Hoi4 Units of Measurement

[77Hawk77]

Nearly everyone I play paradox games with are americans, and we have played for years Hoi, CK and EU. And in all that time none of them said the game would be improved by having imperial measurements.

Besides, by now all of those same friends actually have no problem with the metric system, even if they can't do the exact conversion on the fly.

 

[Katarian]

It's...NOT.....about Europeans. I could careless about you. It has nothing to do with you. No one is advocating doing anything to you. It's about Americans a huge portion of Paradox sales....I would just like the option.

I like knowing how fast something actually is..it's the same reason people want Tiger Is instead of just a generic picture. Or I want stats on losses or something else. It's helpful and immersive.

And lastly I think you totally missed the point about the language comment. I don't like speaking for the guy but I think his point was. If you aren't going to be inclusive on this..what's the point in being inclusive on all the other things.

Why should anyone care about what you want with that attitude? You couldn't careless about Europeans, or most of the rest of the world that understands Metric, why should anyone care about American's problems with the Metric system.

A unit having a speed in KPH is telling you how fast something is. I'm not that great at KPH as I use MPH but it doesn't hurt my immersion especially as the numbers aren't actually accurate. A Tiger doesn't in game actually have it's correct speed just like it doesn't have it's real armour or gun penetration values.

As for the language that is a totally separate issue. If you can't read English or another supported language then playing the game will involve masses of guesswork and trial and error to work out. I've tried playing games in languages I don't understand and it's nigh on impossible when you start out, after a while you kind of learn what each button does and maybe understand a few of the numbers but miss out on a lot because you can't understand advanced aspects of a game. In this case we are literally talking a few numbers where all you need to know is bigger is better and it's largely irrelevant if they even have a unit. I mean the game could literally say Fighter I moves at speed 600 and Fighter II moves at speed 1000 and everyone who understand one of the supported languages would know Fighter II was faster then Fighter I without the need for KPH or MPH.

I kind of agreed a bit initially, privately if not in my posts, that it could be a fairly simple option but your attitude has rubbed me up the wrong way and I don't care if it makes in or not anymore.

 

[GermanPower]

Why should anyone care about what you want with that attitude? You couldn't careless about Europeans, or most of the rest of the world that understands Metric, why should anyone care about American's problems with the Metric system.

A unit having a speed in KPH is telling you how fast something is. I'm not that great at KPH as I use MPH but it doesn't hurt my immersion especially as the numbers aren't actually accurate. A Tiger doesn't in game actually have it's correct speed just like it doesn't have it's real armour or gun penetration values.

As for the language that is a totally separate issue. If you can't read English or another supported language then playing the game will involve masses of guesswork and trial and error to work out. I've tried playing games in languages I don't understand and it's nigh on impossible when you start out, after a while you kind of learn what each button does and maybe understand a few of the numbers but miss out on a lot because you can't understand advanced aspects of a game. In this case we are literally talking a few numbers where all you need to know is bigger is better and it's largely irrelevant if they even have a unit. I mean the game could literally say Fighter I moves at speed 600 and Fighter II moves at speed 1000 and everyone who understand one of the supported languages would know Fighter II was faster then Fighter I without the need for KPH or MPH.

I kind of agreed a bit initially, privately if not in my posts, that it could be a fairly simple option but your attitude has rubbed me up the wrong way and I don't care if it makes in or not anymore.

....................................My attuide. The fact you start at that shows me you aren't at all understanding my point. My point is Europeans have no dog in this fight and to complain about something being more inclusive is simply ignorance. It'd be like going on a request for Croatian language and yelling at them saying your language is dumb and why should we care about you! Except for the fact this Croatian makes up 30% of total sales in my made up forum request. That's how shockingly ignorant people are acting. SO WHEN Someones says they don't care about Europeans it doesn't fucking extend beyond the immediate conversation. So if you wanna get rubbed the wrong way why don't you realize how the other forum members are acting about a subject that has little or nothing to do with them. They are arguing against something being more inclusive and shouting learn! Learn it! Ours is better. Then belitting the entire US sales base as if it doesn't matter. Like seriously read some of there post. I feel I'm being entirely justified.

