How does Paradox determine where resources are located?

[nuarbnellaffej]

Sweden IRL most certainly did not produce half the amount of steel that Germany produced, yet it does in the game.

While the actual in game numbers definitely are not realistic, they do help to mimic the real life situation. IIRC IRL a good deal of Germany's steel refineries pre-war were set up to process high grade(high iron concentration) Swedish ore. As the war went on this ore became less relavent due to German steel mills re-tooling(takes a while) to process the lower concentration French ore they gained access to.

How this all works in game though, I'm not sure since I'm still on HOI IV hiatus..

 

[Xaelyn]

Perhaps it would make more sense to change steel into iron (and remove sources that don't represent iron mines), with steel mills simply represented by the factories needed to build equipment/ships. That would better represent countries like Germany that needed to import a lot of ore to feed their substantial steel production industry. It's also more consistent with other resources.

 

[aono]

I'm sure they deleted a lot of recources during balancing, e.g. the Chinese tungsten and steel, as it would make Asia OP.

Asia should be OP when you're speaking about resourses.

 

[Xaelyn]

Asia should be OP when you're speaking about resourses.

Yeah, there is a reason Japan invaded China. As it stands doing so isn't worth the world tension it generates.

 

[aono]

Yeah, there is a reason Japan invaded China. As it stands doing so isn't worth the world tension it generates.

Actually it's a reason European nations created colonies at all. Now in-game there is one useful colony - Indonesia; every other is quite insignificant. Why do French and Brits own all that african lands, for example? Why did they came there first time? If you're looking into game, that's only to fight Italians in Sahara.
I believe to prevent colonies became supermonsters with hundreds of civilian factories from the very beginning, national idea or law can be added, something about "mining industry development", with negative modifiers to resourse collecting.

 

[nuarbnellaffej]

Perhaps it would make more sense to change steel into iron (and remove sources that don't represent iron mines),

Yea that would make more sense to me immersion wise. I know the resources in game are really meant to represent a whole basket of different resources but it's weird having a finished industrial product(steel) as a primary, natural resource.

A good flavor name to me would be "ferric metals" or something.

 

[Wing_008]

the lack of Aluminium in the eastern hemisphere, save for the USSR, is very annoying, i cant import because the stupid route is through the english channel, i cant conquer, because there isnt any except for the USSR and thats is a tough nut to crack, i just sit and wait for germany to unf***k itself, which never happens

 

[Riktol]

So when are we going to see a mod which adds all these resoruces in so that you have to trade for 20 resorces per tank?
Because that sounds like FUN.

 

[Prinz Wilhelm]

I was just thinking about this, what's up with the Chromium in Botswana? https://books.google.se/books?id=3C...AEIQTAF#v=onepage&q=chromium botswana&f=false According to this, chromium deposits in Botswana weren't discovered until the mid 60's.

 

[Chagall]

Spoiler: steel production ECSC

Spoiler: iron production ECSC

Spoiler: coal production ECSC

Spoiler: source

http://www.cvce.eu/content/publicat...c5a-45e3-9356-3309c9eaeb04/publishable_en.pdf

Now tell me why France produces so much steel.

 

[billcorr]

• Repair the link? (or perhaps find another reference source).

I was just thinking about this, what's up with the Chromium in Botswana? https://books.google.se/books?id=3C...AEIQTAF#v=onepage&q=chromium botswana&f=false According to this, chromium deposits in Botswana weren't discovered until the mid 60's.

Thanks for researching chromium in Botswana (formerly the British protectorate of Bechuanaland). Well done. But the link provided does not seem to work.

It might be that another mineral that was mined in Bechuanaland in 1936 is tallied as "chromium" in HoI4. For example, nickel *might* be represented as chromium in Hoi4. Although I've upheld the "nickel=chromium in HoI4" theory previously, I've begun to have second thoughts about nickel = chromium.

 

[billcorr]

I was just thinking about this, what's up with the Chromium in Botswana? https://books.google.se/books?id=3C...AEIQTAF#v=onepage&q=chromium botswana&f=false According to this, chromium deposits in Botswana weren't discovered until the mid 60's.

Nice catch.

Alternatively, the developers could have made a mistake and were just a few hundred kilometers off. North of the border from Botswana/Bechuanaland is Southern Rhodesia. In 1936, S. Rhodesia was the 2d leading world producer of chromite.

Luckily, Paradox now has a physical geographer on the HoI4 team (I forget his name, but Paradox had a list of backgrounds of different members of the HoI4 team...one of the staff members was trained in physical geography). He'll be able to help make all the corrections.

