Hold the Line, Bring back Sectors.

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AbstractSpaceCreatures

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The new sector system is complete and utter garbage. I end up with a hundred single one planet sectors, and it's frankly annoying as hell. The old system was better for the simple fact that you could choose what planets were in the sectors yourself.
 

Badesumofu

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It just needs tweaks. Sectors should be a bit bigger, and for the people that want it, there should be a functional automation system (it’s not automated if you have to keep giving them resources).

That’s basically it, a modest balance change to sector size and a modest UX change to make automation more effective and sectors will be in a good place.
 

ladybug

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So having played a game in which I used the sector AI for basically everything from the start it appears to be extremely bad at times. Late game planets having next to constant unemployment (5+pops) and housing shortages when there are free slots and +10k resources banked. During early game it seemed to just ignore the focus I had set but given at times I was low or negative of some resources I won't complain with the AI ignoring the focus to compensate but it would be nice to know it would do that.
 

Sifer2

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Since this topic is still going i'll just repeat some suggestions I made in another thread on it.

1. Fix the generation like the mod does so you don't get the 1 planet sectors.
2. Bring back sector stockpiles but make them very small. Like 1000 resource cap. This is so they have something to build with.
3. The excess resources a sector produces over cap goes to you. Their deficit comes out of your stockpile.
4. Allow automation settings on a per planet basis.
5. Just copy whatever Glavius does so the autobuild AI is not mentally handicapped.
 

Xephos Demonslayer

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I despise the new sector system.

I can tell you with absolute honesty that when I found out they were removing sectors and allowing the player to assume direct control of every planet I genuinely shed a tear of joy and made the people in the train look at me like I was a nutcase when I started pumping my fist in elation.

This is gonna be just like the FTL discussion. It was a sytem that was cool in concept, sucked for the majority of players, got removed to improve game preformance and make things simpler. The FTL was to make wars work in manners that weren't doomstack V doomstack, I won 1 battle now the war's over Imma siege the rest of your worlds 1 by 1 with my 10k army stack when you can only stack 2.5k defense armies. This was because sector AI was 'rarded since day 1, has never been good, takes up performance and pxsses players off, and was easier to remove than port to the new economic system, in which it would be even more fxcking braindead than it usually was. You'll either leave or try the new system and grow to like it just like the FTL people did, and player counts will still rise just like they did then.
 

Kain2K

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@Xephos Demonslayer
You miss the point here by several light years.
The problem is not that the sector change may be controversial. The problem is, that the change is just incomplete. There is no automation what-so-ever, the implemented "automation" needs constant babysitting because it'll only work as long as the sector has resources. The only way a sector can get resources is by manually, and the emphasis is on "manually", assign them. Sectors only consist of systems that are up to 2 jumps away from the first colonised planet. This leads to the problem that there are often enough only sectors with one habitable planet in it - this is especially a problem when playing with less then the normal number of colonisable planets. This means you need a s***load of govenors, which in turn means you have to pay a s***load of upkeep in credits.
Aside of this, the awkward design of the outliner, and the whole concept of it, is now breaking down with warp 10, because someone at Pdox made the brilliant design decision to put things in there that aren't available anywhere else, so you tend to have everything activated, which in turn means you constantly have to scroll through the darn thing just to find the one thing you're looking for. The sector overhaul, as it is of now, is just a massive step backward, because it has to many design flaws.
Like I wrote already in my first post here:
We need a real automation option.
We need either a redesign of how sectors are created (preferable precreated during galaxy creation), or the number of jumps per sector has to be increased.
And we need a complete overhaul of the outliner, which means that anything that is shown there has to be also shown somewhere else, like, for example, in its own menu. But the issue with sectors is not only an adjustment issue on our part, it is for the much greater part an issue with a seemingly unfinished, and not well thought through overhaul.
 

Archael90

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Sectors should have max number of planets e.g. 5, and when above new sector is creating. Also, each sector should have its own resource stock, but not big. like about 500 minerals, and some other resources, and it should be filling with serctor income, and when above 100% income should go to empire deposite.
 

Evaris

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Sectors should have max number of planets e.g. 5, and when above new sector is creating. Also, each sector should have its own resource stock, but not big. like about 500 minerals, and some other resources, and it should be filling with serctor income, and when above 100% income should go to empire deposite.

Ok, but what about when you have world counts at 5x, and you have systems with 3-4 planets right next to each other, or start spamming habitats all over the place, or you've rushed ringworlds and both of the above are true to boot?
 

Archael90

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Ok, but what about when you have world counts at 5x, and you have systems with 3-4 planets right next to each other, or start spamming habitats all over the place, or you've rushed ringworlds and both of the above are true to boot?
Well... think of something? Maybe unlimited planets in star cluster, but unlimited clusters as long as you dont have 5 or more planets ant the same time?
Maybe pre-launch slider choosing how many systems in one sector, regardless on later game decisions?
Or something else?
 

