HOI4 - Development Diary - September 2nd 2016

[PanH]

Afaik, it happens in late 38, without purging.

 

[Comrade110]

Hello developers nice work looking forward to patch but I got few issues.

Would it be possible to make units which are surrounded make non-disbandable ? (units having no direct route to capital cannot be disbanded?- possible solution)

Another exploit like, landing 1 inf brigade divisions into enemy territory (so risking nothing while transporting) and then changing template to 40 width heavy tank monster. Perhaps you should be unable to change templates on territory of the country which havent capitulated.

 

[billcorr]

Regarding disbanding while encircled, credit to Alex Brunius who pointed out that there is already a penalty for disbanding a unit that is encircled. Is 80% manpower loss and 100% equipment loss satisfactory?

Paradox actually already thought of that one ( mostly mitigated I'd say )

I don't think this seems unreasonable judging how many soldiers that could escape pockets posing as civilians or just sneaking out in the terrain in reality.

( ENCIRCLED_DISBAND_MANPOWER_FACTOR = 0.2 )

 

[Jorlem]

Regarding disbanding while encircled, credit to Alex Brunius who pointed out that there is already a penalty for disbanding a unit that is encircled. Is 80% manpower loss and 100% equipment loss satisfactory?

The game only applies the encirclement combat penalty when the encircled unit is down to one province, with larger encirclement not taking the penalty. I'd imagine this is the same way, so to avoid the penalty, one could disband when down to two provinces.

 

[Blastaz]

The game only applies the encirclement combat penalty when the encircled unit is down to one province, with larger encirclement not taking the penalty. I'd imagine this is the same way, so to avoid the penalty, one could disband when down to two provinces.

Apply the penalty to disbanding while out of supply then.

Also there are generally a ton of problems with changing unit templates and one infantry battalion divisions...

 

[Alex_brunius]

The game only applies the encirclement combat penalty when the encircled unit is down to one province, with larger encirclement not taking the penalty. I'd imagine this is the same way, so to avoid the penalty, one could disband when down to two provinces.

I tested this and it seems your absolutely right. I have made a bugreport with this including a savegame.

 

[Balesir]

Also there are generally a ton of problems with changing unit templates and one infantry battalion divisions...

Where exactly do you see the issues? I see procedures that were actually quite common, and the great disadvantage of doing just this is that STR and ORG take a while to build when you do it. Boosting up "colonial" brigades to divisions is something that was done quite readily, but it took time (and required a supply link, obviously). As long as the game requires these, what is the problem, do you think?

 

[henzington]

I am curious if puppets will still be allowed to become major powers? i find it a bit silly that Vichy France, Reorganized Nationalist China, or the British Raj can become major powers while still a puppet.

 

[Telenil]

Great DD, looking forward to the patch!

 

[Neciota]

Sunflower patch seems to be shaping up nicely guys!

My question is whether there are any plans for the introduction of frozen-over seas during winter to the game. Like the Swedish Baltic ports that would freeze over during winter, forcing Germans to ship iron ore through Norwegian Narvik.

 

[Blastaz]

Where exactly do you see the issues? I see procedures that were actually quite common, and the great disadvantage of doing just this is that STR and ORG take a while to build when you do it. Boosting up "colonial" brigades to divisions is something that was done quite readily, but it took time (and required a supply link, obviously). As long as the game requires these, what is the problem, do you think?

Things like building one battalion divisions, deploying them as soon as they hit 20% trained and then switching them to full infantry divisions so you can a) reach 750k manpower deployed as Germany by May 36 allowing you to Anschluss and Sudetenland that year or b) send them as an expedition to another country to suck up their manpower and then recall them.

I haven't tried the reverse of switching full divisions to single divisions when they are cut off so you get all the resources back when they are cut off but that might be an exploit too...

 

[Meglok]

Welcome changes and improvements, thank you guys @ PDS for the hard work.

Looking forward to playing 1.2 to see how everything will work and give feedback.

 

[VlCT0R]

National Foci that requiring to field a sizable army (like Germans territorial demands):
If requirement is not meet, please add a line showing how many are missing.
Yes, it is possible to switch menus to see how many are field, minus those on vacation to Spain or China, do the math.... but that is not comfortable!

 

[Balesir]

Things like building one battalion divisions, deploying them as soon as they hit 20% trained and then switching them to full infantry divisions so you can a) reach 750k manpower deployed as Germany by May 36 allowing you to Anschluss and Sudetenland that year or b) send them as an expedition to another country to suck up their manpower and then recall them.