Good for you? What's your point? Games shouldn't be more inclusive? Not sure what gun values have to do with anything. But in the same bounds there I'd enjoy real or rather supplanted values there in any event. Secondly to add on no one is saying it's immersion breaking it's being said it'd be a nice touch and would be helpful to many people. Because it wouldn't just be speed changed anyways it'd allow be distance too, among a few others. It'd be helpful for navigation to some extent. So it goes beyond just what you said and extends into easy of use.

Again you are missing the point. My comment was to say very simply. Don't be a dork. If you are all cool with other languages and fine with them being added in one after another. Why would it matter if it was easily possible to add in the Imperial system for a huge section of your audience? It's not about the languages themselves and it's not a separate issue in his context. Secondly it's not just to that single aspect it's others such as distance and what not. Which would be really helpful because in my head I know the distances in miles. It'll give me a better idea of units range and what not. Making it easier. Thirdly arguing against more immersion is silly in the first place. My point still stands. We should just all have pictures of toads and walruses for tanks if you think adding more information that is better palatable is a bad or unhelpful thing.

Last. That means nothing to me. My stance of hey if this is a easy thing to do. Please do it. It'd be nice and ignore all the non-sense these people are saying. It has nothing to do with them. If that rubs you the wrong way or what I'm saying so be it. My views aren't that fickle. It's a rather simply request and all I'm doing is acting in response to the silliness of the handful of posters and disagreers on this forum topic. EDIT; OH Not to mention that was that forum members first post. So everyone disagreeing and telling him his request is for something barbaric and your system doesn't matter just learn ours is certainly inviting and welcoming. It's entirely not me you should be rubbed the wrong way by.

@77Hawk77 Cool.. The vast majority of American's don't understand or can accurately conceptualize the metric system as well as they can the Imperial system. So all of your American friends would much love the ability to turn that on and be able to better understand what the numbers were and what the distances were and so on and so forth. It'd be a helpful and widely used feature by us Mericans. I'm saying if it's something that can be easily done. Please do it.

 

[Gort11]

The idea that a game using metric instead of imperial is in any way comparable to it spitefully lacking a language translation is laughable.

 

[GermanPower]

The idea that a game using metric instead of imperial is in any way comparable to it spitefully lacking a language translation is laughable.

Make that three who've totally missed what's being said. Congrats. It has to do with a line of logic not a DIRECT COMPARISON. Does cap locks help? Language served the purpose to show hypocrisy. Which you still don't get. I didn't take the original guys post literally like you did because he was clearly being sarcastic. It's that if you are too be inclusive with other languages, it's hypocritical to refuse to do it for measurement systems or make the silly arguments you guys were making. It was a satiric post to illustrate this by him, I believe. Point still stands.

 

[Invictus5966]

The main reason I want to see an option is because I don't feel like doing the math in my head how much is 437 mph in kph for the p51d?
Its just something I'm used to.... how many MM of armor is 3" of armor ect...
I want to play a game for fun not have to do math.

 

[GermanPower]

The main reason I want to see an option is because I don't feel like doing the math in my head how much is 437 mph in kph for the p51d?
Its just something I'm used to.... how many MM of armor is 3" of armor ect...
I want to play a game for fun not have to do math.

You shouldn't have to explain yourself. That's what is annoying me about this thread. Can you imagine if the shoe was on the other foot? If it was a American company that didn't have metrics in. Someone makes a post requesting asking about it and all the Americans just shit on the dude calling it barbaric, stfu just convert, it's arbitrary doesn't matter, so on and so forth. Can't get more redneck then that.

 

[The Nothing]

Make that three who've totally missed what's being said. Congrats. It has to do with a line of logic not a DIRECT COMPARISON. Does cap locks help? Language served the purpose to show hypocrisy. Which you still don't get. I didn't take the original guys post literally like you did because he was clearly being sarcastic. It's that if you are too be inclusive with other languages, it's hypocritical to refuse to do it for measurement systems or make the silly arguments you guys were making. It was a satiric post to illustrate this by him, I believe. Point still stands.

Making a comparison with language would make sense, provided Paradox games have a good translation. Yet, they're mostly not very well translated, at least in french it is a big bunch of variables name and no text for any event in Hearts of Iron 3. And we're talking about the second most spread language accross the world. I'm pretty sure same thing happens in spanish. Third language in the world. There's only in english that the game can be enjoyed fully.

And we, the non english speaker, aren't complaining about it.

By the way, earlier you said in 1939 it doesn't makes sense to have the metric system. I'll answer then, in 1939 it doesn't make sense to have the game in english either. It's AFTER the second world war english became the most used language in diplomacy. But who cares ?

Lastly you're claiming most buyers are americains and thus deserve to have what they want. Hopefully it won't be like that. They can be numerous and yet be wrong, otherwise we would live on a plan earth with dangerous edges, and with our sun turning around our good old earth.

And should a part of the buyers order the studio to do what they want, that game wouldn't be historical anymore. It would be totally biased.

 

[GermanPower]

Again. I don't think you guys get the point. The logic behind adding languages is to be more inclusive and if you are to do that for languages to be more inclusive. Why not apply the same for measurements.

That was satire of the point he was making. I wasn't being serious. I was simply pointing out his logic was flawed.

I'm not claiming anything. The largest buyers are Americans of any nation. To me that means doing so and adding in the option would be valued to many people who play the game. That was the point. Secondly creationist have nothing to do with being American. I didn't make a argument out of correctness or what was right. My entire point was out of pandering, really. It'd helpful and useful to a very large section of the audience. People were trying to pretend the US sales don't exist by saying it's a minor and small group in reference to the Imperial system. When in reality it's makes up the largest section of gamers that play PI games.

Lastly what in the world are you talking about? I don't think allowing the option to have the imperial system so it's more legible for US customers is much a do anything to do with others? Or demanding/ordering anything. Your post is very strange to me. Secondly reread the post you quoted for that last line too.

 

[Zaku]

@GermanPower
Okay I think this is strating to become silly now.
In the amount of time you took to rabble about this here, you could easily learned the 3 or 4 units of masurement you'll need for hoi4.
mile = km x1.6
mph = km/h x1.6
foot = m*0.3
0 celsius(freeze point) is 32 farenheit, 20C is 68 F, -20C is -4F

Is there anything else I'm missing?

 

[GermanPower]

@GermanPower
Okay I think this is strating to become silly now.
In the amount of time you took to rabble about this here, you could easily learned the 3 or 4 units of masurement you'll need for hoi4.
mile = km x1.6
mph = km/h x1.6
foot = m*0.3
0 celsius(freeze point) is 32 farenheit, 20C is 68 F, -20C is -4F

Is there anything else I'm missing?

Irrelevant. Irrelevant. Irrelevant. You still have not gotten the main point. I've already invalidated your LEARN IT point. As have others. Until you can refute what I originally said when a few people brought this up. The point is null. You should very easily be able to scroll up and see the variety of peppered arguments against the LEARN IT! I'll add another point: People think in relation not in mathematics. Saying solve it doesn't solve that problem. Sure I know roughly sorta know what it says but initial my mind is held from instantly understanding what's needed adding another thought process to go on. It's the same people generally prefer their own language instead of a English version even if they speak English perfectly fine. Ease of use.

Secondly I will address new stuff you brought up. How is it silly? I feel I'm being sound and logical. I don't take it as rabble. As for I could have done something else instead of what I'm doing now....no one is peak in efficiency and it's not for you to judge what someone should and shouldn't do with their time. My nickname is internet warrior..it should be self explanatory. I'm rather enjoying myself. Now that's a silly point. So both sides of the learn it! Are negated. Also you are apart of the problem. So to say I could have just! when you are posting things I'm replying to makes you apart of the 'problem of time wasting'. So try to make arguments that don't shoot yourself in the foot.

