HOI4 Husky 1.9.1 BETA hotfix [checksum: 3d42] (Not for problem reports)

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Vril266

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please fix the fate of yugoslavia bug

Atm fate of yugoslavia NEVER works cause yugolsavia always refuse because of their guarantee. This is massivley annoying in sp if you play germany and can not use 3 of your focuses.. cause they do not work
 

xtfoster

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There are 8. And how many types of unique roles do you have for DDs? How many for BBs?

Its FINE the way it is, and honestly I can't think of any easier way to implement what was needed. However, it is VERY confusing and difficult to use, most people don't understand how, even with their video tutorial.
There are, and I don't personally have a problem with it...but: It is possible to run out if you have many generations and roles of ships and don't want to mix them. The game doesn't look at the hull generation, so it would mix interwar DDs with 1940 DDs if they both had the same icon. I don't usually run into this myself because I usually refit all my starting DDs to a single design (and create a new interwar 'Escort' design with minimum equipment for escort duties.)
 

Kenttäharmaa

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Now that XP gain from training is, if I've understood correctly, weighed by the amount of manpower in relation to how well-equipped they are, or something along those lines, wouldn't the new meta be to spam pure rifle divisions to maximize XP gain for minimal cost? To counter this, would it be possible to weigh XP gain from different types of equipment, in relation to their production cost? E.g. training with tanks would give more XP than training with rifles. Ideally this would be done in such a fashion that it'd remove any way to game the system.
 

Franky

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I did not see anything about the Crush the Revolution focus on the Stalinist Spain tree being impossible to reach in the notes? Unless I’m missing something, mathematically unless you add a way to add days to the anarchist event trigger you’ll never get to that focus before the anarchists revolt, so what is the point of having it in the tree at all?

are there plans for this? It’d be cool to have some non-focus way to interact with the event, like maybe needing X divisions in Barcelona away from the front to stop the event from progressing or something.
 

Delpheus

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Oh wow, finally 1 division training is fixed, thank you! As a heads-up PDX, there will no doubt be crying about this from certain audiences in the MP scene once the patch goes live. I am an MP player too, but I care more about realism than cheesy exploits that are explained away with nonsense like "the Allies need 1 div training to remain competitive".

PDX once bent to peer pressure before, when they fixed the free doctrine-switching, only to drop the cost of the first land doctrine to 50% of what it was initially post-fix, after a massive backlash from people who exploited this bug. I truly hope the devs don't cave in to the backlash this time, and keep this exploit wholly gone for good.
I agree that one division training is an unrealistic problem, but removing it makes it impossible, especially for passive allies at the start to modify their templates...there is now no way they can do this.
One division training was a problem but not having ways to fix or add to your templates is another problem.
This change fixes half the problem but it leaves us with nothing to fill the void. How are we supposed to get that stupid xp now?
For France you need to grind 10 xp just put trench tools in....while the Germans start with trench tools in their templates. Well that's stupidly unfair. And yeah another one of the 1000s of disadvantages for france.
 

guprad

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I agree that one division training is an unrealistic problem, but removing it makes it impossible, especially for passive allies at the satrt, to modify their templates...there is now no way they can do this.
One division training was a problem but not having ways to fix or add to your templates is another problem.
This change fixes half the prpblpr but it leaves us with nothing to fill the void. How are we supposed to get that stupid xp now?
For France you need to grind 10 xp just put trench tools in....while the Germans start with trench tools in their templates. Well that's stupidly unfair. And yeah another one of the 1000s of disadvantages for france.
Can't you send attaches to China?
 

sekelsenmat

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Can't you send attaches to China?

Either that or train all your starting infantry (don't train tanks). I've done it as Japan, because I refused to use the 1 division exploit in SP. The equipment loss wasn't nearly that horrible. You should be able to get the 10xp.

Or get the Theorical guy with +0.05 xp per day. Harder for France due to the pp issue, sure, but possible.
 

Delpheus

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Either that or train all your starting infantry (don't train tanks). I've done it as Japan, because I refused to use the 1 division exploit in SP. The equipment loss wasn't nearly that horrible. You should be able to get the 10xp.

Or get the Theorical guy with +0.05 xp per day. Harder for France due to the pp issue, sure, but possible.
That's really all we can do, but as France, the equipment loss kills them. They need everything they can get and you need to train for a year just to put in entrenching tools which they should already have...That's crazy! And the xp giving guy costs PP that France just does not have. AND they took away France's ability to get 120 PP boost with the first focus, so you need to wait a long time before you can even hope to get a silent workhorse.
 

Delpheus

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Most people play it on singleplayer though, only like 10-20% play it in multiplayer.
Those stats come from where? Number of games played? Yeah, no...i should not have to explain that single player is much easier to set up than multiplayer. You can play SP multiple times 24 hours a day 7 days a week, but most people can't set up a multiplayer game more than a few times a week when their schedules line up. So don't try to tell me SP is more important than MP, it should be considered 50/50, equally important.

And even if your statement was accurate, and a bug or issue only effected MP and not SP, that does not change the fact that there IS an issue and it SHOULD be fixed.
 

guprad

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Those stats come from where? Number of games played? Yeah, no...i should not have to explain that single player is much easier to set up than multiplayer. You can play SP multiple times 24 hours a day 7 days a week, but most people can't set up a multiplayer game more than a few times a week when their schedules line up. So don't try to tell me SP is more important than MP, it should be considered 50/50, equally important.

And even if your statement was accurate, and a bug or issue only effected MP and not SP, that does not change the fact that there IS an issue and it SHOULD be fixed.
The devs said it, unless the devs statement isn't accurate?
 

Delpheus

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The devs said it, unless the devs statement isn't accurate?
Correct, does not matter if the devs said it, they are wrong. I saw something about this once that they just counted the number of games played. That's a totally illogical and ridiculous way to calculate the importance and popularity of multiplayer, because as I've said before, multiplayer depends on the schedules of 20+ different people to line up so they can play together. But i can log on and play 50 games today right now by myself if I wanted to.
 

Flight_of_Icarus

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If Republican Spain declares independence after having Expanded Soviet Aid, the Soviet Union can now choose to grant it, instead of being forced to fight them over it. If the Soviet Union elected to annex Spanish land in preparation for the Independence War, via the event, this land will be returned and spawned divisions are once again removed. The AI is unlikely to choose this course of action unless they are in a large war.

Ok, thank goodness. That was a serious oversight. This isn't a perfect fix, though, imho. A perfect fix would be a scripted peace deal with the Soviet Union if they are unable to take the Republican capital after a certain period of time, and a return of Spanish territory if they fail. Don't make those poor Spanish boys march to Moscow.

Also, if they do go to war early, and the Allies are at war with Germany, they should be reluctant to join the war against the Soviets.
 

Flight_of_Icarus

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Actually, here's a suggestion. Have the political commissars focus in the generic tree, on the Communist side, add a spy slot for generic Communist countries if they have LaR. The generic Communist path is lacking compared to the Fascist one anyway, so it would be more of an incentive to go Communist.
 

fighting_falcon93

First Lieutenant
Sep 1, 2017
231
62
So any commander could have called up high command and drastically alterer all divisions in their army?

Well, to start, I think it's false to claim that the player is "any commander". Judging from how much overall power the player has in taking decisions, I'd say that the player is rather a president, prime minister or dictator. That combined with also being a commander in chief for both the army, air force and navy. With that in mind, I think it's perfectly reasonable for a person in that position to ask for a change in division setup if he sees a need for it. Because if that person is not considered qualified for such requests, then who is?

not without solid testing in training exercises or data from actual combat, which is what the system simulates.

If we bring this down to the most basic foundation of logics, then we could reason that experience is not required to make a change. Experience might help us to make a good change, but we are not forced to have experience just to make a change. Equally, just because we have experience, doesn't neccessarily mean that a change will be good. Good is a relative term and we don't know if something is good until we compare it with something else.

With that in mind, I see 3 problems here:

1. Why would we need training or experience in order to make a change that makes sense without having experience? For example, we don't need combat experience to realise that a garrison division that will mostly sit idle can consist of fewer battalions. Equally, we don't need combat experience to realise that a certain division is too cheap or too expensive in regards to our nations industrial capacity.

2. Why would training or experience against one opponent help us against another opponent? For all we know, these two opponents might fight entirely different, with different tactics, doctrines, equipment etc. What works against the French must not necessarily work against the Russians, and the experience we gained when fighting the French might not be of any use when fighting the Russians, and so on.

3. Why would a player need experience points when he doesn't know what to expect from his opponent and thus gains experience simply by playing against the opponent? This player has no idea what to expect from his opponent until the actual fighting starts and thus he cannot prepare any optimal divisions. With a more interesting AI that uses different strategies each game, we wouldn't know what to expect either.

Some nations were much more behind than others and I feel its important to model this.

Nations being behind prior to the start date of 1st january 1936 is already modeled by the starting scenario. This has nothing to do with experience points. The nations at that time used division templates that they considered to be right for them at that time, otherwise they would have changed them. It's not like these nations wanted to change their division templates but couldn't do so because a lack of experience points.

I wouldnt like a system where you could just change stuff to the optimum however you pleased.

Maybe the problem here is that we have an "optimum" in the first place? In real life, there is no "optimum division", since the optimum division for a specific scenario entirely depends on what the enemy is using. So maybe, the problem here is not about allowing us to change division templates for free, but rather the problem is an AI that always uses the same division types, which in turn creates a predictable behaviour, which in turn creates an optimum division?
 
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