I haven't tried the reverse of switching full divisions to single divisions when they are cut off so you get all the resources back when they are cut off but that might be an exploit too...

Thanks for the clarification. Deploying MP fast I really can't see as an exploit - if you have the MP and some equipment what is stopping you just deploying a full division 20% trained anyway? The Exp forces exploit is a good example and I had noticed that issue (reinforcement for Exp Forces coming from the "host" - it is an exploit with equipment, too, IMO). I think the remedy is for the actual owner to provide all reinforcement, rather than prevent template switching, but it's still an issue. Returned equipment when you "downsize" - good point, but the remedy seems to me to be to treat such returns the same as disbanding, so you normally lose something and lose the majority if out of supply (the last bit subject to the correction discussed upthread).

 

[Blastaz]

Thanks for the clarification. Deploying MP fast I really can't see as an exploit - if you have the MP and some equipment what is stopping you just deploying a full division 20% trained anyway? The Exp forces exploit is a good example and I had noticed that issue (reinforcement for Exp Forces coming from the "host" - it is an exploit with equipment, too, IMO). I think the remedy is for the actual owner to provide all reinforcement, rather than prevent template switching, but it's still an issue. Returned equipment when you "downsize" - good point, but the remedy seems to me to be to treat such returns the same as disbanding, so you normally lose something and lose the majority if out of supply (the last bit subject to the correction discussed upthread).

Because this route avoids the need for equipment, it also avoids the current you can only deploy a set percentage of your current army in one go rule.

You need 20% of the equipment for one infantry battalion. You then change the division to the standard starting division which for Germany is 9(?) battalions. Manpower then reinforces separately from the equipment so you can deploy 45 times the amount of manpower as you actually have equipment for.

As soon as you have done the Sudetenland focus you can disband the extra divisions at no cost, or keep them in a reserves front on low priority for reinforcements.

I'm not saying the feature should be removed, just that currently there are a number of exploits around it that need to be fixed.

 

[Dalwin]

Sunflower patch seems to be shaping up nicely guys!

My question is whether there are any plans for the introduction of frozen-over seas during winter to the game. Like the Swedish Baltic ports that would freeze over during winter, forcing Germans to ship iron ore through Norwegian Narvik.

Actually the imports from Sweden are already a bit messed up. They do not route to Germany's Baltic ports. Instead they go to Wilhelmshaven so that they get exposed to attack in the North Sea. Fixing that is more important than the Narvik situation, though I would like to see that as well.

Thanks for the clarification. Deploying MP fast I really can't see as an exploit - if you have the MP and some equipment what is stopping you just deploying a full division 20% trained anyway? The Exp forces exploit is a good example and I had noticed that issue (reinforcement for Exp Forces coming from the "host" - it is an exploit with equipment, too, IMO). I think the remedy is for the actual owner to provide all reinforcement, rather than prevent template switching, but it's still an issue. Returned equipment when you "downsize" - good point, but the remedy seems to me to be to treat such returns the same as disbanding, so you normally lose something and lose the majority if out of supply (the last bit subject to the correction discussed upthread).

Equipment for expeditionary forces comes from the original country so the exploit is only a method of transferring manpower between nations by using expeditionary forces.

 

[billcorr]

National Foci that requiring to field a sizable army (like Germans territorial demands):
If requirement is not meet, please add a line showing how many are missing.
Yes, it is possible to switch menus to see how many are field, minus those on vacation to Spain or China, do the math.... but that is not comfortable!

Good suggestion. Having the gamer go look up statistics (such as manpower in divisions in the field) is kind of like a pizza restaurant informing the customer "Yes, we know you want onions on your pizza...you'll need to go into the kitchen and put the onions on yourself."

What simile can you think of regarding the better display of statistics or information (e.g. manpower in divisions in the field in the Anschluss national focus)?

 

[mmarques]

Will this patch address the issue that manpower for Expeditionary Forces is drawn from your own?

 

[Dalwin]

Will this patch address the issue that manpower for Expeditionary Forces is drawn from your own?

Before they address this you will need to convince the devs that it is even an issue. I am fairly sure this is working exactly as intended even if I disagree with that design decision.

 

[Broletariat90]

Spent a 1.1 game as Italy. Took 5 hours to get to 1940. Game is still massively screwed. Hopefully this next patch can help. Going to beer up and give it another go, try a different OOB maybe different approach in general, hopefully the German AI will be a bit better. Time will tell. I noticed that taking the aggressive approach towards Yugoslavia is harder then I thought it would be. Anyone else have experience with that?

Anyways just decided to wait for the open beta.