`How exactly do you make a MDS mod?

[Xie]

I would like to see a way to create a european state in this mod. If it is with the Eurozene or civil war in eruope...

There will be no EU unification events. At least not for now.

 

[razorbird789]

There will be no EU unification events. At least not for now.

i disagree, there should be a german backed unification of the eurozone so that it becomes a more financially stable area. This could be interesting because France would have the option to reject the proposal and nations such as Spain, Greece, Ireland and Portugal could be left out because of their instability. Also there'd be options for non euro nations to join such as Hungary or the UK albeit with the chance of civil unrest if they do so because of the unpopularity of the EU in those nations. I also believe that this mod WILL fail if we attempt to start in 2000. It should start in 07/08 at the start of the credit crunch for many reasons.

1) It will be less work to do and therefore less likely to be abandoned
2) If events before the credit crunch go a historical what would happen to the credit crunch? it would be hard to simulate whilst war is going on.
3) there is more information about the latter half of the 00s than the first half concerning armed forces and industry
4) it would prevent having to waste time in game sitting around for 12/13 years

 

[Xie]

i disagree, there should be a german backed unification of the eurozone so that it becomes a more financially stable area. This could be interesting because France would have the option to reject the proposal and nations such as Spain, Greece, Ireland and Portugal could be left out because of their instability. Also there'd be options for non euro nations to join such as Hungary or the UK albeit with the chance of civil unrest if they do so because of the unpopularity of the EU in those nations. I also believe that this mod WILL fail if we attempt to start in 2000. It should start in 07/08 at the start of the credit crunch for many reasons.

1) It will be less work to do and therefore less likely to be abandoned
2) If events before the credit crunch go a historical what would happen to the credit crunch? it would be hard to simulate whilst war is going on.
3) there is more information about the latter half of the 00s than the first half concerning armed forces and industry
4) it would prevent having to waste time in game sitting around for 12/13 years

Or at 2005, or whenever things arguably started to get "fun" for MDS. I might push the time back to 2000 or at least 2003 at one point in the future if we go by this route. Just like how HOI2 starts off in 1936, but DH and IC extends to 1933, and AAR extends it even further by merging with 1914.

 

[Ottoman Master]

Once somebody does ministers and gets me the list, I'll be able to complete the election events.

 

[unmerged(174159)]

There will be no EU unification events. At least not for now.

4TH REICH 4TH REICH.

Also remember MDS is older than this. Doing it from 07/08 to the backdrop of a Eurozone crisis gives the mod a new joie de vivre, whilst MDS was kinda like "We'll start at 2000 cos Sept 11th." I mean you could have a 2nd scenario or such, but honestly, it's not really MDS unless you aim to start within 5 years of the day you start modding IMO (which means at some point if you keep with this mod you'll have to develop it with a rolling start date, or alternatively, you just model historical paths better as time goes on and you change the name to Euro Crisis mod when someone else wants to make a 2016 MDS with Iran nuking Israel etc

 

[Xie]

It is decided that this mod will start in 2007 should I ever do it, through I might pull back the time to 2000 in the future.

 

[razorbird789]

It is decided that this mod will start in 2007 should I ever do it, through I might pull back the time to 2000 in the future.

good. Maybe templates should be laid out for storylines after 2012? (or the end of it forward)

 

[Xie]

good. Maybe templates should be laid out for storylines after 2012? (or the end of it forward)

We can use your ideas for WW3 and how the whole world gets involved.

 

[unmerged(174159)]

The way you mentioned the flashpoints feels forced. I'd much rather have some sort of spiraling descent that gives the whole mod an undertone of hopelessness and the inevitability of war and strife.

 

[Xie]

The way you mentioned the flashpoints feels forced. I'd much rather have some sort of spiraling descent that gives the whole mod an undertone of hopelessness and the inevitability of war and strife.

Well, how do we do this. And what do you mean war is not inevitable. AI will 90-99% pick choices that lead to WW3 with the exception of the Russian and DPRK flashpoints. So? It is pretty much inevitable for the AI to pick the two flashpoints I'm working with.

It's like the 1989 mod, where they claim the AI will have a very high chance of starting WW3.

 

[razorbird789]

The way you mentioned the flashpoints feels forced. I'd much rather have some sort of spiraling descent that gives the whole mod an undertone of hopelessness and the inevitability of war and strife.

it should be centred around the need for resources and food i presume most the the flashpoints will be in (Korea, Iran, Taiwan, Kosovo, arab uprising etc) so I'm bringing something new :

The Euro has collapsed but NATO has barely scrapped through, the UN is missing the Russian alliance and all of the Chinese Alliance except China itself, China is just there to mock the USA.


after one of the obvious flashpoints cause war, or an arms race then war food should cause chaos, think about what would happen if trade collapsed and nations found themselves without food. Is that dark enough for you Kaiser

India, China, Japan, UK, Africa Caribbean, Mediterranean islands, Latin America, South Europe, USA. Those are the flashpoints of the new food crises. These nation would suffer the worst through a trade/food collapse and so i'll write my thoughts on them. In order of what will happen, this will probably begin to occur in the second year of WW3.

Africa : South Africa finds it's population isn't sustained by it's food, but it's neighbours think that they are going hungry as South Africa is plentiful with food. The surrounding nations ally together to destroy it, after doing so they find that it it isn't as rich as it thought and so they attack each other thinking that if they unify the south of the continent they will be fine for food. Thousands die in the conflict.
The area of Kenya echoes the same story barely weeks after South Africa is defeated. Their neighbours tare it apart then proceed to destroy each other.

Nigeria and Ghana ally with each other to prevent themselves from being victims like Kenya and South Africa. They instead assault their neighbours and unify the coast from Gambia to the Congo. The rest of the African nations all battle each other for complete control over the continent. The rest of the world turns a blind eye as they watch their food stocks shrink as the war escalates.

At this point Russia has Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia, Kazakhstan(and all other 'stans' except Turkmenistan) under it's control. Finland and the Baltic states have allied for it in return for food while Serbia (who has seized Kosovo) has been allied to it for the whole war, Greece is also allied to it after the Russians backed their taking of F.Y.R Macedonia. These nations have enough food to get by and will go on a gradual conquering spree. Turkey has been defeated by Kurdistan which owns all of central and north Iraq aswell as south east Turkey. Israel owns Jordan, South Lebanon and the land up to the Suez canal.The arabian peninsula is one nation (arab federation) which is all of the peninsula including Basra and Iraq up to Baghdad.

Indochina becomes chaos as Vietnam invades Laos and Cambodia and Thailand attack each other thinking that they have enough food to save them. As this happens after about 1 year 4 months of war an Indian poll finds the world death toll to be around 150million through lack of food. This information is what will ruin the world. As the information is released Riots spring up throughout the world. (in game players will get to choose how they react to them). Most countries to to contain it, Dictatorships just gun down the protesters as they are wasting food anyway. China and America make peace as food is depleted in both nations. Western China tries to join Mongolia who is getting by with food imports from Russia. China allows i as Riots spread across major cities, Southern China becomes independent after three months of hunger, the Chinese civil war will be swift and deadly. One China will win with over 300million killed. They will invade Japan who is a starving nation. After seizing Nagasaki and Kagoshima Japan makes peace and allies to China in return for food. South Korea is left abandoned and is quickly destroyed by the north.

At the same point in the civil war in China the UK will dissolve as riots spread throughout the nation. The four nations of the British isles will trade successfully for food but all foreigners will be forced into southern Yorkshire by angry natives thinking that their food is being stolen. a brief English civil war is fought where the republic of Britain which is completely dominated by non natives trying to take control of the countryside (This could be event driven). The citizens of the Isles are content to trade amongst themselves and the loyal members of the commonwealth (Canada, Australia, Caribbean). The commonwealth stays intact and peaceful for now. (there could be more anti foreigner movements across the world)

France struggles against communist uprisings in Italy, Spain and Portugal. The normally neutral Swiss join the French cause for food that the French never supply. France's dissent will constantly rise during the war until it collapses under rebellion. A man rises and calls himself emperor of the French 2nd empire. It seeks to unify France, Italy and Iberia (Spain/Portugal). They also take Switzerland. As the communists lose they call on Germany for help. Germany had recently recovered from an attempted coup then a civil war with Bavaria/Austria. It takes the opportunity to invade Belgium and hand it over the The Netherlands in return for an alliance. Denmark, Norway and Sweden form the Scandinavian union during their war with Russia. Poland falls to Russia before the it invades Sweden and triggers the union formation.
A new poll by a Brazilian intelligence suggests the death toll from lack of food is at 400million. This causes an invasion of the food rich Argentina who has peacefully annexed Chile with food offerings.
India doesn't know what to do, they invade Pakistan and trigger the third nuclear strike of the game (The first is Iran to Saudi, the Second is NATO to Wonsan to prevent a N.Korean nuke launching.) Pakistan is quickly destroyed and revenge is taken on them by the Indians, no food is given to the Pakistani's and all of it is taken to India. India then does the same to Burma and Afghanistan. Kurdistan has a disagreement with Iran which results in war. (This is a non food driven war.)


