• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Sietrin

Private
10 Badges
Aug 12, 2018
17
54
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
I tried finding this info on wiki with no results. So should non-fighters have any air attack and air defence? Do they even shoot at the plains trying to shoot them? What is the point of air defence for non-fighters if AA both ground (this one ignores agility too) and naval ignores it? If I were to attach to a carrier fighter a bomb to strike ships would it even strike them or fulfill onl its roll in battle (being on a carrier)? Or would a naval bomber actually fight any warplanes having decent air attack (being on a carrier)?
And a less important question to me: are there any decent builds for the medium air hull?
 
  • 1
Reactions:

billcorr

Field Marshal
53 Badges
Feb 5, 2010
8.750
2.862
  • Cities in Motion
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Semper Fi
  • Rome Gold
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • Majesty 2
  • Magicka
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Darkest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Divine Wind
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Knights of Honor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Pride of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Rome: Vae Victis
What is the point of air defence for non-fighters

My understanding (and I could be wrong) is that Paradox chose the words "air defence" to describe how many points of damage an airplane can take before being destroyed.

That is to say,

HoI4 "air defense" is what the rest of the world's wargame designers call "hit points" ("HP").

[I admit, I could be totally wrong...please correct me if "air defense" is not the same as "hit points"]
 
Last edited:

blahmaster6k

Bob Semple Tanker
38 Badges
Feb 8, 2018
2.278
6.261
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Colonel
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Semper Fi
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • For the Motherland
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
Air defense isn't strictly representative of HP, it's more like armor in that it reduces the damage your planes take. More air defense -> Lose fewer planes to the same amount of air attack. Planes only have one HP really, they either are shot down or they are not. A simplified explanation would be something like this: when air combat is calculated, the combined air attack of the attackers is put against the air defense of the defenders and the result decides how many planes are destroyed.

There's a detailed breakdown of the air combat formula on this wiki page.

To answer OP's question, having some air attack and extra defense on non-fighters can help lower casualties and inflict a few more to enemy fighters attacking your bombers, but it's questionable whether it's worth the cost to do so. If your bombers are regularly being intercepted and shot down by fighters, it might have been a better idea to invest in fewer CAS and more fighters so that the CAS you do have has a better chance to get through, while the extra fighters help to remove the threat posed by enemy planes, freeing you up to use more CAS later.
 
  • 3Like
  • 3
Reactions:

billcorr

Field Marshal
53 Badges
Feb 5, 2010
8.750
2.862
  • Cities in Motion
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Semper Fi
  • Rome Gold
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Majesty 2 Collection
  • Majesty 2
  • Magicka
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Darkest Hour
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Divine Wind
  • Leviathan: Warships
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Hearts of Iron III Collection
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Knights of Honor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Pride of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Rome: Vae Victis
Air defense isn't strictly representative of HP, it's more like armor in that it reduces the damage your planes take. More air defense -> Lose fewer planes

Thanks!
 
  • 1Like
Reactions:

HugsAndSnuggles

General
86 Badges
Sep 3, 2016
2.345
2.718
If I were to attach to a carrier fighter a bomb to strike ships would it even strike them or fulfill onl its roll in battle (being on a carrier)? Or would a naval bomber actually fight any warplanes having decent air attack (being on a carrier)?
You might want to check this thread on the subject:
 

Cavalry

Field Marshal
8 Badges
Jul 24, 2001
5.311
1.363
Visit site
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
I tried finding this info on wiki with no results. So should non-fighters have any air attack and air defence? Do they even shoot at the plains trying to shoot them? What is the point of air defence for non-fighters if AA both ground (this one ignores agility too) and naval ignores it?

Just look at real life or non DLC game to have an idea how to design planes.
- They should have a little air attack just in case, the turret is for them and not for fighters. Don't overdo it at the coast of bomb load. The turret can be as cheap as only 1 IC 1 weight and can reduce distruption too, no reason to skip it.
- Yes they can shoot and receive attack from enemy fighters.
 

Ferrous Will

I Invoke The Ancient Power That I May Return!
130 Badges
Jul 17, 2012
1.729
5.647
  • Sword of the Stars II
  • The Kings Crusade
  • Magicka
  • Majesty 2
  • March of the Eagles
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
  • Rome Gold
  • Semper Fi
  • Sengoku
  • Ship Simulator Extremes
  • Sword of the Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Cities: Skylines - Snowfall
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Rome: Vae Victis
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Magicka 2
  • Cities: Skylines Deluxe Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Cities in Motion
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Darkest Hour
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Arsenal of Democracy
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • For The Glory
  • For the Motherland
  • Hearts of Iron III
  • Hearts of Iron III: Their Finest Hour
  • Heir to the Throne
To answer OP's question, having some air attack and extra defense on non-fighters can help lower casualties and inflict a few more to enemy fighters attacking your bombers, but it's questionable whether it's worth the cost to do so.
I should probably point out that air attack on CAS/TAC/STR/NAV does contribute to disruption negation, so it does help the planes in question in doing their job a little better. If you can't destroy every enemy fighters in a war then that might be worth considering. (still probably questionable though)
 
  • 1
  • 1
Reactions:

Cavalry

Field Marshal
8 Badges
Jul 24, 2001
5.311
1.363
Visit site
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
Yeah the 1-2 IC gun turret have the best efficiency than invest in a few more fighters, and think about having 1000 more turrets in the air. Most of the time they will shoot, if you stick to fighter: CAS ratio 1:1 or when the enemy is numerous enough. For strategic bombers, the cannon turrets alone can beat a few interceptors if bombers have number advantage enough (up to 3:1)
 
Last edited:

Synicus

Major
10 Badges
Jan 3, 2018
544
307
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Hearts of Iron IV: La Resistance
  • Battle for Bosporus
  • Hearts of Iron IV: By Blood Alone
  • Hearts of Iron IV: No Step Back
How do airplanes work?
It's all about thrust, weight and lift.
Piloting is a bit like driving a car in 3D.
 
  • 1Haha
Reactions: