How about the pope

[geogus]

Is the pope going to have any special role as head of catholic curch? Or the papal states is just going to be a regular country as any other.

The curch had a relevant role in the abolition of slavery and was getting pressed by italian rissorgimento that eventually reduced it to a one-block sized nation.

Will catholic countries be able to defend the soverinity of papal states and rome ( as france was doing, but suppose any other major catholic nation in the game could do it)

 

[thedarkendstar]

The Pope how many divisions does he have?

 

[geogus]

Actually, he had a few in the 19 century

 

[Paghalay]

The Pope how many divisions does he have?

About 135 men armed with pointy sticks.

 

[geogus]

Actually, prior of the disband of the papal states, the l'Esercito Pontificio (Papal Army) comprised two regiments of locally recruited Italian infantry, two Swiss regiments, a battalion of irish volunteers, artillery and dragoons

plus the papal states had and international legion of sorts, the international Catholic volunteer corps called the Papal Zouaves, comprised from catholic volunteers from all the world willing to fight for the soverginty of the pope.


Importany to note, the Vatican we know today only was born in 1929, with the lateran treaty, outside vic3 time scope.

Prior to that, it was the papal states and after rome caputre by italy it was sort of an occupied nation by an foreign power ( at least from the papal point of view). Maybe something similar to poland situation in the XIX century.

Who says one could not demand from an unified italy, defeated in war, ( or even from diplomacy, after all the pope has lot of soft power) the release of the papal states

 

[kviiri]

The Papal State was still, aside its religious role, a rather significant power in 1800's Italy until their conquest by the Kingdom of Italy. And as hard as it is to believe, considering the Vatican City State is technically an absolute monarchy today, they were going through a phase of semi-secular constitutionalism in the 1840's under Pius IX that, should the state have endured, might've resulted in a partially democratic rule similar to eg. the English bicameral parliament. Would be interesting to see some speculative outcomes based on that in-game, though as the state is a very special construction, I don't think it's wise to expect it to be particularly accurate at launch.

 

[geogus]

Now that i think about it, the papal states, trying to hold against italian unification, might be an interisting run, especially if somehow is strong in diplomatics, diplomacy being a key element in the game

 

[Valladolid]

Now that i think about it, the papal states, trying to hold against italian unification, might be an interisting run, especially if somehow is strong in diplomatics, diplomacy being a key element in the game

I made a few modest suggestions for the pope in Vic 3 here if anyone is interested. I do think it would be interesting if the Papal States are more than a speed bump for Victor Emmanuel and Garibaldi

 

[geogus]

Another idead that comes to me,how would an late game surviving papal state deal with the rise of communism.

The pope was able to kick hard socialism in the second half of XX century even with no divisions, how would an pope fare with an army at his disposition.


Id like to play a papal state crusading against URSS

 

[Woifee]

Another idead that comes to me,how would an late game surviving papal state deal with the rise of communism.

The pope was able to kick hard socialism in the second half of XX century even with no divisions, how would an pope fare with an army at his disposition.


Id like to play a papal state crusading against URSS

Or communist papal state going to spread socialism to the catholic world.

 

[Amallric]

Please, the HoI4 forum is over there.

 

[geogus]

Please, the HoI4 forum is over there.

No pope in hoi iv

 

[Grim Deadman]

in 1929, with the lateran treaty, outside vic3 time scope.

Uhm... but that's within Vic3's time scope? Otherwise, excellent post.

 

[Tibi088]

OTL the Pope was one of the main candidates for italian nationalists to unify Italy under. The popes OTL proved not to be a partner in this - a good decision I think. But there could ba timeline when they decide to head the italian unification movement.

 

[Drakken]

OTL the Pope was one of the main candidates for italian nationalists to unify Italy under. The popes OTL proved not to be a parter in this - a good decision I think. But there could ba timeline when they decide to head the italian unification movement.

Yes, because Pius IX was such a overzealous Liberal... bit of self-delusion from a segment of the Nationalists there. I'm still not convinced that Pius IX was in fact mentally sane.

The Popes' main issues in the era was spiritual vs. their temporal power, poverty among Catholic workers, and the rise of Socialism. Not to play Great Power politics. Besides, as soon as Pius IX published his Syllabus of Errors he lost the attention of about half of his secular worldwide flock towards Liberals and Socialists.

 

[Drakken]

How many Divisions does the pope have?

Plenty to squash the Roman Republic, thanks to Napoleon III.

Also, in 1836 the Papal States was still occuping vast territories from Ferrara in the North to Velletri to the South. It was not just Rome itself. They were among the great regional powers with Piedmont-Sardinia and the Two-Sicilies.

 

[Mr. Wiggles]

Plenty to squash the Roman Republic, thanks to Napoleon III.

Also, in 1836 the Papal States was still occuping vast territories from Ferrara in the North to Velletri to the South. It was not just Rome itself. They were among the great regional powers with Piedmont-Sardinia and the Two-Sicilies.

Less than 30 years into the game start (IRL) and the papal states fell apart by themselves, most people in central and north Italy wanted a national and secular state

 

[Victoria 3 finally]

Excommunicate button wich gives a nation 0.00001 infamy per year.

 

[PhilzuNeide]

Or communist papal state going to spread socialism to the catholic world.

Wouldn’t be completely unrealistic. Christian socialism exists after all

 

[Woifee]

Wouldn’t be completely unrealistic. Christian socialism exists after all

Absolutly, this makes such a playtrough so intriguing