(Edit: the above real world annual mining tonnage of chromite invites some questions. Where's the Philippine Islands' chromium? How does Canada's real world chromium production correspond with patch 1.3's Canadian national focus? New Caledonia and chromium...what's the correlation? Brazil will get a chromium boost when PDX publishes a Brazil DLC? Interesting questions with hopefully some interesting answers in the future).

 

[billcorr]

• Paradox's physical geographer may help with a more historical depiction of resource locations.

Here's the mention of Paradox having a (former?) Physical Geographer on their staff:

• Your name: Rufus
• Your forum name: Omghax
• How long you've been on the team: On and off since february. Permanently since August.
• Role on the team: QA tester
• Brief explanation on what that role means:
  Trying to ensure we ship the best possible product by identifying issues early and ensuring they've been addressed before release. Also bug forum liason.
• Something you want to share with the forumites:
  Scientists seem to be attracted to PDX like flies to honey. As I left behind a masters in molecular biology to come work here and our team also includes a nuclear physicist and Physical Geographer. Makes one wonder if we're branching out in unexpected directions.

 

[Prinz Wilhelm]

• Repair the link? (or perhaps find another reference source).

Thanks for researching chromium in Botswana (formerly the British protectorate of Bechuanaland). Well done. But the link provided does not seem to work.

It might be that another mineral that was mined in Bechuanaland in 1936 is tallied as "chromium" in HoI4. For example, nickel *might* be represented as chromium in Hoi4. Although I've upheld the "nickel=chromium in HoI4" theory previously, I've begun to have second thoughts about nickel = chromium.

https://books.google.se/books?id=3C...pg=PA79#v=onepage&q=chromium botswana&f=false how about this one?

 

[billcorr]

• Suggest a tungsten boost for Spain when PDX works on Spain's national focus tree?

The relatively low tungsten value of Spain is also kind of weird. They were a significant part of the wolframite trade in WW2, and one available to Germany without needing to ship it with convoys. Some googling suggests their output was a third or more of Portugal's, but in HoI4 they get a mere 6 to Portugal's 376.

Spoiler: Spain produced 0.63% [0.0063] of world's tungsten in 1937

According to one source, Spain produced 0.63% [0.0063] of world's tungsten in 1937.
http://images.library.wisc.edu/EcoN...41/reference/econatres.minyb1941.hdavis03.pdf

page 652

Later in the war, Spain produced more and more tungsten. By studying the percentage of world tungsten Spain produced in the later years of WW2, an HoI4 developer or modder might be able to recreate Spain's tungsten production more accurately.

Spoiler: Tungsten production by country 1941 - 1948

http://images.library.wisc.edu/EcoN...948/reference/econatres.minyb1948.hdavis6.pdf
page 1258

Tungsten (general discussion)
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a286718.pdf

International Strategic Material Report: Tungsten
https://pubs.usgs.gov/pdf/circular/pdf/c930-o.pdf
This USGS source is useful, given that it lists world (to include Spanish and Chinese) tungsten mines and the year they became operational.
Table 10. Selected production and mineral-resource information from ISMI records for tungsten deposits and districts.

 

[Xaelyn]

Thanks for posting that, I looked but couldn't a source for tungsten production.

Paradox is way off with their tungsten figures, which is strange given how accurate their rubber and oil figures are.

 

[Kaanka]

The charts here are greatly appreciated, I made a mod to increase the states of asia and wanted to adjust the resources as well yet i didn't have the knowledge about actual production/extraction values

 

[Novacat]

I'm sure they deleted a lot of recources during balancing, e.g. the Chinese tungsten and steel, as it would make Asia OP.
I'm fine with that

Except it is not really well balanced. At the moment, as Japan, going into China or Southeast Asia is foolish since it does little to solve Japan's shortages in Aluminum, Steel, and Oil. There is something wrong when it feels like the only move Japan can make, other than Southeast Asia, are to go after the Soviet Union because it is the only country with decent resources in Asia.

 

[Slickzor]

Except it is not really well balanced. At the moment, as Japan, going into China or Southeast Asia is foolish since it does little to solve Japan's shortages in Aluminum, Steel, and Oil. There is something wrong when it feels like the only move Japan can make, other than Southeast Asia, are to go after the Soviet Union because it is the only country with decent resources in Asia.

The focus for war against the netherlands before they join the allies is really interesting.

But you are 100% correct about the rest.

 

[Secret Master]

We have some other resource threads going on. There's no need to necro this one.

Go ahead and continue discussion in the other threads talking about resource distribution. Thread closed.