How china DLC would be named?

[Thure]

It was sarcasm, though I don't believe that ties between China and Europe were sufficiently strong during this time period to warrant the two appearing in the same game. I would much prefer to see China in its own game.

Indirect ties. The Mongols for exemple would be way better represented with China in the game. Or the plague. The Steppes had both influences from China and Europe.

And shortly before the first start date there was even a battle between China and the Abassids.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Talas

 

[Aries666]

Western baka gaijins love their Japanese samuari and ninja of the Sengoku Jidai. How many Three Kingdoms games have major Western devs published?

Not many that I know of and a CK2esque adaptation in the 3 kingdoms era would be pretty cool. Part of the problem though is having the confidence to get it right seeing as it's a foreign culture (for western devs).

 

[Aries666]

Indirect ties. The Mongols for exemple would be way better represented with China in the game. Or the plague. The Steppes had both influences from China and Europe.

And shortly before the first start date there was even a battle between China and the Abassids.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Talas

Of course areas of the map closer to China had more contact with China, this would be true of any time period. By this logic after putting China in the south east asian kingdoms should be included and then all of the pacific islands and perhaps Australia? My point still remains that China is better depicted in its own game due to its unique culture and structures rather than being shoe horned into a game centred around European feudalism.

 

[SBolshevik]

Of course areas of the map closer to China had more contact with China, this would be true of any time period. By this logic after putting China in the south east asian kingdoms should be included and then all of the pacific islands and perhaps Australia? My point still remains that China is better depicted in its own game due to its unique culture and structures rather than being shoe horned into a game centred around European feudalism.

Every nook and cranny of the game should have its own game then. The current feudal system fits Germany and France above all.

 

[Aries666]

Every nook and cranny of the game should have its own game then. The current feudal system fits Germany and France above all.

I hardly think China (you know that place bigger than Europe) is a mere "nook and cranny"

 

[Keizer Harm]

have specifically stated that [...] the last expansion will add playable theocracies

Where did they specifically state that? They only said a vague "rulers you cannot play as", which might as well refer to inland republics. I agree with you theocracies are likely, but they did not specifically state it.

 

[SBolshevik]

I hardly think China (you know that place bigger than Europe) is a mere "nook and cranny"

Indeed, but as I said, CKII's systems are barely good for the land currently in the game, let alone China.

 

[Thure]

Of course areas of the map closer to China had more contact with China, this would be true of any time period. By this logic after putting China in the south east asian kingdoms should be included and then all of the pacific islands and perhaps Australia? My point still remains that China is better depicted in its own game due to its unique culture and structures rather than being shoe horned into a game centred around European feudalism.

Australia? You know Austrialia and the Pacific had absolutelly no or little contact with South East Asia or East Asia? And there were no real states in this territories.

 

[Legionary Guard]

When the hell did the bad pun thread turn into the Pro/Anti-China war Mk. 27,009!?

 

[DàbiànLājīdàrén]

CK2: Gwailos be Angry

 

[Aries666]

When the hell did the bad pun thread turn into the Pro/Anti-China war Mk. 27,009!?

Don't they always

 

[SBolshevik]

When the hell did the bad pun thread turn into the Pro/Anti-China war Mk. 27,009!?

Everything changed when the Fire Nation attacked I guess.
Or something like that, my memory is fuzzy.

 

[IFWanderer]

"Serious" answer to title question, since the puns have been made already: All Under Heaven.

 

[Thrake]

When the hell did the bad pun thread turn into the Pro/Anti-China war Mk. 27,009!?

Especially since it has offocially been announced that there will be no map expansion

 

[DàbiànLājīdàrén]

Especially since it has offocially been announced that there will be no map expansion

Yet people still ask for playable theocracies.

 

[orochi2k]

Yet people still ask for playable theocracies.

It suddenly comes to my mind that there is no way to handle the religions in China

 

[Hikuran]

It suddenly comes to my mind that there is no way to handle the religions in China

Buddhism (Mahayana) spreaded in China in Mid-Tang, bud the majority of Chinese are either Taoist, Confucianist or just Pagans (ancestor worship).

