How many Alloy Foundries you need

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Ex Mudder

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it's 2236, and I was just DoW'd by my rival, who has 2.3k fleet power to my 1.4k, despite me being #1 overall. I opened up Observe mode and had a look around to figure out how the AI did it. There are 2 more empires with 2.3k fleet power, the rest are between 1k and 1.6k.

I found the reason for the difference. The ones with 2.3k fleet power has 3 alloy foundries on their homeworld, everyone else (including me) has 2.

Looks like the only viable build is 3 alloy foundries on your homeworld.

That is not a meaningful choice.
 

trojan1234

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Looks like the only viable build is 3 alloy foundries on your homeworld.

That is not a meaningful choice.

No, you can contact other AI empire and throw some resources(foods per months for 30 years are usually best) to sign defensive pact. In your case, 1.4k + 1k-1.6k is enough to deter AI aggression.
 

Glavius

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My mod works like this:
If mineral income is higher than 35 minerals build an alloy factory on the homeworld. Build up to a total of 4 at the level of 35 mineral income.

If alloy income is less than 75, consumer goods income > 2 or gestalt, and you have a mineral income >65 build an alloy factory.

It then changes to if monthly mineral income > 200 build an alloy factory.

To me personally the number of alloy factories that you should run is directly tied to how many minerals you're producing. Letting the AI get to superior fleet power is always dangerous since it's far more likely to declare war at that point. That said, a 2.3k fleet can easily be defeated by a starbase with 2 gunports and a few support ships in orbit and that costs far less than the enemy fleet.
 

redharo

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In current version, it's best to specialize your economy.

During time of peace/ when you feel safe, from nap/ defensive pacts, you should enable civilian economy/consumer trading, replace all your alloys with civilian industries/labs,

During war/ when you don't feel safe, you swap to wealth trading, militarized economy, and alloys.

The 10 year truce from breaking nap is a great time to start changing your economy from civilian to war

At start of the game, when you don't know your neighbors, it's best to go military economy, 4-5 alloys and stockpile them because you can't feel safe if you dont know who your neighbors are. You should only swap to research only when you know that your safe and have a decent alloy stockpile.

Alloys first also have the benefit of settling border disputes through war
 
Last edited:

nuyu

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Actually it depends on your planet, how many you already have for that 36 years. As for me, normally I will dedicate one planet for Research and one planet for Alloy at early game. Once I have Ecu. then I will replace it with appropriate buildings. I feel comfortable if I have 30-50/month Alloy productions at early game.
 

Zeelilus

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How many foundries are needed?

Current foundries + 1
Rinse and repeat until you've won the game.

Honestly though, alloys are the new minerals. Long as you've a positive income of everything else, build foundries (And sometimes it's even more efficient to just build more foundries anyway if the AI is inflating the market price of alloys).
Unless Paradox decides to finally make tech a viable form of combat strength, the guy with the biggest alloy income is going to be the guy winning the game.
 

AlanC9

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Build minerals wherever you can, build alloys until the minerals run low, then build labs until minerals catch up?
 

roman566

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None. You need to make Ecumenopolis, or five, to run your industry. Then switch normal planets to mineral/energy/food production. All empty building slots on those are good for research.
 

Less2

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Zero once you find an Ecumenopolis for free in 2125 due to silly imbalanced precursor rewards. :D

In any case yes, you generally want 3 alloys foundries. Both to make a navy and to make outposts/bases.
 

Slynx

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I think in the early 10-20 years golden number is 5. then you add more if needed.
(then you replace them with something else when you finally get an ecumenopolis, either through tech or through precursors)
 

Edorath

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You might want to specialize one of your planets as a forgeworld at some point to keep your alloy income as high as you can, especially if you take the Arcology Project AP and end running an ecumenopolis.
 

