Hoi4 Dev Diary - Thoughts & roadmap

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Greetings all!

As you’ll no doubt be aware, the launch of the No Step Back expansion last year was the climax of a busy year of development for the HoI team, and it continues to be one of our best received releases to date.

Of course, the last year also saw the departure of @podcat as Game Director who was reassigned to Siberia greater things at Paradox. Many of you will also have read the roadmap document that was produced towards the beginning of HoI4 development, and are asking questions as to the veracity of that plan under a new director, and whether I have any different ideas or plans to announce.

Looking Forwards

I mentioned at the beginning of my tenure that both @podcat and I see HoI4 in broadly similar terms. This hasn’t changed, and you can expect to see many of the parts of the previous roadmap make an appearance at some point in the future.

My approach to a ‘Grand Plan’, however, may be somewhat different. I have a preference for leaving plenty of space for reactive development (something that served us well on Imperator), and while there are many things that I feel are ripe for future development, I am also keen to leave a lot of space for changing course and acting on community sentiment.

There are two main points I want to raise before we get to details, however. Firstly, we intend to up the tempo of our releases a little. This is, of course, an ambition, and not a promise, however it informs some further decisions related to the development of HoI. Namely, that we are considering ways to change how and when we release information on development to you folks. Since faster development is the goal, this also means getting ideas into public view slightly faster, for feedback and conversation. We’re not exactly sure how this will look yet, but it is likely that there’ll be a reorganization of the traditional dev-diary schedule into something that feels less like a milestone delivery. This comes in tandem with a need to shift the community’s expectations on what ‘in development’ means: getting fans accustomed to seeing placeholders, WIP balance, and half-built systems in early phases, and seeing things develop as time goes on.

The last major point here is that we recognize a need to maintain the game as well as to develop it, especially if development pace is picking up. We’re still considering how best to achieve this, and I’m watching initiatives such as the Custodian team on Stellaris with curiosity. For the time being, what this is likely to manifest as, is the inclusion of older system maintenance into our patch planning - you may start to see patch bulletin features including things such as minor focus tree revamps, as well as attention paid to older systems and expansion content.

Roadmap

As mentioned above, the 2020 roadmap for HoI4 included many things which have now either been completed or rendered unnecessary. This leaves several from podcat’s list which I believe are still important for the future of the game:

  • Improvements to frontline stability (progress in NSB, more to come)
  • Long term goals and strategies to guide ai (progress in NSB)
  • Improving peace conferences
  • Update core national focus trees with alt-history paths and more options (Italy)
  • Wunderwaffen projects
  • More differences between sub-ideologies and government forms
  • More National Focus trees
  • Make defensive warfare more fun
  • Adding mechanics to limit the size of your standing army, particularly post-war etc
  • Have doctrines more strongly affect division designing
  • Strategic and tactical AI improvements

In addition to these items, I will of course add some of my own personal intentions:

Great Power Diplomacy
This is one area that I feel doesn’t need much explanation. More diplomatic tools are a clear area for expansion, and a careful look at how this module can be developed without interfering with the overarching global war, is likely to happen.

Economic Decision Making
The economic system is very abstracted in HoI, and I do not foresee ever making it a major part of the game loop. This said, there are elements of an industrial economy that I feel could do with being part of decision making in HoI.

Immersive/Roleplay Elements
Optional tools for making your mark on a game, and/or development of further building blocks to enhance attachment to a HoI campaign. Bring the simulation to life.

And of course, many more that I feel do not need as much of an explanation:

  • Battleplanner improvements
  • Advisors/internal politics improvements
  • Ideological distinctions
  • Multiplayer & social layer improvements & support

I like to remain as open as possible to the needs of the community, and the inclusion or omission of any particular item above should not be considered ‘set in stone’.

As we look at how we plan on structuring future communications, there may be some space for a few more dev diaries on what you’ve all been getting up to in NSB in the near(ish) future!

/Arheo
I believe that the Poland focus tree is amazing, but a slight rework should be in order. I just doesn't make much sense to me why the only way to reopen the Polish Colonial League is through the communist path, it seems to me like that is the one path that shouldn't have that option is the communist one. It would make sense if that option was open at least to the monarchist branch, maybe by an Alliance with the Kaiser focus. (But only after a monarch is picked.)
 