Lastly I think you'l find it enjoyable and easy to convert 3,342 and times it by 1.6.. 1.60934 is the full number to actually have it be accurate. Top of my head it's roughly 5,100? I was off by 200 miles. Considering the propensity for human error that margin is going to be much wider then 200. It's not something you can easily just do on the fly to get accurate numbers. You have to sit and think about it and do the times table if you aren't familiar. Myself I excel at math and I can't imagine for those who aren't as inclined with numbers and how annoyed that'd be to give a relative and real sense to it. So like your argument still doesn't even make sense if I accept learn it! Which isn't a acceptable or reasonable response to this request. This is highlighted by various responses to it that have yet to garnered any meaningful rebuttal. So it still very much stands. Like it or not I like the Imperial system and prefer it to metric in any event. So the only reasoning is to do it for a game. That's not a lot to push me. I'd rather just request something in a sensible manner. Still don't get why people hate inclusiveness.

So my suggestion instead of telling and shoving learn it in peoples faces. Why not..not care about it at all? That's a suggestion. Why say anything. When I've already stated soundly it has nothing to do with you.

->Hey it'd be awesome and cool if you guys added this in and I'm sure many of my other Americans would enjoy it. If not it's whatever I get that might be hard to do considering the nature of how PI numbers are displayed. If that's the issue then its okay. In any event it's the least of my concern. <- This has been the nature of what I think and posted besides rebuttaling dumb points.

So like...uh. I'm being pretty reasonable here.

 

[Zaku]

Irrelevant. Irrelevant. Irrelevant. You still have not gotten the main point. I've already invalidated your LEARN IT point. As have others. Until you can refute what I originally said when a few people brought this up. The point is null. You should very easily be able to scroll up and see the variety of peppered arguments against the LEARN IT! I'll add another point people think in relation not in mathematics. Saying solve it doesn't solve that problem. Sure I know roughly sorta know what it says but initial my mind is held from instantly understanding what's needed adding another thought process to go on. It's the same people generally prefer their own language instead of a English version even if they speak English perfectly fine. Ease of use.

Secondly I will address new stuff you brought up. How is it silly? I feel I'm being sound and logical. I don't take it as rabble. As for I could have done something else instead of what I'm doing now....no one is peak in efficiency and it's not for you to judge what someone should and shouldn't do with their time. My nickname is internet warrior..it should be self explanatory. I'm rather enjoying myself. Now that's a silly point. So both sides of the learn it! Are negated. Also you are apart of the problem. So to say I could have just when you are posting things I'm replying to makes you apart of the 'problem of time wasting'. So try to make arguments that don't shoot yourself in the foot.

Lastly I think you'l find it enjoyable and easy to convert 3,342 and times it by 1.6.. 1.60934 is the full number to actually have it be accurate. Top of my head it's roughly 5,100? I was off by 200 miles. Considering the propensity for human error that margin is going to be much wider then 200. It's not something you can easily just do on the fly to get accurate numbers. You have to sit and think about it and do the times table if you aren't familiar. Myself I excel at math and I can't imagine for those who aren't as inclined with numbers how annoyed that'd be to give a relative and real sense to it. So like your argument still doesn't even make sense if I accept learn it! Which isn't a acceptable or reasonable response to this request. This is highlighted by various responses to it that have yet to garnered any meaningful rebuttal. So it still very much stands. Like it or not I like the Imperial system and prefer it to metric in any event. So the only reasoning is to do it for a game. That's not a lot to push me. I'd rather just request something in a sensible manner. Still don't get why people hate inclusiveness.

So my suggestion instead of telling and shoving learn it in peoples faces. Why not..not care about it at all? That's a suggestion. Why say anything. When I've already stated soundly it has nothing to do with you.