Matoro_TBS

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Wow, surprise, producing more alloys means you can build more stuff from alloys! Of course the one with more alloys should have bigger fleet. That's the sole function of alloys. If you want bigger fleet, make alloys. If you manage to get all your neighbors in non-aggression pacts or you get a strong defensive alliance, then it's not so important.
BTW, 2K fleet is easily countered with a 1K fleet and big station, so if it's just defense that's your worry, you don't need that many alloys. Sure, star-bases are built with alloys, but they don't use alloys as upkeep like ships do.
 

Yámáto

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The only answer is MORE.


I
was content when I produced 1400 alloys/month, dont ask me how many foundries I got at that point, but even with matter MegaStructure I struggled to feed them.
 

methegrate

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Honestly? As many as you can possibly build.

Build a few research labs, enough so it's not too slow, but it's not that much of a priority... Tech is all just a little bit extra damage here, a 5% bonus there. It's not that important. Twice as much tech vs. twice as many ships, the science nerd will lose every time.

Then balance your energy/food/mineral/consumer goods income. (That is, get it to zero, plus your needs for some civilian construction.)

Now get your amenities balanced (5-10 extra for some happiness).

Then put a foundry in literally every other building slot you have. Take an occasional break if you need a refinery.

There are two related reasons for this:

- First, alloys are the only thing you can never have too many of. Despite the economic overhaul this remains a core weakness of Stellaris. It has no competing priorities.

Think about it this way: For any other resource, what do you spend excess income on? Not that much. There's the odd edict or decision, but they're trivial. Mostly your empire is exactly the same whether you have +1,000 consumer goods/energy/food/etc. or +1 for the whole game. Everything above 0 is irrelevant and excess is just stockpiled in case of future deficits. But +1,000 alloys vs. +1 is the difference between winning and losing.

This has made min/maxing toward alloys a dominant strategy, because there's no downside to minimizing any other resource and all upside to maximizing alloys.

- Second, this keeps happening because ships are the only things that matter in Stellaris.

This is a competitive game that wants to pretend it's not, so none of the other systems (economic, diplomatic or technological) are designed to give you a meaningful advantage over other players. As a result, ships are the only thing you need and can use in unlimited quantities.

This is why there's no advantage to having more of any other resource. There's nothing you can spend those resources on, and nothing that would be useful even if you could. This is a war game (in reality, if not by design). The only relevant spending in Stellaris is on something that makes your empire stronger, and only ships make your empire stronger.

If you could spend other resources in ways that made your empire asymmetrically stronger against other empires (technology, economy, productive capacity, diplomacy, etc.), it would be different. Then you'd be giving something up by min/maxing to alloys. But there are no asymmetrical solutions or strategies in Stellaris. There's just the one: Get alloys, build ships. So... do that.
 
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Star Foth

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Depends on your strategy and current situation.

I usually just build them depending on my relative strength to potential threats. If I am roughly equivalent then I decide to up by alloy foundries by quite a bit and spit out bigger fleets. If I am going for a specific strategy like planning an expansion campaign or megastructure, I ramp up my production to suit it.

If you aren't planning a campaign, aren't under duress by imminent crisis, and aren't building megastructures try to merely stay ahead of your opponents and use relative fleet strength as an indicator of when to build.
 

Marconius

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I'm playing my first real game since the patch and pretty much my entire economy is driven by the thirst for alloys... Build more foundries; upgrade your foundries; now you need volatile motes, so build chemical plants; now you need people to work all these; oh, but you need amenities for those people; also food, so fill a planet with farms; now you need consumer goods, so factories for that OR get it from trading... everything comes back to alloys. Alloys are my new god.
 

Kryndude

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The more the better. In Stellaris your ultimate goal is to have the strongest fleet in the galaxy. That's achieved by producing as many alloys as you can. Tech is also important but once you reach the end game level it's all alloys from then on.
 

Badesumofu

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You don't necessarily need that many foundries because ecumenopolises are the best way to make alloys. But if the question is how many alloys you should aim to produce then the answer is as many as you can.

In terms of the very early game - it seems like the AI gets cheated some alloys or something because they all end up being overwhelming fleet power to me when I meet them even on low difficulty. You just find ways to avoid being targeted early while you build up and then crush them as they inevitably can't keep up.