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I believe that the Poland focus tree is amazing, but a slight rework should be in order. I just doesn't make much sense to me why the only way to reopen the Polish Colonial League is through the communist path, it seems to me like that is the one path that shouldn't have that option is the communist one. It would make sense if that option was open at least to the monarchist branch, maybe by an Alliance with the Kaiser focus. (But only after a monarch is picked.)
Sorry, but this doesn't make the least of sense as the Polish Colonial League, or the Polish relations with Liberia (which existed) were a product of the late 19th and early 20th century and never had anything to do with the Polish monarchy. It arguably seems weird to include it in the communist/democratic branch and would better fit into a economically liberal Sanacja path but i digress.

Also an alliance with the Kaiser should be completely out of question as the German dream of regaining the eastern lands it occupied during the 2nd Reich is irreconciable with any Polish government that takes itself seriously, as the talk is afterall about areas like Greater Poland (Poznan) which is literally where the first Polish capital was, where the cultural birthplace of Poland is, and it is one of the three Polish heartlands next to Lesser Poland (Krakow) and Mazovia (Warsaw).

The rework i would like to see the most is changing the leaders in the communist branch, making Gomułka the non-Stalinist leader (as he was a national-communist and took over the party only after Stalin died and de-stalinization kicked in) and replacing him with Bolesław Bierut as the Stalinist leader. Bierut was Stalin's idolizer in Poland, unleashed a reign of terror and cleansing in his name and was so fixated on him that he died of an heart-attack after hearing the now famous Khrushchov speech On the Cult of Personality and Its Consequences. And most importantly he was the actual historic leader of Stalinist post-ww2 Poland so i can't think of a single reason why he was ommited by the developers.
 
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Sounds good.

I'm mostly looking forward to the fleshing out of more nations. Italy of course, and Denmark and Norway come to mind. Plus I see a lot of potential in Egypt. After all they were more of a british puppet than a colony back then, so there'd be all kinds of options for resolving that status. Asserting themselves while staying aligned to Britain, gambling for the Axis to free them of the british yoke, trying to play both sides while gaining independence...
 
Sorry, but this doesn't make the least of sense as the Polish Colonial League, or the Polish relations with Liberia (which existed) were a product of the late 19th and early 20th century and never had anything to do with the Polish monarchy. It arguably seems weird to include it in the communist/democratic branch and would better fit into a economically liberal Sanacja path but i digress.

Also an alliance with the Kaiser should be completely out of question as the German dream of regaining the eastern lands it occupied during the 2nd Reich is irreconciable with any Polish government that takes itself seriously, as the talk is afterall about areas like Greater Poland (Poznan) which is literally where the first Polish capital was, where the cultural birthplace of Poland is, and it is one of the three Polish heartlands next to Lesser Poland (Krakow) and Mazovia (Warsaw).

The rework i would like to see the most is changing the leaders in the communist branch, making Gomułka the non-Stalinist leader (as he was a national-communist and took over the party only after Stalin died and de-stalinization kicked in) and replacing him with Bolesław Bierut as the Stalinist leader. Bierut was Stalin's idolizer in Poland, unleashed a reign of terror and cleansing in his name and was so fixated on him that he died of an heart-attack after hearing the now famous Khrushchov speech On the Cult of Personality and Its Consequences. And most importantly he was the actual historic leader of Stalinist post-ww2 Poland so i can't think of a single reason why he was ommited by the developers.
I think an alliance with germany would have still been possible, it should be hard ad have negatives, but it should be possible because Russia was such a huge threat.

I think the way it would make the most sense if a serious of events pop up for both sides, with about three or four variations on each decision depending on the combination of polish and german governments, like a democratic gemran and moncarchist poland, monarchist for both, democratic for both and one for democratic poland and monarchist germany.In this event chain the old german territorys would be discussed, rights for minorities etc. for example one of the events would be about Danzig, the germans can either demand it outright, give up any claim, demand a refernedum or demand its total independence. The decisions would've differentmali or boni for germany dependingon idiology, for example giviing up on Danzig would give a huge stab hit for monarchist germany and a smaller one for democratic, while the referndum would be neutral for democratic but have a smaller malus for monarchist.