->Hey it'd be awesome and cool if you guys added this in and I'm sure many of my other Americans would enjoy it. If not it's whatever I get that might be hard to do considering the nature of how PI numbers are displayed. If that's the issue then its okay. In any event it's the least of my concern. <- This has been the nature of what I think and posted besides rebuttaling dumb points.

So like...uh. I'm being pretty reasonable here.

Okay, then continue with the ranting.
Reasonable... yeah right.

 

[GermanPower]

Okay, then continue with the ranting.
Reasonable... yeah right.

That's a ad hominem. Not dealing with the substance or point of a argument. But rather going after the person by using a sarcastic remark and degrading my post to 'ranting'.

 

[Zaku]

That's a ad hominem. Not dealing with the substance or point of a argument. But rather going after the person by using a sarcastic remark and degrading my post to 'ranting'.

Substance? You are basically throwing a tantrum because the game doesn't have imperial units.

When people give you advice on how to deal with YOUR issue all you are telling them is irrelevant irrelevant. Excuse me for not taking you seriously any more.

 

[TheRomanRuler]

yeah those of us that can do complex math and not just factors of 10 will do so

Well, NASA certainly can do complex math, and like said previously in this thread, they use metric system.

 

[GermanPower]

Substance? You are basically throwing a tantrum because the game doesn't have imperial units.

Do you have any proof of this? Or examples? I bet not. Just saying something doesn't make it so.

Also I direct you to my first post which was reactionary to the actual tantrum being thrown by the other side. What's that called again? Oh Projection. The example is someone being satirical/joking in response to the barbarian comment and overwhelmingly negative response to the request of inclusiveness for a huge base of customer. That guy who makes the satire in response is thrown into the -adjust glasses- WELL TECHNICALLY. If anything that's showing a sign of temperament issues by your side not mine. Not me responding to the ridiculousness points, arguments, and so forth.

Lastly I direct to section of my first post
-> "In all seriousness please do this. Please don't make me have to mentally translate every time I view speed of units I have. The US has the most sales of any nations. It'd be nice if I bought from a US ip there were the correct measurements. I'd be so happy to see that. It'd be a nice touch.

Edit: It is the least of my concerns. It'd just be something nice assuming it would be easy to just mask the number." Me like first time homie.

Such a harsh childish demand and so was this
"->Hey it'd be awesome and cool if you guys added this in and I'm sure many of my other Americans would enjoy it. If not it's whatever I get that might be hard to do considering the nature of how PI numbers are displayed. If that's the issue then its okay. In any event it's the least of my concern. <-" Me a moment ago.

I can sense the anger and demands and tantrum in those words. Especially this "If not it's whatever" God..so much rage in those words I apologize.

@TheRomanRuler NSA a model government program we should all model ourselves after. Mind if I snoop around in your trash tonight?

 

[GermanPower]

When people give you advice on how to deal with YOUR issue all you are telling them is irrelevant irrelevant. Excuse me for not taking you seriously any more.

It's been explained how it's bad advice and irrelevant to the conversation. I'm not just shouting irrelevant. I explained thoroughly multiple times and haven't heard a rebuttal.
So sorry for me not taking your points seriously because I literally just said why it's bad and why it doesn't help. Why it's a irrelevant point.

 

[safe-keeper]

I wouldn't mind such a setting myself. Something like "Metric", "Imperial" and a setting that shows knots, feet, etc. for aircraft and ships where applicable, and metric measurements like KPH for tanks and whatnot. Except maybe nautical miles, that would be confusing alongside kilometers .

Lots of games, including simulators like Silent Hunter 4, have settings that allow you to change between measurement systems, so I don't really see why not. Seems a good idea to me, and I don't see why it sparked a thread full of "europe good, amerika dumb" posts.

yeah those of us that can do complex math and not just factors of 10 will do so

Can we report moderators for trolling ?

 

[The Nothing]

 

[Zaku]

Can we report moderators for trolling ?

You try it.