I could go on, but basically there could be a civil war in the USA eventually, with Texas, Pacific states and Confederacy declaring independence. The pacific states should be the most powerful. (ALL US soldiers return home when the first food poll is released.) Eventually China will annex Hawaii with food offerings and Invade the Pacific states which will look to the USA for aid, the PSA will collapse but Utah, Nevada and New Mexico don't want to reunify so form the nation of Deseret which was rejected years ago by the USA. Deseret is neutral in the 2nd war between China and the USA. At some point every ex NATO nation will have to rejoin to battle Russia and China when they have a disagreement over west China which is still under Mongol rule. They will make war with Mongolia and eachother which will be when NATO will strike back, this time though there could be a massive empire in Africa, an other nations like Israel, Arab federation, Iran, India and Latin America could make a difference one way or another.(before this though there will be many more food wars that may include more nukes.)

 

[Xie]

This social collapse idea seems interesting. Through I might need more than one ppl to work on it.

 

[unmerged(174159)]

I'll write/lay out my thoughts in response Razorbird later.

 

[Xie]

For the social collapse events, if we use IC or incorporate new nations into this mod, we can use some revolters such as Normandy and Occitania to split from France when France faces revolt. US civil war will involve all nations that can be balkinized from US.

 

[Lucifer]

A man rises and calls himself emperor of the French 2nd empire.

This guy has even a name : Napoleon III :laugh:

 

[messenger]

I think a much better idea would be proxy/real war caused by the scramble for resources in Africa.
Already nations such as China are investing heavily in African nations for rare materials that aren't found in useful quantities in most places.
For example many materials vital to modern technology such as coltan, are primarily mined in countries such as Congo.
(Here is a reasonable documentary on the subject: http://www.vice.com/vice-news/vice-news/the-vice-guide-to-congo-1
It shows how the discovery of valuable resources has a marked effect on a nation and also the reliance the modern consumer has on such resources.)
This would be the second scramble for Africa in as many centuries. I think could make for a much more interesting story than the normal 'oh shit society died again' storyline.
What would perhaps be more interesting is setting this 'modern' scenario in 1991 after the fall of the Soviet Union, Russia is still powerful but in disarray, you have the option to have the Gulf War against a strong Iraq. Technology as we know it was really starting to pick up the pace, meanwhile this theme of relative Western triumph is juxtaposed by the Third and Second Worlds being hit hard by the power vacuum left by the the dismantled USSR. China and India are also finding their strength, Germany is struggling with the East German problem etc. It is a really interesting time to choose that hasn't been over done like the Modern Warfare mods, not to mention it makes it easy to either turn into an alternate History mod or follow to contemporary History, dependent on player choice ofcourse. Combined with the scramble for rare resources for modern technology, it could be a really interesting premise for the mod setting.
I feel it is often a stalling point for many of these mods to try and work out a viable narrative that would contribute to intriguing gameplay, so why not let our recent History be the storyline with some minor amendments?
This also means it is possible to do fairly realistic OOBs for nations in order to have a semi-realistic or atleast authentic feeling world military of the time as such information is now available.

 

[unmerged(174159)]

It's also been done already. Turning point 1989.

 

[messenger]

It's also been done already. Turning point 1989.

I assumed from what I read on that, it was primarily aimed at a Cold War continuation as opposed to post Cold War but thanks for the heads up.

 

[razorbird789]

i was trying to think of the one thing that would be dark and ominous, and that is the death of millions by starvation, mainly in Latin america, Africa and Asia because of the higher populations and less food production etc. So i thought that most nations would have to scramble for key locations and have to make allies through the mess of destruction caused by civil wars sprouting everywhere.

Key Locations off the top of my tired brain :

(Wheat/Meat)

Russia
Ukraine
Argentina
USA
UK
Northern France
Germany
South Sweden
Denmark
Baltic states (including Poland)
Northern Italy
South Africa
Central North China (Beijing area)
Coastal Australia
US border states of Canada
Ireland

(For Rice)

Thailand
Vietnam
Burma/Myanmar
South China
Indonesia
South Korea
Philippines

Places where populations will be affected by food the most

(Worst places/Starvation throughout most of the game unless food sources are taken immediately)

India
China
Japan
Africa
Brazil
Mexico
Taiwan
North Korea

(Mediocre places/ Will survive if proper reforms are taken or food source taken)

UK
USA
Germany
France
Italy
Turkey
Australia
Canada
Spain/Portugal
Greece
South Africa
South Korea


(Places that should be fine for food but will be the target of many)

Ukraine
Hungary
Argentina
Thailand
Ireland
Philippines
Russia



There are many i missed but you get the picture

 

[Ferreti]

Is this still alive?