The same can then be done for otherthings, and each nation gets 2-4 events for stuff they want, over 300 days or so the negotiations go on and then you can either accept the results or not, for example the polish would get the previously entioned german dmeands for Danzig, they then can either accept them, propose a compromise or reject them. At the end there would be a summary or you can make it a decison with a timer that shows all 8 points that are negotiated and the current status of them. Stuff like referendum for Danzig can then be done via a secret loyalty score for teh disputetet territorys which start at a sepcific level and Danzig for example gets more points from doing teh Foci relevant to it.

I think such a system would be good for many other crises too and some other rather streched alliances. Like the nazis and the balkan nations, instead of having germany just invite hungary make it a similar event chain were hungary can demand stuff from germany, be it military investment land etc.
 
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I think an alliance with germany would have still been possible, it should be hard ad have negatives, but it should be possible because Russia was such a huge threat.

I think the way it would make the most sense if a serious of events pop up for both sides, with about three or four variations on each decision depending on the combination of polish and german governments, like a democratic gemran and moncarchist poland, monarchist for both, democratic for both and one for democratic poland and monarchist germany.In this event chain the old german territorys would be discussed, rights for minorities etc. for example one of the events would be about Danzig, the germans can either demand it outright, give up any claim, demand a refernedum or demand its total independence. The decisions would've differentmali or boni for germany dependingon idiology, for example giviing up on Danzig would give a huge stab hit for monarchist germany and a smaller one for democratic, while the referndum would be neutral for democratic but have a smaller malus for monarchist.

The same can then be done for otherthings, and each nation gets 2-4 events for stuff they want, over 300 days or so the negotiations go on and then you can either accept the results or not, for example the polish would get the previously entioned german dmeands for Danzig, they then can either accept them, propose a compromise or reject them. At the end there would be a summary or you can make it a decison with a timer that shows all 8 points that are negotiated and the current status of them. Stuff like referendum for Danzig can then be done via a secret loyalty score for teh disputetet territorys which start at a sepcific level and Danzig for example gets more points from doing teh Foci relevant to it.

I think such a system would be good for many other crises too and some other rather streched alliances. Like the nazis and the balkan nations, instead of having germany just invite hungary make it a similar event chain were hungary can demand stuff from germany, be it military investment land etc.
So sort of like the peace treaty interface in Europa Universalis but for alliances?
 
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One thing that I hope to see added to @Arheo 's list: An improved scoreboard screen :D With some statistics over wars fought (with start/end date), manpower and equipment lost, buildings bombed, etc. And maybe the ability to set an end year or end condition. I think that would be a great way to show the "story" of each war, and be a nice incentive for players to finish the war, even when playing on the losing side.
 
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HOI4 should make all its logic code open source, allow modders to create forks, and just make money selling access to the game assets (sound, images, etc).

At this point HOI4 has become bigger than Paradox can keep up with. Its fans have so many ideas for the game. Set it free and it will grow into an ecosystem, a platform.

Besides, Paradox puts most of its effort into the assets. Let the loser mod nerds with no life focus on the logic, and paradox can just sell people the assets, for the same price as before. Paradox would make more money and spend less.

We already test the game, why not take the next step and just let us make it?
 
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More designers would be great. Yes to aircraft. But also small arms to design new rifles. A cheap new bolt action in 1936 or the expensive semi-automatic? Of maybe early automatic rifles in 1943?

I'd be in for a designer that lets you modify the way your infantry is equipped...increasing/decreasing the number of machine guns/mortars/whatever in each battalion.
 
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Hot take? Railroaded diplomacy in HOI4 is good, actually.

Given the incredibly limited timeframe of the game compared to other PDX games, HOI4 just does not lend itself to sandbox game design the way games spanning a bigger timeframe like CK3 or EU4 do. HOI4 sucks as a sandbox, but it absolutely shines as a narratively-driven game. It's why most big-time mods lean so heavily on pre-scripted paths nations can take. KR, TNO, EAW, all of them to lesser or greater degrees design specific paths for your country, and then - and this is the important bit vanilla really needs to improve on - has pre-scripted responses at the ready for countries that interact with you.