For Taoism...
Well one can relate it to Green Party, they prefer small government, less restrain and being peace with nature. On the other hand, they believe that by "mediation" and practice they can transcend into Sage or reach immortality. A rather peaceful and self-focus religion

For Confucianism..
It's not even a religion, it's almost atheism and in fact statecraft. The core of Confucianism is about obeying the "Rule", that kings should be kind and love his realm, Vassal shall obey its liege like son obey his father. (君君臣臣父父子子) If every one does what he/she is supposed to do, society will maintain and prosper.
When things go out of order, like Kings being arbitrary, then vassal will have obligation to overthrow him. Fear not for Heaven will support such righteous revolt, that's the reason why every revolt in China in history need some "proof" like natural disasters (flood or drought) or omens like disfigured First-Born Son of Kings/Emperor. Those who wants to revolt will claim that "The emperor has lost heavenly mandate" exactly like in EU4

 

[orochi2k]

Buddhism (Mahayana) spreaded in China in Mid-Tang, bud the majority of Chinese are either Taoist, Confucianist or just Pagans (ancestor worship).

For Taoism...
Well one can relate it to Green Party, they prefer small government, less restrain and being peace with nature. On the other hand, they believe that by "mediation" and practice they can transcend into Sage or reach immortality. A rather peaceful and self-focus religion

For Confucianism..
It's not even a religion, it's almost atheism and in fact statecraft. The core of Confucianism is about obeying the "Rule", that kings should be kind and love his realm, Vassal shall obey its liege like son obey his father. (君君臣臣父父子子) If every one does what he/she is supposed to do, society will maintain and prosper.
When things go out of order, like Kings being arbitrary, then vassal will have obligation to overthrow him. Fear not for Heaven will support such righteous revolt, that's the reason why every revolt in China in history need some "proof" like natural disasters (flood or drought) or omens like disfigured First-Born Son of Kings/Emperor. Those who wants to revolt will claim that "The emperor has lost heavenly mandate" exactly like in EU4

But, so far as I know. Emperors of China change their religions very often. Religions are more like politic tools they can chose from to rule the Empire as they like. Except some zealots, they seem very tolerate to other religions. That is very different to the rest part of the game.

In addition, 朱熹 somehow "reformed" Confucianism in Song dynasty. Thus, would it make the old Confucianism a Pagan?

Both Taoism and Confucianism are requiring special mechanics to make them feel like them. And the Buddhism is a bit different with the one in India. Plus, the Buddhism in Tibet is a bit different with the one in India and the one in major part of China.
Thus, I assume religions are very complex to implement in China.

 

[SBolshevik]

But, so far as I know. Emperors of China change their religions very often. Religions are more like politic tools they can chose from to rule the Empire as they like. Except some zealots, they seem very tolerate to other religions. That is very different to the rest part of the game.

In addition, 朱熹 somehow "reformed" Confucianism in Song dynasty. Thus, would it make the old Confucianism a Pagan?

Both Taoism and Confucianism are requiring special mechanics to make them feel like them. And the Buddhism is a bit different with the one in India. Plus, the Buddhism in Tibet is a bit different with the one in India and the one in major part of China.
Thus, I assume religions are very complex to implement in China.

Buddhism would have to get revamped in order to avoid sudden Hinduism in China.

 

[Hikuran]

But, so far as I know. Emperors of China change their religions very often. Religions are more like politic tools they can chose from to rule the Empire as they like. Except some zealots, they seem very tolerate to other religions. That is very different to the rest part of the game.

Both Taoism and Confucianism are requiring special mechanics to make them feel like them. And the Buddhism is a bit different with the one in India. Plus, the Buddhism in Tibet is a bit different with the one in India and the one in major part of China.
Thus, I assume religions are very complex to implement in China.

Yep, Buddhism in North China (Mahayana), South China (Hinayana, same as South-East Asia and Sri Lanka), Tibet region (Vajrayana) and Ikko-Ikki (Japanese variant) are very different from each other.

As for Emperor himself, religion is indeed a tool, eastern Religion normally don't have religious leader or is simply secular leader him/herself. No pope or Caliph to restrict powerful lords like in Europe so they don't pose much of a place in politics, more in daily life of people (both commoners and nobles)