING in that thread they could get sued over. Thats just funny. Like I said, the first page that got snipped wasnt even "debating" like the reason it was snipped. I know, I posted there too. It was one guy giving his opinion on it. The second section was just a humerous poke at the movement showing where their views and the trw party views overlap. But apparently, the OP couldnt deal with that - and she was a admin - so she snipped it). It IS totally a free speech thing, and they TOTALLY dont excercise that there. It IS funny to note that theyre ALL ABOUT supporting ppl promoting a right theyre not willing to give (and not to "debate, not to "argue") just to say what you think on that. The thread is totally a propaganda tool. You either post pro occupuppy stuff or you get snipped.
As someone who has been going to their boards for at least 4 years I would say the following:
1. I find their openness and communication refreshing, I would much rather deal with devs who have imperfect personalities than PR people who won't say anything.
2. I find the way they handle some of the more zany, ignorant, abusive behavior laudable, they keep a smoothly running forum. At the same time this does tend to veer into simply squelching people because you don't like what they are saying from time to time. And that is unhealthly. Criticism can be constructive, but a lot of the response to criticism seems to be "my way or the highway", which while trivially true is not a very intelligent way to deal with fan input. This behavior also tends to minimize real problems as the main people commenting are people who are always positive. When people are negative they get yelled at, or banned, or whatever, and they tend not to post as much afterwards. So eventually you have a forum with a bunch of non-confrontational, non-critical people.
4. Mecron is pretty much a jerk. Nothing wrong with this, I am kind of a jerk at times, and I can see where dealing with forums concerning something you made would bring that out in you. But he certainly doesn't pull many punches and he doesn't come across as someone that fun to be around.
5. That said being fun to be around doesn't have a lot to do with making great games (unless it starts effecting internal team dynamics). As long as the product is acceptable I am more than willing to put up with his occasionally boorish behavior.
But the bottom line is this product was completely unacceptable. So people are going to start re-evaluating things that before were things they overlooked/ignored.
A year ago I might have thought, "Oh that irritable Mecron, here he goes again shouting down some newbie's naive criticisms. Those issues have probably come up 40 times before.".
Now seeing the same thing I might think, "Is that how Mecron deals with all criticism, because if it is I can see how he might be living in some dulusional world where he thought releasing the game as it was was acceptable.".
When you perform people overlook your faults, when you don't people focus on them. That is life.
1. I find their openness and communication refreshing, I would much rather deal with devs who have imperfect personalities than PR people who won't say anything.
2. I find the way they handle some of the more zany, ignorant, abusive behavior laudable, they keep a smoothly running forum. At the same time this does tend to veer into simply squelching people because you don't like what they are saying from time to time. And that is unhealthly. Criticism can be constructive, but a lot of the response to criticism seems to be "my way or the highway", which while trivially true is not a very intelligent way to deal with fan input. This behavior also tends to minimize real problems as the main people commenting are people who are always positive. When people are negative they get yelled at, or banned, or whatever, and they tend not to post as much afterwards. So eventually you have a forum with a bunch of non-confrontational, non-critical people.
4. Mecron is pretty much a jerk. Nothing wrong with this, I am kind of a jerk at times, and I can see where dealing with forums concerning something you made would bring that out in you. But he certainly doesn't pull many punches and he doesn't come across as someone that fun to be around.
5. That said being fun to be around doesn't have a lot to do with making great games (unless it starts effecting internal team dynamics). As long as the product is acceptable I am more than willing to put up with his occasionally boorish behavior.
But the bottom line is this product was completely unacceptable. So people are going to start re-evaluating things that before were things they overlooked/ignored.
A year ago I might have thought, "Oh that irritable Mecron, here he goes again shouting down some newbie's naive criticisms. Those issues have probably come up 40 times before.".
Now seeing the same thing I might think, "Is that how Mecron deals with all criticism, because if it is I can see how he might be living in some dulusional world where he thought releasing the game as it was was acceptable.".
When you perform people overlook your faults, when you don't people focus on them. That is life.
Couldn't agree more. And that is a dangerous quality in a CEO. And I have seen a few in my time crash and burn a company for it.
But something I noticed about said thread we were talking about
news, coverage, images and memes ONLY those that follow along with what theyre supporting there. As I noted earlier, if you post a image showing hoe the Occupy ppl's views converge with other views, especially if its a group they dont like, itll get snipped (which I find funny)
another great example of pure mec:
http://www.kerberos-productions.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=22869&p=349467#p349467
Someone posts spoilers about Mass Effect 3, he's all over them for trying to kill the game lol
news, coverage, images and memes ONLY those that follow along with what theyre supporting there. As I noted earlier, if you post a image showing hoe the Occupy ppl's views converge with other views, especially if its a group they dont like, itll get snipped (which I find funny)
another great example of pure mec:
http://www.kerberos-productions.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=22869&p=349467#p349467
Someone posts spoilers about Mass Effect 3, he's all over them for trying to kill the game lol
The worst criticism usually comes from your biggest fans. Squashing the critics is like taking a sledgehammer to the very people who love you.
The OP made an interesting point and going by experience (20+ years in software development and design) I agree with him. I also didn't buy the simplified initial story myself for similar reasons and because it all sounded too damn familiar.
However how would you transition from a situation like they are in currently into one where things are properly settled? I take it that it makes sense to have their intense bugfixing period running their course first and for the finer parts they transition into more workable development cycles?
However how would you transition from a situation like they are in currently into one where things are properly settled? I take it that it makes sense to have their intense bugfixing period running their course first and for the finer parts they transition into more workable development cycles?
lol...
This thread has gone waaaaaay off topic. Entertaining nevertheless!
Getting back to topic, personally I'm not much of a fan of gimmicks like Agile and SCRUM. I know why people do them, but it just ends up going way over the top. The principles are usually right, but just taken too far by theorists sitting in Universities. (UML 2.x anyone?).
Just my opinion.
My hero (sad, it’s true) is Steve McConnell. I’d recoomend his book “Code Complete” (http://cc2e.com/), to anyone who wants to learn more about improving software development.
A favorite quote of mine from it (God knows how many times I’ve used this to PMs and other assorted IT managers) is:
“You work hard or you work smart”
And I’d then refer them to the book.
As you can imagine, this usually goes down swimmingly. Luckily I’m good at my job, I suppose.
Getting back to topic, personally I'm not much of a fan of gimmicks like Agile and SCRUM. I know why people do them, but it just ends up going way over the top. The principles are usually right, but just taken too far by theorists sitting in Universities. (UML 2.x anyone?).
Just my opinion.
My hero (sad, it’s true) is Steve McConnell. I’d recoomend his book “Code Complete” (http://cc2e.com/), to anyone who wants to learn more about improving software development.
A favorite quote of mine from it (God knows how many times I’ve used this to PMs and other assorted IT managers) is:
“You work hard or you work smart”
And I’d then refer them to the book.
As you can imagine, this usually goes down swimmingly. Luckily I’m good at my job, I suppose.