The absurdities and exploits we see in vanilla are a consequence of the game having no real response to your country going off the historical rails. Give countries paths/decisions/events to respond to alt-history paths. Sandboxing it entirely would just lead to even more bizzare scenarios since there's only so much leeway you can have in a country's politics in a short timespan without it becoming completely absurd.

Big agree. A sanity check before the AI acts on a war goal would also greatly improve the NF-based diplomacy. Instead of war goal = declare war, something like : if war goal = yes AND I am part of a faction OR the force ratio is favorable THEN declare war.
 
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I know that can seem like an easy thing to do, but the developers can only keep one start date balanced and properly updated. The current 1939 start date, according to the developers, gets almost zero play time. Instead of adding a third start date, it may be best to drop to only one start date.
I agree that maintaining two start dates in a game this detailed is probably not feasible...but given how much fun the game is before the shooting starts I'd prefer that the one start date be 1933.

...but that would entail a ton of work, so probably not happening.
 
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I agree that maintaining two start dates in a game this detailed is probably not feasible...but given how much fun the game is before the shooting starts I'd prefer that the one start date be 1933.

...but that would entail a ton of work, so probably not happening.
I can see why a 1933 start date would be preferable to many over 1936. The build up in the game is part of the fun. I know I enjoy it. As you said, it would require a lot of work and probably not going to happen, but I would play it.
 
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I can see why a 1933 start date would be preferable to many over 1936. The build up in the game is part of the fun. I know I enjoy it. As you said, it would require a lot of work and probably not going to happen, but I would play it.
I think 1933 might be a bit too early, as it would make the game too long. Maybe pushing it back to autumn 1934 (this was an available start in HOI II) to allow for a longer pre-war period without making it too long.
I'd be more interested in extending the end date. Maybe the final major DLC could take the game into the early Cold War (say 1953 or so?)
Or add new bookmarks during the war itself. A January 1942 bookmark, so we could play a scenario with all major powers already at war and battle lines already drawn, and a January 1944 scenario, so we could play with the Axis on the defensive and late-war technology like jet engines and super-heavy tanks.
 
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I think 1933 might be a bit too early, as it would make the game too long. Maybe pushing it back to autumn 1934 (this was an available start in HOI II) to allow for a longer pre-war period without making it too long.
I'd be more interested in extending the end date. Maybe the final major DLC could take the game into the early Cold War (say 1953 or so?)
Or add new bookmarks during the war itself. A January 1942 bookmark, so we could play a scenario with all major powers already at war and battle lines already drawn, and a January 1944 scenario, so we could play with the Axis on the defensive and late-war technology like jet engines and super-heavy tanks.
I believe this topic has already been closed once and for all by the devs as almost no players play the other start dates, in any paradox game mind you (maybe except for CK2), while it binds too many developer resources to keep them running for every patch and update.
 
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I would like the new director to review the Yugoslav tree as it lacks elements of his characteristic partisan fighting and post capitulation approaches in his tree unlike other countries like the new Polish tree.


In addition, I believe that there should be a dilemma in post-capitulation approaches that I propose to promote a nationalist partisan struggle that would have how to contact the Western allies led by Draza Mijhalovic whose objective would be to restore the Serbian monarchy to power and another historical alternative to Tito's socialism that would give access to the Yugoslav socialism part of the current tree,

and that both parts of the tree would unlock a new marshal for each part, for example the alternative nationalist part to Dhraza Mijhalovic himself, instead the historical part would do so with Tito himself
 
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autumn 1934 (this was an available start in HOI II)
Official (PDS) HOI II never had a start date earlier than 1 JAN 1936. Either Darkest Hour and/or Arsenal of Democracy (both part of the (short) project where they allowed independent (outside) teams access to the source code) might have added official start dates earlier but its been so long I can't remember.
 
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Official (PDS) HOI II never had a start date earlier than 1 JAN 1936. Either Darkest Hour and/or Arsenal of Democracy (both part of the (short) project where they allowed independent (outside) teams access to the source code) might have added official start dates earlier but its been so long I can't remember.
Start dates before 1936 were added by Iron Cross.
 
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