Evaris

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Well... think of something? Maybe unlimited planets in star cluster, but unlimited clusters as long as you dont have 5 or more planets ant the same time?
Maybe pre-launch slider choosing how many systems in one sector, regardless on later game decisions?
Or something else?
Personally speaking, I'd suggest sectors be replaced with a modified constellation system - where each constellation is it's own sector, and have constellations fixed to a set number of systems, to which I'd suggest 10, and the planet count being adjusted to an average number of habitable planets per constellation.

This would mean, for example, if you set it to an average of 5 planets per constellation, that's all you'd have in most cases (obviously with some fluctuation, likely falling between 3 and 7 planets) but wouldn't excessively clutter the UI. And of course, you wouldn't have to settle (or would want to, in some instances) all planets within a constellation.

What's more, is you would be able to see where your sectors would be before you stared planning things out, and given at lower hyperlane densities you're looking for defensive chokepoints anyway, you'd likely stick to constellations in your natural growth as it was.
 

Orphalesion

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Also, each sector should have its own resource stock, but not big. like about 500 minerals, and some other resources, and it should be filling with serctor income, and when above 100% income should go to empire deposite.

Only if that resource stock is optional. I like developing my planets myself and don't allow auto-build, so that delayed resource delivery would just be an unnecessary complication for me.
 

Archael90

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Only if that resource stock is optional. I like developing my planets myself and don't allow auto-build, so that delayed resource delivery would just be an unnecessary complication for me.
Noone force you to enable auto-build, it is disabled by default, you have to manually allow sector to auto-build.
 

wolcen

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Another vote to generate sectors at galaxy creation to match star clusters.

Give free claims against systems owned by others in a star cluster, have governors manage their own small patrol fleets, etc., sets up some interesting possibilities for both internal and intl politics.
 

Orphalesion

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Another vote to generate sectors at galaxy creation to match star clusters.

Give free claims against systems owned by others in a star cluster, have governors manage their own small patrol fleets, etc., sets up some interesting possibilities for both internal and intl politics.

That was the idea put forward in Dev Diaries, wasn't it?

No idea why they changed that before release...
 

PirateJack

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That was the idea put forward in Dev Diaries, wasn't it?

No idea why they changed that before release...

Because it doesn't work with all settings. 0.25x or 5x hyperlane settings would so utterly break it that it'd make the game effectively unplayable. The Devs can't make a system that isn't supported by all of the starting options; there'd be riots on if they did from the crowd that accepted the 5x hyperlane compromise. Galaxy-gen, ironically, has too many options available to allow something so rigid to work. So they have to go with a dynamic system like this.

That said, I've been experimenting a bit with varying sector sizes and having them set to 4 jumps seems reasonable to me. That's enough to cover the 2 guaranteed planets you get at game start and potentially a couple more. Anything outside of that forms its own sector and expands for 4 jumps in every direction. I'd also give the option to have the old sector resource accumulation back, though modified a bit, so any space-based resources in the sector would go into the stockpile. You could then set it to give you a percentage of its income like before, or everything over an adjustable cap like mentioned earlier in the thread.

It'd take a bit of work on the Dev's side, but it'd mean having a workable automation system for the people that don't want to min-max every single planet.
 

kmh42

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After reading the hole thread my feeling are mixed.
I didn't play Stelaris a lot before 2.2 so I learned the new system fast and enjoined it quickly.
Now I have 32 planets and 16 sectors. 10 with only 1 planet. I tried to managed it all by myself but this is not fun at all on this scale like other already pointed out. Automation also doesn't work because I still have to give the sectors res manually, hope for the best and repeat the circle later again 16 times.
I just wondering how a perfect automation should look. Click and forget seems a bit strange considering strategic resources. There aren't enough out there to just simply give it to the AI. You need to decide on your own where to invest them on an empire level. I can't have a governor that says to him: "Oh! Volatile Motes are nice. Let's build a random building/upgrade which needs it". These resources need spend thoughtfully.
Same with research and unity. A planet/system/sector does not need those resources but the empire does. But those goes also into the thought process of building up a planet.
Same again with immigration and emigration. There are so many factors that needs consideration which will always go beyond a simple Autobuild button. This are also the fun part of micromanagement. But it stops being funny doing this for 20+ planets.
Non of the presented solution in this thread convinces me fully. Some are good and would fix single parts of the overall issue but there is always a drawback of some kind. I hope paradox comes up with a good solution fast so I can enjoy my big sprawling empire.
 

SpectralShade

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I'm fine with needing to handle planets by myself. I'm not fine with needing to either have a majority of the planets be without governer bonuses because... gamemechanics make weird sector sizes... or go into bankruptcy from leader maintanance to roleplay an efficient beuracracy empire that wants a governor in each sector.

Before this patch I always divided my empire into several sectors. I know some people did the "core sector and the other sector" thingie, and I can see why that would need to be regulated. But what we got now is just inane. I just started out a new empire with efficient beuracracy. I have the 2 planets closest to me and my capital. I am already at 2 sectors. I wouldn't even need to worry about sectors until early midgame or something in the old versions, so this is just out of control.

Bring back the ability to define sectors ourselves, but place a limit of amount of colonizable systems in a sector that is reasonable (Personally I would think it should lie somewhere around 5-7 systems with colonies per sector as that was what I usually played with before the patch).